REOPENING AT STAGE 2, with recommendations for Coordinated Toronto Reopening Strategy

[wiskey bravo]

Lots of good points here to consider, however, phase two is still in the discovery stage so why play with fire? You cant wait it out? Most bartenders along with thousands in the service industry are benched but agencies should't be?
Truth be told this is one particular industry that should be extremely cautious for obvious reasons. I'm sure most girls are eager to work, however, the ship captain has the final call. Its up to the leaders of these agencies to be safe, cautions and make the right decision. Limiting the amount of people is not a problem solver. Once the doors are opened it done so go full throttle at that point. We should continue to push towards social distancing with strangers as we work through these phases. There's a lot of people ( heath organizations ) working behind the scene who are exposed to a great deal of information who might know more than you, me or the family next door.

Lastly, if one of your girls does contract the virus at work I'm curious if you would say or question " fuck look what i have done.....did I opened up too early". How would that make you feel? My gut tells me you would sleep better knowing someone contracted something after the city gave a green light to all business.

Guys, girls and agency owners....I thought this whole thing was bole shit. I thought what the government was doing was totally stupid. I was only thinking about my selfish needs or inconveniences this brought to my life. That all changed when I knew two people who contracted it. One didn't make it and the other dude is thankful to be alive. He described this virus as a powerful demon trying to kill you. Have respect for it.
Don't underestimate it like I did.

Agencies owners, this one is on you. Even if you gave the ladies the options to work or not, ultimately, you're the one accountable and held responsible. My advise just wait it out a few more months. You came this far and survived. Why not a few more months?

 

[tribunus]

Well said, wiskey bravo. You're a lot more articulate than me but we both agree that this is way too soon.

The fact that only one agency is leading the charge and a whole lot of silence from the rest tells me there's a shitload of doubt still.

 

[Rugbywolf]

Let's not kid ourselves. There are girls working now and that is a fact. They choose to work now and their clients choose to see them now while others choose not to. The agencies are going to open eventually (either that or go bankrupt and cease to exist--look at SFTO who are down to 4 incall spaces now when they decide to reopen) and when they do it will be up to you to choose to go or not and up to the girl to work or not. Personally as I have stated many times I'd feel more comfortable seeing the results 2 to 3 weeks after Phase 2 opens but that IS MY CHOICE.
In any event when they do open I hope everyone remains well and all this doom and gloom predictions do not become reality.

 

[Jasmine Raine]

For all the naysayers, do you really think that agencies that have decide to open in stage two, are really going to listen to you? They have already decided.

Sadly that makes it harder for ladies who will choose to still not work. Agencies have basically decide when the "industry" will open without consultation with indies. They don't speak for the entire industry but they have basically just done so. They say they want all escort agencies to open at the same time to ensure no shaming but have not thought at all about what that will do to those who don't want to work yet at that stage. Seems a little one sided to me. But that is just me.


Store front style spas who have no choice but to open because all the agencies did, will bare the burnt of the risk because they will actually be seen as open so what do agencies care. Again they have decided for the entire industry.

These are just some things I'm getting from others who will not speak out. I have personally not decided when I will go back to seeing clients. Could be stage two, could be stage three, could be never at this point. But I can say that if I was a girl that needed to stay relevant and not lose a chunk of business I am basically forced to open stage two now. It just put pressure on others and that is really not far. All indies are going to hear now is "we'll agencies are open so you should too". They didn't want shaming one way but put no thought in to the opposite side of the coin.

Even TERB itself took its cue from agencies. They want to open and need to advertise so now TERB has no choice but to open up advertising again. Personally I think it should have been the other way around. TERB should have decided the advertising stage based on information from all sources. That being indies, classifieds girls,agencies, spas, clubs and clients. It would have been more fair. Agencies clear own the industry and the rest of us are just allowed to play in the sad box.

 

[bebe]

The fact that only one agency is leading the charge and a whole lot of silence from the rest tells me there's a shitload of doubt still.

You only need one leader, apart from Allegra, Sassy, SFTO and Mirage have indicated on terb that they are planning to reopen at stage 2. Others will follow. The agencies have posted little but they have not been silent.

What we have is a shit load of BS from the Governments. They have to move slow to reopen otherwise it will say that the lockdown was totally unnecessary. Look at how much faster the Americans are reopening versus us. Georgia was first to reopens salons etc they have not seen a huge spike in the death rate as predicted

 

[wiskey bravo]

They have not opened yet. Saying and doing are two different things. Curious to see what will happen. Safe to say when a doctor informs you have lung cancer there's a good chance that individual gives up smoking right? Well who knows if this virus can have the same spin off effect to a small percentage of mindsets For the independent operators who are well reviewed on this site and never stopped offering their services during Covid -19 (we see you on Leo List), NEVER will you been seen by me. A few people share similar feelings to those who did not surrender their services when the world first did. Your choice to stay open during the shut down showed a few hidden messages about your heath and safety perspective. Don't throw the money card. There's many people who make less and are sitting on the sidelines.

 

[bebe]

I wonder if a life long smoker really quits when a doctor tells him/her they have lung cancer. Why stop when you already know the outcome...maybe they will live a few months longer maybe they won’t. If you can’t accept the risk, don’t smoke

If you can’t accept the risk for contracting C19 from an SP don’t hobby. There are many other ways you can contract C19.

 

[Knuckle Ball]

For all the naysayers, do you really think that agencies that have decide to open in stage two, are really going to listen to you? They have already decided.

Sadly that makes it harder for ladies who will choose to still not work. Agencies have basically decide when the "industry" will open without consultation with indies. They don't speak for the entire industry but they have basically just done so. They say they want all escort agencies to open at the same time to ensure no shaming but have not thought at all about what that will do to those who don't want to work yet at that stage. Seems a little one sided to me. But that is just me.


Store front style spas who have no choice but to open because all the agencies did, will bare the burnt of the risk because they will actually be seen as open so what do agencies care. Again they have decided for the entire industry.

These are just some things I'm getting from others who will not speak out. I have personally not decided when I will go back to seeing clients. Could be stage two, could be stage three, could be never at this point. But I can say that if I was a girl that needed to stay relevant and not lose a chunk of business I am basically forced to open stage two now. It just put pressure on others and that is really not far. All indies are going to hear now is "we'll agencies are open so you should too". They didn't want shaming one way but put no thought in to the opposite side of the coin.

Even TERB itself took its cue from agencies. They want to open and need to advertise so now TERB has no choice but to open up advertising again. Personally I think it should have been the other way around. TERB should have decided the advertising stage based on information from all sources. That being indies, classifieds girls,agencies, spas, clubs and clients. It would have been more fair. Agencies clear own the industry and the rest of us are just allowed to play in the sad box.

You seem to think that agency’s should have consulted with Indies as part of this planning process? Why?

Why should agencies give af what Indies think about this or anything else?

See clients if you wish. Don’t see clients if you do not wish to.

Make whatever decision you think is right for you.

 

[canada-man]

this covid19 exercise split people those who lives in fear and those who don't

 

[homersimpson1]

For all the naysayers, do you really think that agencies that have decide to open in stage two, are really going to listen to you? They have already decided.

Sadly that makes it harder for ladies who will choose to still not work. Agencies have basically decide when the "industry" will open without consultation with indies. They don't speak for the entire industry but they have basically just done so. They say they want all escort agencies to open at the same time to ensure no shaming but have not thought at all about what that will do to those who don't want to work yet at that stage. Seems a little one sided to me. But that is just me.


Store front style spas who have no choice but to open because all the agencies did, will bare the burnt of the risk because they will actually be seen as open so what do agencies care. Again they have decided for the entire industry.

These are just some things I'm getting from others who will not speak out. I have personally not decided when I will go back to seeing clients. Could be stage two, could be stage three, could be never at this point. But I can say that if I was a girl that needed to stay relevant and not lose a chunk of business I am basically forced to open stage two now. It just put pressure on others and that is really not far. All indies are going to hear now is "we'll agencies are open so you should too". They didn't want shaming one way but put no thought in to the opposite side of the coin.

Even TERB itself took its cue from agencies. They want to open and need to advertise so now TERB has no choice but to open up advertising again. Personally I think it should have been the other way around. TERB should have decided the advertising stage based on information from all sources. That being indies, classifieds girls,agencies, spas, clubs and clients. It would have been more fair. Agencies clear own the industry and the rest of us are just allowed to play in the sad box.

To be fair, TERB doesn't really control the industry. If established businesses open, whether they could advertise on Terb wouldn't really make or break their decision. It's also unfair to say that independants and other establishments have "no choice" due to competitive pressures. You are free to decide when you'd like to operate just as they are free to do the same. We can't have a double standard. Terb is a business and can't run like a democracy.

The idea of safety in this business even prior to covid is all a relative term. Hence you have girls to only offer "safe services" which I guess implies everyone else is unsafe. This business will never operate as 100% safe by its very nature. All that's changed is the risk is elevated slightly. For some that is manageable and for others it is not.

Personally I am not really for or against opening. Kind of indifferent but I do think against the alternative of suggesting this industry shut down until there's a vaccine just isn't practical. And also that everyone who participates should just know and accept the risks.

 

[wiskey bravo]

I wonder if a life long smoker really quits when a doctor tells him/her they have lung cancer. Why stop when you already know the outcome...maybe they will live a few months longer maybe they won’t. If you can’t accept the risk, don’t smoke

If you can’t accept the risk for contracting C19 from an SP don’t hobby. There are many other ways you can contract C19.

Yes some do and some don't. My Father quit when he was told the news and like any dieing person they always regret the decision to smoke. Saying " why stop smoking when you know the outcome " is a convenient thing to say when someone is not suffering or an individual is sitting on the sidelines. Bebe, you're referencing yourself and the customers with your above comment. I'm thinking about the girls. Sure everyone wants to work but is it safe to do so? I am not saying hold off forever, but at this point a few more months wont hurt. " If you cant accept the risk of contracting the virus......"....I thought the hole point of this is trying to eliminate the risk and not train our minds to accept the fact of getting it??


I know i am going off the beaten path here, however, why not. Freedom of speech. If i were to tell you before an aircraft gets released into service it goes through 4 stages of maintenance. Which bird would you feel more confident in? Second or forth stage completion? Personally I would feel more confident about the girl/agency after completing the stages. Anyone else?

BEBE - in no way I'm bashing you man. If it sounds like I am sorry for that. I mean this message with kindness and sincerity. At the end of the day I don't want you or anyone else on this board catching it. That's where my heart is. I realize everyone will do what they want to do. Peace.

 

[wiskey bravo]

I'm not mentioning any names. There's girls on this board offering services. Have a look for yourself. Yes during these boring times I'm being nosy because I have nothing better to do. House is clean, stocked on food, lots of paper towels, ass wipe and the pay checks are still coming in. Very thankful.

 

[Smallcock]

If I'm going to contract covid-19 (which is highly likely for all of us eventually), I'd rather do it having fun with an SP than from a piece of contaminated fruit or someone coughing while grocery shopping.

If you want to remain shut in on the belief that you will somehow manage to outmaneuver this invisible monster, you're free to do so. Waste your time, but don't waste anyone elses.

 

[wiskey bravo]

It's a business, like any other! And they need to do what to they need to do to survive. With all due respect, everyone here has an opinion, but if it isn't in line with the agency so be it. Some here think that TERB members make up the majority of business for these agencies, but that is WRONG. I went years without being a member, and a transient city like Toronto has that many more potential clients/customers. And the best part is these members claiming they're going to "blacklist" an agency or independent escort, as if she's going to go broke without them. Time will pass, all will be back to normal, and these same members will be calling these very same agencies. Do you think these girls have locked themselves up in a dungeon for the last 90 days? LoL What about grocery stores, Wal-Mart or Costco runs. The risk is just as high. But then again, let fear lead you and maybe reconsider the hobby you've found yourself in. Do whatever you need to do Allegra. If others don't agree with it, stay home, don't call. As for the rest of us, as I mentioned, I will be there next month and I, for one, will be a customer.

Grocery stores, Walmart or Costco....All places that allow someone to contract the virus but keep in mind if you're going to mention that don't forget to include how people are practicing social distancing at these facilities. Last time I was there I did not notice anyone kissing or fucking? Maybe I missed that isle.

One last thing......Italy has high numbers, Greece as well.....And so does Quebec. Quebec carries a European vibe in many ways. I have travelled across the globe and back 10X. I know this sounds silly and I have no evidence, however, one thing I noticed about all 3 locations, its standard to greet someone with a kiss on both cheeks. There's probably no relation here but it made me think.

 

[bebe]

....I thought the hole point of this is trying to eliminate the risk and not train our minds to accept the fact of getting it??

Personally I would feel more confident about the girl/agency after completing the stages. Anyone else?

The purpose of the lockdown was not to eliminate the risk. It was done so the health care system was not overwhelmed. In the end hospitals lacked patients.

If the governments wanted to eliminate the risks in our lives cars would be limited to a snails pace, smoking and drinking would be banned same with salt sugar high fat foods etc. Gyms would be on every street corner. Life always has risks

For me, waiting for stage 2 is more that sufficient for reopening. Stage 3 may not occur for many more months with larger public gatherings. Again no matter what stage we are at, more than likely the virus will still be here with us. It might be here for years.

And I do think about the girls. Many rely on this income stream to support their families, dreams and goals. If they feel safe and comfortable why should they not work. I do hope the agencies that plan to open are not forcing girls against their will to work, that would just be out right wrong. But if the girl wants to work, she should have that option.

 

[wiskey bravo]

It has nothing to do with kisses on the cheek....Italy has a high elderly population as well as the fact they refused to close their borders and even encouraged hugging citizens from the centre of outbreak they were more afraid of looking racist than catching the bug...I see a correlation with that a lot more than traditions of kissing on the cheek...

And Greece? They have one of the lowest counts in the European Union...because they acted quickly...they are now at the point of moving on as most of us should be.....the high cases mostly came from the migrant camps in which most people there are not going to adhere to social distancing protocols...

My bad. I thought Greece was up there. I'm an idiot. Anyways by far I'm not in this field of work. I dont know the space and people will do what the heart desires on that particular day. Stay safe everyone.

 

[legmann]

Italy has a high elderly population as well as the fact they refused to close their borders

And even with a very well-developed health care system, waited until hospitals were completely overwhelmed with sick and dying before implementing any kind of quarantine measures.

 

[wiskey bravo]

The purpose of the lockdown was not to eliminate the risk. It was done so the health care system was not overwhelmed. In the end hospitals lacked patients.

If the governments wanted to eliminate the risks in our lives cars would be limited to a snails pace, smoking and drinking would be banned same with salt sugar high fat foods etc. Gyms would be on every street corner. Life always has risks

For me, waiting for stage 2 is more that sufficient for reopening. Stage 3 may not occur for many more months with larger public gatherings. Again, no matter what stage we are at, more than likely the virus will still be here with us. It might be here for years.

Sorry man I cant comment on the lockdown. I'm talking about escorts/customers and the objective of reducing the risk of contraction between the two. The whole topic is about should an agency open or not? isn't it? I'm probably doing a weak job in articulating myself. Sorry about that. Typical case of my brain painting a different picture then my finger tips

I had a feeling someone would take this topic and say something about eliminating alcohol, sugars, cars..... I saw this coming too. All good man. Best of luck.

 

[bebe]

Sorry man I cant comment on the lockdown. I'm talking about escorts/customers and the objective of reducing the risk of contraction between the two. The whole topic is about should an agency open or not? isn't it? I'm probably doing a weak job in articulating myself. Sorry about that. Typical case of my brain painting a different picture then my finger tips

I had a feeling someone would take this topic and say something about eliminating alcohol, sugars, cars..... I saw this coming too. All good man. Best of luck.

Upon reopening the agencies cannot eliminate the risk. They can try to clean some touch points the best they can but the girls/agencies are not super human, they can only do so much without being ridiculous. You have to accept the risk of C19 if you plan to hobby or go to work, the LCBO, the gas station, the grocery store etc etc etc.

You have to accept the risks no matter what you do, get behind the wheel of a car, drink booze, smoke, do drugs, climb a tree, eat that bag of salty chips. Risks are every where.

Yes, the agencies should reopen.

If things such as dfk, daty and bbbj are no longer offered and masks are required then they can stay closed forever. They can go out of business for all I care. If some do plan on shutting down, post it now and let the girls find a new place to work. I have no doubt if some close, someone else will try to replace them. I have a feeling none of the reputable agencies will close because of C19 but they need to reopen to generate money not just for themselves but for the girls, the bookers and other that work for them

 

[Smallcock]

Italy is re-opening. Their Prime Minister says their economy can't afford to stay closed any longer.

In retrospect, they never should have closed in the first place.