Reverie

Quality of SPs gone down?

doggystyle99

Well-known member
May 23, 2010
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Long time hobbyist infrequent poster. Now before I begin I’ll aplogize in advance before all the white knight defenders crawl out and come roast me. Hoping to have more of an honest discussion here. Has anyone else noticed in the last year or so that the quality/attractiveness of SPs have gone considerably down hill? And rates continue to climb/remain high for even some questionable looking providers..I get it, beauty is subjective but let’s be honest here. Again, not meant to be a hurtful post I could very well be missing something completely as to where all those classically beautiful provides have gone since the beginning of the year..
When I consider quality of SP's I am considering looks, attitude, value, service and experience. My take on this:
The quality of SP's today compared to 20 years ago (prior to online/internet advertising) is a lot better. The quality of SP's today compared to 5-15 years ago (start of online advertising) has gone down. In the last 5 years it's been going down even more and that's due to the SD and SB scene being more acceptable in society.

I think there are a few reasons, one is that these days we are dealing with Millennials and majority of Millennials have a sense of entitlement attitude, they want what they want and wanted yesterday, with doing the lowest amount of work and getting paid the highest amount of pay. Another reason is the fact that there are less and less Eastern Europeans women migrating here and working in this industry. In the late 90's or late 2000's there were so many new to Canada women from Hungary, Romania, Czech that moved here to work in the industry. Also the explosion of SB and SD and dating apps has also had an affect on SP advertising themselves as sugar babies rather than SP's
 

doggystyle99

Well-known member
May 23, 2010
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Whoa. I'm so mind blown I decided to make my first post.

That part about Millennials - lmao. You really hate Millennials!

But it seems like you read that exact criticism online written somewhere and decided to run with it forever, never mind that it doesn't make any real sense. The cost of living goes up, the amount of available jobs is seemingly lower than it was when boomers were coming of age. Tech companies for instance hire and lay off like mad because industries like that and others are erratic these days. If you were interested in the well-being of anyone else... well, the obvious point is you are not.

Of course, the generation(s) trying to make it now are fighting a bit harder in what is a brand new world... in this bizarrely overpriced city. Perhaps you live in the outskirts and do not experience the life of someone living in the city. But oh man, they're "way too demanding"

And it seems like you love women from poor countries because they are easy to take advantage of. Eastern European women came and changed the climate here, making BBBJ normal (not many new people know this but a former vet board member told me this). Because they were desperate. That was the hurrah and excitement really. Kind of weird no?

Only abusive people prey on desperation, getting angry that it's not as widely available.

Guess what, agencies and indies are more or less charging what they feel will keep everything afloat - so that people like you can still hobby and have access without too much discomfort. And if these people don't profit, boards like this that you find beneficial wouldn't profit or stay alive either.

There are plenty of well-mannered people (men and women alike) reading this thread and shaking their damn heads at some of these posts without bothering to output any precious energy to correct anyone, but I just happen to have too much caffeine in my system.

Good day sir.
You're mind blown I am guessing your panties are blown too. Send me your wishlist I'll buy one of the AP panties off your wishlist so you could have a better day.
Yes the part about Millennials I don't hate them at all just pointing the obvious, it's clear you fit into the group hence why you've gone on a rant trying to make this about Millennials and pricing which my post wasn't about. The question was about SP's quality today and I merely pointed out my experience over the last 20 years or so. As I said earlier it is better than 20 years ago plus and worse than 5-15 last years but you were in diapers back then so you have no clue about what I am talking about.

As for reading this online quite the opposite again this is my experience in the last 20 years or so. Cost of living goes up for everyone so for example me coming out of high school 20 or so many years ago and making $24/hr or so back then my wage would also have to increased over the years. I am one of the lucky ones that hasn't had to worry about wage increases but I know many who have and many who are coming out of university now that are not even making that amount to start with a degree.

As for Tech companies yes some have layoffs but majority are doing well but what does that have to do with my post or what I wrote hence why you went on a rant.
Generations usually don't have a difference in the amount of effort they put into fighting it's just that they do it differently, my parents did it differently than me and so did yours, and the next generation will do it differently. But it is a proven fact through studies that Millennials are slightly lazier than my generation and the generation following Millennials will be even more lazy.
As for "women from poor countries" I really couldn't care where a beautiful woman is from whether it's our own country Canada, U.S.A, France, Romania, Germany, South Africa, China, Brazil, Australia, United Kingdom or where ever I treat all the same. It's clear you do not like performing BBBJ and I always say you should never perform services that you are not happy providing. But again I never made any reference about BBBJ in my post so you just assume once again. Maybe you're a psychic in disguise.
Getting angry not quite I am quite happy even when posting this. I didn't have any coffee but I did have a bottle of vintage Bodegas from 2009 and after some Glenfiddich to wash it down.
Again you keep mentioning pricing and what people charge and no where in my post was I just refering to pricing as I pointed out it was quality in general.
I don't know what you are trying to refer to "so that people like you can still hobby" but I can hobby anywhere and regardless of what you think. You referred to tech companies going out of business guess what all industries face challenges just like the escort industry 20+ years ago when it wasn't online. Indies and agencies had to adapt and hence why it's easier for you to advertise now than before where escorts had to stand on the corner of Church St and Carlton and fight pimps and other escorts for business and doing BBBJ for $60 in the car.

You're right there are many well mannered people who will shake their head at your post as you're attempting to make this about pricing which my post was clearly not about as I clearly stated due to the facts some SP's always try to argue about facts and make it about pricing rather than the facts.

Keep having fun and don't take things so personally as you usually do :wink:
Good day mam.

PS I got this feeling from your post and how you put everything together that you might be one of the many independent SP's who has multiple handles trying to post under a different handle so you don't identify yourself.
It's clear you hate hobbyist who have an opinion about the difference in this industry now and what it was 5-15 years ago, or 20 years ago.
 
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Carvher

Well-known member
Apr 13, 2010
963
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I find the longer I do this, it's difficult for me to say who's good looking or not. My pallet is so large now that it's easier to have a good time. Maybe I'm into a petite Asian lady one day and the next day I'm craving a chunky EI girl. Whatever, you want, you have to admit Toronto has it. I think it's true that you have to do your research, which is enjoyable isn't it?
 

mongol2011

New member
Nov 28, 2018
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Hi,

Thanks for the effort it took to make your post. We all take things personally at times and I don't know if i would want to be numb anyway. I am not going to get 'into the weeds' of your post and the one to which you were responding.

It is too hard for me to draw conclusions about differences in generations when I am getting older myself. We do our research, gauge our own experience and try to do what has worked in the past, given what we know of ourselves.

My experience though has been that the independents have to work harder to sell themselves than the agency women. I assume that agency women are intending to go out on their own once they have built a clientele. When they are in their late twenties to mid thirties there is that clock ticking which I think affects the way there are with clients. My most 'exciting' experiences have been with women that age but those have been the craziest ones. No coincidence?

Since I have traveled quite a bit my perspective on 'local' women has changed. It is not that they are 'all the same.' I just don't work as hard to figure out which one is going to flip my switch. Age has its advantages I suppose.

Did I drift off into me-land? Oops.

Happy hunting.
 

kherg007

Well-known member
May 3, 2014
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_Melissa

Tall/Curvy Ebony Seductress
Apr 25, 2017
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Toronto
www.beacons.ai
Also, out of all of the places I have travelled, Canada has the cheapest rates for sex workers.
I have to agree with Violette here. Out of all the first world countries, Canada is the cheapest. I’m planning to tour the states next spring so I joined a group chat with girls in the US. Charging less than 200/hr is what they consider a crackhead... 200 - 300 is considered low end, charging 400 - 600 is about average and if you charge 800+ THEN you are considered elite. Of course this may vary from state to state. The point is that our “high end” is their “low end”. Also consider that these rates I just mentioned are in US dollars. Let’s not even get started on rates in Australia.


The way I see it these Canadian gents are very very lucky and don’t even know it! SMH
 

NiceToMeetYou

Active member
Oct 24, 2010
718
207
43
When I consider quality of SP's I am considering looks, attitude, value, service and experience. My take on this:
The quality of SP's today compared to 20 years ago (prior to online/internet advertising) is a lot better. The quality of SP's today compared to 5-15 years ago (start of online advertising) has gone down. In the last 5 years it's been going down even more and that's due to the SD and SB scene being more acceptable in society.

I think there are a few reasons, one is that these days we are dealing with Millennials and majority of Millennials have a sense of entitlement attitude, they want what they want and wanted yesterday, with doing the lowest amount of work and getting paid the highest amount of pay. Another reason is the fact that there are less and less Eastern Europeans women migrating here and working in this industry. In the late 90's or late 2000's there were so many new to Canada women from Hungary, Romania, Czech that moved here to work in the industry. Also the explosion of SB and SD and dating apps has also had an affect on SP advertising themselves as sugar babies rather than SP's
+1 .... I really like your post and it's so true.

For the young millennial indy girls nowadays who are charging anywhere between $350 - $500 per hour, forget that I will never book with them LOL... When you are seeing them, they will say... you can't touch this, you can't touch that... it's sensitive.... LOL... you're crossing my boundary... LOL.... Then they require you to take a thorough shower before you can touch their waist may be in the doggy sex... LOL while they only use the baby wipe to clean their pussies after finishing with a client right before you... LOL
 
I have to agree with Violette here. Out of all the first world countries, Canada is the cheapest. I’m planning to tour the states next spring so I joined a group chat with girls in the US. Charging less than 200/hr is what they consider a crackhead... 200 - 300 is considered low end, charging 400 - 600 is about average and if you charge 800+ THEN you are considered elite. Of course this may vary from state to state. The point is that our “high end” is their “low end”. Also consider that these rates I just mentioned are in US dollars. Let’s not even get started on rates in Australia.


The way I see it these Canadian gents are very very lucky and don’t even know it! SMH
IN the Big U.S. cities this is true ..... the fact that rates are low in Toronto means it only attracts the low quality girls. Higher quality girls often decide to go another route such a SUGAR BABY . I guess it comes down to the old saying .... You get what you pay for & NOTHING is for free. Toronto Guys want to pay very little so they get that .... for the most part. Of course there is a few gems out there for the 150-250 range.
 

Mable

Active member
Sep 20, 2004
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Nothing is for free. That is true, but you do not always get what you pay for. For some of us, ( I been hobbying for about 25 years) we have found that the ladies, while they are entitled to charge whatever they want, often do not provide a compatible experience with the rate. In fact, more often than not, I have found a reverse correlation. My worst experiences have been with ladies who charged $400 and up per hour. The vast majority of us hobbyist out there, in my view, are ok with higher rates, as long as the value is commensurate with the rate.
 

squeezer

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2010
20,826
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I have to agree with Violette here. Out of all the first world countries, Canada is the cheapest. I’m planning to tour the states next spring so I joined a group chat with girls in the US. Charging less than 200/hr is what they consider a crackhead... 200 - 300 is considered low end, charging 400 - 600 is about average and if you charge 800+ THEN you are considered elite. Of course this may vary from state to state. The point is that our “high end” is their “low end”. Also consider that these rates I just mentioned are in US dollars. Let’s not even get started on rates in Australia.


The way I see it these Canadian gents are very very lucky and don’t even know it! SMH
You are comparing a country where the provider is in legal jeopardy as is the client if not more. The providers take a great risk unlike providers here with the law. Screening in the US was primarly used to weed out LE. This is the reason many American hobbyist come here to enjoy the hobby and besides a strip joint they don't partake in their homeland.

Nothing is for free. That is true, but you do not always get what you pay for. For some of us, ( I been hobbying for about 25 years) we have found that the ladies, while they are entitled to charge whatever they want, often do not provide a compatible experience with the rate. In fact, more often than not, I have found a reverse correlation. My worst experiences have been with ladies who charged $400 and up per hour. The vast majority of us hobbyist out there, in my view, are ok with higher rates, as long as the value is commensurate with the rate.
Anything over $300 for an indy is just giving away money unneccasarily but that's up to the individual and his own fantasy.
 

Jasmine Raine

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Jul 28, 2014
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You are comparing a country where the provider is in legal jeopardy as is the client if not more. The providers take a great risk unlike providers here with the law. Screening in the US was primarly used to weed out LE. This is the reason many American hobbyist come here to enjoy the hobby and besides a strip joint they don't partake in their homeland.
While the legal issue may be true now. It has only been a couple of years where the onus changed. Providers here dealt with the same legal issues as the US. Screening started here before C36 became law. It has continued since.

Don't paint an incorrect picture. Ladies here did not start screening to be uptight bitches all high on themselves. It started when we were legally at risk more then clients were.

And none of this takes personal safety into account. It is not just about LE. I prefer to see a man that has been scene by someone else. So I screen. I have clients in my home, so I screen. There are plenty of reasons to screen. I would recommend it to any lady in any country under any rate.

Screening and quality of service vrs rate are two different topics. Let's keep it on the one the OP I rented.
 

squeezer

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2010
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While the legal issue may be true now. It has only been a couple of years where the onus changed. Providers here dealt with the same legal issues as the US. Screening started here before C36 became law. It has continued since.

Don't paint an incorrect picture. Ladies here did not start screening to be uptight bitches all high on themselves. It started when we were legally at risk more then clients were.

And none of this takes personal safety into account. It is not just about LE. I prefer to see a man that has been scene by someone else. So I screen. I have clients in my home, so I screen. There are plenty of reasons to screen. I would recommend it to any lady in any country under any rate.

Screening and quality of service vrs rate are two different topics. Let's keep it on the one the OP I rented.
My comment on screening was only in regards to the US and nothing to do with here. Sip on that coffee and breathe LOL.
 

Jasmine Raine

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Jul 28, 2014
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My comment on screening was only in regards to the US and nothing to do with here. Sip on that coffee and breathe LOL.
When in comparison, it is just as much about there as it is here. You can't compare a difference without automatically talking about the other side.

Sip that in your coffee....

;)
 

squeezer

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2010
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When in comparison, it is just as much about there as it is here. You can't compare a difference without automatically talking about the other side.

Sip that in your coffee....

;)
Two totally different markets although I get why many laidies here would love to fully implement the US pricing structure. The reality is the markets are as different as are the two leaders Justin and Donald.

ps...coffee is only a buck at McDonalds!
 

Kadie Lux

ITALIAN BELLA KADIE
Aug 14, 2016
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Mississauga, GTA, Ontario.
I honestly think that part of the issue is that a lot of these fake, shady awful service SPs on leolist have multiple ads up and clog up the entire leo lists escort page of every region. It’s insane! I knew one “SP” who would continue to give crappy service (she told me) and i would always explain to her the importance of giving quality service and how beneficial regulars are. She then proceeded to tell me she has 3 DIFFERENT LEO LIST ADS UP! So for example her name would be Sarah on one ad, Paige on another ad and Sandy on the third ad. I think this is absolutely nuts.

With that being said, so many hobbyists are being tricked into seeing these scamming ladies and are missing the ladies such as myself who are extremely well Reviewed and love what we do. always do your research and make sure the SP you want to visit has at least 5 positive reviews.. I always tell my clients this. Super important.
 

Jasmine Raine

Well-known member
Jul 28, 2014
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Two totally different markets although I get why many laidies here would love to fully implement the US pricing structure. The reality is the markets are as different as are the two leaders Justin and Donald.

ps...coffee is only a buck at McDonalds!
I agree they are different markets.

PS... I know. So coffee is on me. You can get it next time.
 
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