NHLPA...take it or leave it

[scubadoo]

It is tough to be sympathetic toward any athlete who makes millions of dollars for a sport, but at the same time none of us would ever stand for a "cap" on our businessworld salaries.

Actually that cap does exist. It is call budgets, profit and loss statements etc etc etc. How many employees has Nortel laid off in the past number of years do to revenue declining? 12,000? 20,000? The fact is that the pie got smaller so the people who worked there got laid off. Pure economics. The nice thing that the NHLPA has failed to recognize is that when the player signs a contact it is guaranteed, so he gets the same amount of money if he plays well or suck sh*t! How many businesses do you know where if someone sucks sh*t they still get paid without the company having anyway of getting rid of them.

The NHLPA had the brass ring handed to them, those choose not to take it! No crying now Goodenow!

 

[n_v]

The nice thing that the NHLPA has failed to recognize is that when the player signs a contact it is guaranteed, so he gets the same amount of money if he plays well or suck sh*t! How many businesses do you know where if someone sucks sh*t they still get paid without the company having anyway of getting rid of them.

This is a BIG problem with the NHL. You echo my sentiments exactly.

 

[matrix2004]

This is a BIG problem with the NHL. You echo my sentiments exactly.

This is not just a big problem in the NHL, but in the NBA and MLB as well. Guys like Yogi Stewart aren't even playing and yet are getting paid millions (how sweet is that!... for him that is) The NFL is the only major NA sports league where the contracts are NOT guaranteed. Interesting that the NFL has both a hard salary cap and UN-guaranteed contracts...yet is the most successful of the 4 top leagues! NHL- are you listening?

 

[n_v]

NHL- are you listening?

Yes. The problem is that the NHLPA is not!!

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

Hugh u are very well spoken and its obvious u know of what u speak but u must acknowledge that alot of this could stem back to adding 9new teams in 9 years, i would think as we speak right now 10 teams would jump at the last offer of the PA 10 would maybe live with it and 10 there is no chance in hell they would ever agree to it thus this is where we stand.

In principle I would agree...the NHL expanded into markets it had no business going....but at the times of expansion the NHLPA did not complain because it created jobs and increased union size.

That is the same reason that the NHLPA opposes contraction now....just like any union they want to preserve jobs and membership base.

As Matrix said:
"This is not just a big problem in the NHL, but in the NBA and MLB as well. Guys like Yogi Stewart aren't even playing and yet are getting paid millions (how sweet is that!... for him that is) The NFL is the only major NA sports league where the contracts are NOT guaranteed. Interesting that the NFL has both a hard salary cap and UN-guaranteed contracts...yet is the most successful of the 4 top leagues! NHL- are you listening?"

True that the NFL does not have guaranteed contracts, but that is largely due to the risk of injury to the player......but that is why they have huge signing bonuses to ensure the players gets his money.

A typical 4 year $20million contract will pay about $12.5million up front in the first year and then $2.5million per year for the final three years of the deal.

 

[MuffinMuncher]

um...?

Actually that cap does exist. It is call budgets, profit and loss statements etc etc etc.

With all due respect, the simple fact that the NHL owners each have a budget is proof that this alone is not enough to constitute a cap. A cap is something artificial put in place to prevent a salary from escalating past a certain point, regardless of the employers' willingness to do so, regardless of profit/loss.

A budget can be busted arbitrarily by whoever controls the checkbook.

 

[eric42]

If I didn't do my job, I would get fired. These guys had all of last summer and did nothing. Bye, bye you asswipes.

Bettman is just a bitch-whore for the owners to butt**ck. I hope if this guy loses his job, he never works again. This is why lawyers should never be given the title of the commish.

There are too many lame teams in this league that have caused all of this. The cities that deserve a franchise, unfortunately have no teams. There are many Canadian cities that would support a team much better than Anaheim, Columbus, Carolina, Atlanta etc., etc., etc.......

The fans are the ones who ultimately pay for everything, including the undeserved salaries of Mr. B. & Mr. G. We lose and the businesses that revolve aroung this wonderful game lose BIG. The bars, SC clubs, retail stores are going to hurt until this all gets back on track. Who knows if they can last that long.

God, I hate these 2 guys.

 

[Bud Plug]

Eric, while you clearly come across as a huge hockey fan, as am I, I disagree with virtually everything in your post.

If I didn't do my job, I would get fired. These guys had all of last summer and did nothing. Bye, bye you asswipes.

If you are referring to the lack of official negotiations meetings over the summer, you should realize that there are plenty of "off the record" meetings and telephone calls that happen in any negotiations. You shouldn't assume nothing happened other than what the media were able to report. Additionally, a lot of the work in a negotiation is meeting with your own principals to determine your mandate and set negotiations strategy. I'm absolutely sure that this work was being done on both sides through the summer.

Bettman is just a bitch-whore for the owners to butt**ck. I hope if this guy loses his job, he never works again. This is why lawyers should never be given the title of the commish.

Bettman has actually proven to be one of the most influential Commisioners of any pro sports league. Compare his influence to that of various NFL or MLB Commissioners. While I am not a lawyer, I realize that lawyers are often appointed to jobs which require negotiations leadership. That's part of what they are trained to do. Bud Selig is not a lawyer and look what a disaster he made out of his MLB negotiations!

There are too many lame teams in this league that have caused all of this. The cities that deserve a franchise, unfortunately have no teams. There are many Canadian cities that would support a team much better than Anaheim, Columbus, Carolina, Atlanta etc., etc., etc........

As I've said in other posts, the number of teams is necessary to obtaining a national television contract. Hockey will not be financially secure until that happens. Attendance in even the poorest NHL markets is not really that bad. Compare the percentage of empty seats in hockey arenas to the poorer baseball franchises. The reason that so many NHL teams are money losers is that salary arbitration, principally, has pushed up the salaries of mediocre players to a level that cannot be supported in a gate driven sport. The better contraction solution is not to reduce the number of teams, but to reduce the line-ups of each team (besides reducing payrolls slightly, this change would also improve the hockey, making it impossible to maintain "the trap" for 60 minutes, and ensuring that skilled players played more minutes on the ice, including more penality killing minutes).

The fans are the ones who ultimately pay for everything, including the undeserved salaries of Mr. B. & Mr. G.

True, but you don't pay when there's no hockey! Personally, I think both of them deserve their salary. Too many people think that being a negotiator is easy because all you need to know is how to say "no". In fact, the talent is in being able to say "yes". That's a rare talent, and well worth the dollars.

We lose and the businesses that revolve aroung this wonderful game lose BIG. The bars, SC clubs, retail stores are going to hurt until this all gets back on track. Who knows if they can last that long.

True, other businesses depend on the NHL. However, that's the gamble you take when you open a business that relies on business conditions beyond your control. It's no different than an auto parts manufacturer who's basically out of business if GM workers decide to strike. This isn't an extraordinary problem. The lesson in this is to diversify your client base so that a work stoppage doesn't put you out of business.

God, I hate these 2 guys.

As I've said earlier in this thread, it's a waste of time to focus on an emotional reaction to the negotiations representatives. The real issue is whether you think the owners are right that a hard cap at the level they've designed is required to stabilize the majority of franchises. If you agree with that concept, and you want to be mad at anyone, be mad at the sports agents and managers who refuse to tell their player clients that they should be accepting the league's deal.

 

[eric42]

This guy must be related to Gary or Bob. Making excuses means nothing.

These two just spit in our faces.

The bottom line is that they did nothing!

Lets hope they get something done tomorrow.