New Smart Hydro Meters

[tboy]

Just a head's up for the people who are about to be switched to smart metering and or switching over to an independant hydro supplier.

I just received my first bill and the costs have basically doubled from what I was paying before the smart meter was installed.

In addition, these companies will it you with an admin fee per month, ask for a $100.00 deposit, and charge you $20.00 for the fine privilege of having them invoice you instead of OPG.

Just be prepared to get fucked up the ass royally.....because it has been mandated that everyone be switched over by 2010.

 

[james t kirk]

I have a smart meter, but I didn't sign up for any hydro supplier.

Just stick with Toronto hydro.

I actually like the new meter in that I can easily read it and tell EXACTLY how much power I have used. Unlike the old meter, which was just a bunch of meaningless dials, this one tells you exactly the number of kw.hrs you have used, like an odometer on a car.

It's interesting to be able to compare my power usage to my neighbour's.

 

[l69norm]

I thought Newmarket, Chatham and Milton were the only ones charging "time of use" rates right now. Wait till next year when the full rate gets charged:
http://www.oeb.gov.on.ca/html/en/consumers/energyoptions/fs_timeofuse.htm#4

 

[Papi Chulo]

Why is hydro in Winnipeg & Montreal so much cheaper than Toronto??? (see link)

I guess we should be glad that we are not paying what they pay in SF or NY!!

 

[Keebler Elf]

My initial thoughts were that this is a great idea and I'd love to have one. Then I read a bunch of horror stories.

The bottom line is, if it's possible to keep your bill at the same level by changing your behaviour when it comes to electricity usage, then I'm all for it. But if you can't, then I don't want to be a volunteer, lol!

But seriously, the idea is a sound one and about bloody time. We need to pay the true cost of electricity if we're going to have any incentive to curtail our excessive usage. And there's no incentive if you don't tie price to usage.

Do your laundry on the weekends or nights. Program your thermostat. Don't use the AC all the time; just use it when it's particularly unbearable. And on and on and on.

Everyone loves to jump on the "subsidies are wrong" bandwagon, but as soon as the gov't talks about cutting the subsidies (via a higher electricity cap), people start screaming bloody murder about their electricity bill.

 

[Back Burner]

I hate the idea but there are good things about it.

For example if you live in a Condo, everyone pays the same rate. So if your neighbor has a marijuana grow-op he's basically paying the same hydro rate as you and in fact increasing the cost of utilities.

 

[Papi Chulo]

I hate the idea but there are good things about it.

For example if you live in a Condo, everyone pays the same rate. So if your neighbor has a marijuana grow-op he's basically paying the same hydro rate as you and in fact increasing the cost of utilities.

Most newer condos have a meter for each unit (in the electric room)

 

[LateComer]

I hate the idea but there are good things about it.

For example if you live in a Condo, everyone pays the same rate. So if your neighbor has a marijuana grow-op he's basically paying the same hydro rate as you and in fact increasing the cost of utilities.

All condos must switch to individually metered smart meters by the end of 2010.

 

[Keebler Elf]

... so if you can conserve during 'on-peak' hours you should be able to save a few $$$$

That's my understanding as well but I've yet to hear or read anything from someone who has actually saved money. That doesn't mean they aren't out there, but I just haven't seen/heard them.

 

[LateComer]

That's my understanding as well but I've yet to hear or read anything from someone who has actually saved money. That doesn't mean they aren't out there, but I just haven't seen/heard them.

I had a smart meter when Toronto did a pilot project a few years ago. I saved about $20 month compared to conventional metering. The savings were itemized on the bill. I did my laundry at night or on the weekends and had a timeshift baseboard heater installed in the part of the house not served by the forced air gas system.

 

[Robio]

Mine was changed without me knowing but the bill seems the same as before. The only thing I have noticed is I do not see any reduction of use with the new style light bulbs .I am not looking at the cost of the bill but the actually usage of KWH is the same all other things being same if not more energy efficient

 

[Terbevore]

Reversal of the decision.....

All condos must switch to individually metered smart meters by the end of 2010.

I'm on a condo Board of directors and we were looking at individual metering as we were informed the 2010 deadline. One company said they would install all the meters with no up-front cost, but we had to sign up for a 25 year contract and everyone would be charged $12 per month plus the hydro they consumed. Based on the number of units in my building, this extra fee for billing services and the amortization of the cost of installation worked out collectively to be about $22,000.00 per year. To say the least, we were not impressed. Interestly enough, the actual cost of installing a meter yourself is about $500.00.

Then the Board of Directors got an official letter from the government, I honestly forget which office or ministry, stating that the mandatory metering program had been cancelled and individual metering was optional. Needless to say we will not be going ahead with this. I imagine the government realized it would be facing a number of legal challenges to this policy had they tried to enforce it.

I'm also not convinced individual metering, aside from the associated costs, will save anyone all that much money. How many people are really going to do laundry in the middle of the night and cook dinner at odd hours. Both of these things represent a significant portion of anyone's power consumption. And then consider the amount of power consumed "silently" with istant-on televisions, digital clocks on things like microwave ovens and sleeping computers. It all adds up. As well, most condos these days are rather unbearable in the summer without AC, in fact, some don't even have windows which open to the outside, aside from small sliding "vent" windows which would allow the flow of cool air into the units.

 

[Keebler Elf]

The only thing I have noticed is I do not see any reduction of use with the new style light bulbs.

I thought the point of the bulbs is that they last far longer?

 

[Keebler Elf]

I'm also not convinced individual metering, aside from the associated costs, will save anyone all that much money.

So let's do nothing?

It's not all that hard at all to do your laundry in off-peak hours. Really, you're trying to tell us you can't do your laundry after 8 pm or on weekends? C'mon...

 

[Gentle Ben]

I thought the point of the bulbs is that they last far longer?

\
that is one of the selling features, because they cost more than incendesent.
They also use less energy, a 13 watt cfl is supposed to have equivilant lumens to a 60watt incendesent

 

[Papi Chulo]

Mine was changed without me knowing but the bill seems the same as before. The only thing I have noticed is I do not see any reduction of use with the new style light bulbs .I am not looking at the cost of the bill but the actually usage of KWH is the same all other things being same if not more energy efficient

Are you looking at the KWH usage from month to month, or are you comparing it to the same month last year??

 

[C Dick]

I think that paying the true cost of energy, plus a surcharge for the environmental impact, is by far the best way to reduce energy consumption. Forcing people to use drizzling showers and crappy little cars and things like that are stupid, it is a one-size-fits-nobody approach. And giving tax credits for hybrid cars when they still get 100% of their power for burning gasoline. Just raise the cost of hydro and gas high enough to reduce the consuption, then people will figure out the ways that work for them. Plus all that tax revenue can be used for something constructive, such as ensuring that politicians can still ride around in private jets and limos.

I would not mind a smart meter that charges more during peak times, it is the smarter meter that turns off your AC and other appliances when it feels like it that disturbs me.

 

[Moraff]

Mine was changed without me knowing but the bill seems the same as before. The only thing I have noticed is I do not see any reduction of use with the new style light bulbs .I am not looking at the cost of the bill but the actually usage of KWH is the same all other things being same if not more energy efficient

When the new bulbs came out I switched almost all my bulbs to the new ones (left a few old-style that get used rarely so I can use up the bulbs) when they first came out. I noticed about a $25 average drop in my hydro bill compared with previous years

 

[james t kirk]

Mine was changed without me knowing but the bill seems the same as before. The only thing I have noticed is I do not see any reduction of use with the new style light bulbs .I am not looking at the cost of the bill but the actually usage of KWH is the same all other things being same if not more energy efficient

CFL's use 15 watts I believe. Compared to say a 60 watt bulb, however, your actual dollar savings will be next to nothing unless your house is lit up like a fire cracker.

If you have 6 bulbs burning on average in your house, you'd save 260 watts.

In a 4 hour evening, you'd save 1 kw.hr

I believe a kw.hr is about 4.6 cents in Ontario.

Therefore, over the course of a month, you'd save about $1.20

I personally don't use CFLs, nor will I in the future because I don't like, nay, I detest flourescent light. It gives me stress headaches, reminds me of the office (or chinese restaurants) and I don't like looking green.

Besides, any energy saved will simply be put into the grid and the Americans will buy it up. I don't see them EVER scaling back electrical production in Ontario, sorry.

 

[tboy]

As rubmeister so rightly pointed out once before about items such as incandescent lightbulbs etc, everything has an energry cost associated with making the item. For eg: it takes x amount of energy to make the bulbs you have in your house now. If you replace those bulbs before they burn out, you're effectively wasting the evergy it took to make those bulbs.

So, if you're going for the cfl bulbs, only replace burned out bulbs not ones that are going strong.

Another thing: because cfl's produce more heat (I guess due to the built in ballast?) I have heard that they don't last more than a few days in recessed ceiling recepticles or anywhere else they don't have adequate ventilation. Can anyone confirm this?