MH17 report suggests efforts were made to cover up causes of disaster

[mandrill]

The official report on the shoot-down of the Malaysian airlines flight over the Ukraine has been released.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-cover-up-causes-of-disaster?CMP=share_btn_tw

 

[Frankfooter]

Russian missile.

Oagre, who fired it?

 

[fuji]

We already know who fired it. Russian-backed rebels in the Ukraine fired it, thinking that they had shot down a Ukrainian military jet. We know from intercepted radio transmissions that they didn't think they were shooting a civilian plane, we know they thought it was military, and they were celebrating that at first, until they started hearing that it was in fact a civilian plane. Then they started trying to cover it up.

This is one of those cases where the coverup is worse than the crime.

There isn't much of a crime here underneath all this -- some guys fucked up and shot at the wrong thing in a war zone. That happens. When Israel or the US does it you insist it's a war crime, but in fact all sides do it from time to time, and in this case, these Russian backed rebels did it. They'll have to live with that on their conscience, but it isn't a war crime to fuck up and shoot the wrong thing by mistake.

On the other hand the COVER UP is pretty interesting. Instead of fessing up and apologizing they tried to hide the evidence, tamper with the scene, interfere with investigators, and Russia itself may be complicit in that coveraup. For that heads should roll, probably all the way up to Putin, although he's a dictator, so he has no accountability whatsoever.

 

[nottyboi]

I think the only real crime here is the ICAO and Govt of Ukraine for not closing the airspace over a war zone with heavy anti-aircraft weapons in the hands of both sides. It seems pretty clear that even IF the rebels fire the missile it was from captured Ukrainian military stock. The EU putting sanctions on the Russian missile manufacturer is utterly retarded. Unless they illegally sold the weapons to non-state entities, they are at no fault in this tragedy. As for cover ups, the US has STILL covered up all kinds of details in relation to the Iran Air shoot down, so covering up things is not uncommon.

 

[fuji]

There were surveillance images of the missile launcher being transferred to the rebels across the Russian border.

In any case, like the attack on the MSF hospital or the USS Liberty that we discussed in other threads a mistake is not a crime. They clearly fucked up, not intentionally trying to kill civilians.

 

[mandrill]

I think the only real crime here is the ICAO and Govt of Ukraine for not closing the airspace over a war zone with heavy anti-aircraft weapons in the hands of both sides. It seems pretty clear that even IF the rebels fire the missile it was from captured Ukrainian military stock. The EU putting sanctions on the Russian missile manufacturer is utterly retarded. Unless they illegally sold the weapons to non-state entities, they are at no fault in this tragedy. As for cover ups, the US has STILL covered up all kinds of details in relation to the Iran Air shoot down, so covering up things is not uncommon.

Why would it be from "captured Ukrainian stock"? There exits video footage of the missiles being brought in from Russia and taken back to Russia. And even if it was captured, the Donbas militia guys were the idiots who fired it at a civilian plane.

And why would Ukraine close the air space? All airlines knew that it was a war zone. To date, the Donbas guys had not been supplied with high altitude missiles.

Notty rushes to protect his buddy Putin with hysterical nonsense once again.

 

[basketcase]

I think the only real crime here is the ICAO and Govt of Ukraine for not closing the airspace over a war zone ...

Typical Notty. Don't blame the (anti-American) people who actually shot down the plane but instead try to find a way to shift the blame.

I'm sure that when Assad started slaughtering protesters notty said the protesters are to blame for the crime of not accepting police beatings as acceptable.

 

[nottyboi]

Why would it be from "captured Ukrainian stock"? There exits video footage of the missiles being brought in from Russia and taken back to Russia. And even if it was captured, the Donbas militia guys were the idiots who fired it at a civilian plane.

And why would Ukraine close the air space? All airlines knew that it was a war zone. To date, the Donbas guys had not been supplied with high altitude missiles.

Notty rushes to protect his buddy Putin with hysterical nonsense once again.

It is a well known fact that the Ukrainians had several bases overrun by the rebels. The Ukraine had suffered several planes shot down already, so it was clear the rebels had anti aircraft missiles. As for footage shown, no one can say what that footage really depicts. Just a Buk launcher going down a country road...

 

[nottyboi]

Typical Notty. Don't blame the (anti-American) people who actually shot down the plane but instead try to find a way to shift the blame.

I'm sure that when Assad started slaughtering protesters notty said the protesters are to blame for the crime of not accepting police beatings as acceptable.

I think it is pretty clear that the rebels had no intent on shooting down an airliner. I am not sure who started what in Syria, but these things are always murky, just like the strange stuff that occured in Ukraine. There is no crime here, it was an error. Unlike Israel which KNOWINGLY bombs buildings full of families because they suspect there are some militarily ineffective missiles stored in the area.

 

[mandrill]

It is a well known fact that the Ukrainians had several bases overrun by the rebels. The Ukraine had suffered several planes shot down already, so it was clear the rebels had anti aircraft missiles. As for footage shown, no one can say what that footage really depicts. Just a Buk launcher going down a country road...

Ukrainians had several planes previously shot down by LOW LEVEL AAA. Up to that time, the rebels did not have high altitude missiles.

The footage of the BUK missiles being transported were correlated with GPS and matched with other photos and clearly showed the missiles being driven along a route from the Russian border to the eventual shoot-down launch site and then back again to Russia.

And what's your proof that Ukraine had specific anti aircraft missile bases over-run? None, right?

Hey Notty, I see you took ALL your talking points from Putin's own press conference for his own fake, bullshit media briefing on the MH17 earlier. You just copied everything that Putin said and regurgitated it. Here's the link.

http://www.rferl.org/content/russia-spins-mh17-report/27306275.html

 

[mandrill]

I think it is pretty clear that the rebels had no intent on shooting down an airliner. I am not sure who started what in Syria, but these things are always murky, just like the strange stuff that occured in Ukraine. There is no crime here, it was an error. Unlike Israel which KNOWINGLY bombs buildings full of families because they suspect there are some militarily ineffective missiles stored in the area.

"Murky". "Strange stuff". "No crime, just an error".

The Notty bullshit factory goes into overdrive licking Putin's ass.

 

[basketcase]

I think the only real crime here is the ICAO and Govt of Ukraine for....

... There is no crime here....

Hmm. Don't worry about contradicting yourself.


Also don't worry about the inconsistency claiming Putin's thugs kill people 'by accident' but US or Israelis do it intentionally.

 

[fuji]

Hmm. Don't worry about contradicting yourself.


Also don't worry about the inconsistency claiming Putin's thugs kill people 'by accident' but US or Israelis do it intentionally.

He is a biased piece is s***. He is happy to give the rebels the benefit of the doubt but on the MSF hospital thread and other cases the US, Israel, etc, he assumes are guilty until proven innocent.

This thread really exposes him, which is hilarious because it is the thread on which the bad guys really just fucked up.

 

[nottyboi]

Ukrainians had several planes previously shot down by LOW LEVEL AAA. Up to that time, the rebels did not have high altitude missiles.

The footage of the BUK missiles being transported were correlated with GPS and matched with other photos and clearly showed the missiles being driven along a route from the Russian border to the eventual shoot-down launch site and then back again to Russia.

And what's your proof that Ukraine had specific anti aircraft missile bases over-run? None, right?

Hey Notty, I see you took ALL your talking points from Putin's own press conference for his own fake, bullshit media briefing on the MH17 earlier. You just copied everything that Putin said and regurgitated it. Here's the link.

http://www.rferl.org/content/russia-spins-mh17-report/27306275.html

They may be fake, the information from the Ukrainians may be fake. Lets face it, both side do not have a great record of honesty.. Who took those photos? Who matched them to GPS? man, talk about licking ass!!!

 

[nottyboi]

Typical Notty. Don't blame the (anti-American) people who actually shot down the plane but instead try to find a way to shift the blame.

I'm sure that when Assad started slaughtering protesters notty said the protesters are to blame for the crime of not accepting police beatings as acceptable.

Who is anti-American? I did not know anyone in Ukraine was fighting the Americans.

 

[nottyboi]

Hmm. Don't worry about contradicting yourself.


Also don't worry about the inconsistency claiming Putin's thugs kill people 'by accident' but US or Israelis do it intentionally.

If you don't understand why that is not a contradiction, then you have no grasp of the english language. "Here" was clearly referring to the rebels if they in fact fired the missile. Not the entire incident itself. Especially clear since they were in two different posts on the thread.

 

[nottyboi]

He is a biased piece is s***. He is happy to give the rebels the benefit of the doubt but on the MSF hospital thread and other cases the US, Israel, etc, he assumes are guilty until proven innocent.

This thread really exposes him, which is hilarious because it is the thread on which the bad guys really just fucked up.

If the missile was fired by the rebels (freedom fighters whatever) that is ONE INCIDENT. Israel and the US have been involved in countless incidents, again, again and again. Slaughtering women and children and then saying.. oops my bad. Especially Israel when they know FULL WELL who is in the buildings.

 

[fuji]

If the missile was fired by the rebels (freedom fighters whatever) that is ONE INCIDENT. Israel and the US have been involved in countless incidents, again, again and again. Slaughtering women and children and then saying.. oops my bad. Especially Israel when they know FULL WELL who is in the buildings.

You're hanging by the neck on this one. There is no excuse for your behavior. The fact is you have a different standard for Jews than you have here for these Russian backed rebels.

You're just a fucking hypocritical bigot.

 

[mandrill]

http://euromaidanpress.com/2015/10/...omprehensive-guide-ever-to-mh17-conspiracies/

Just to help Notty bullshit his way deeper and deeper into ignominy on this thread, I present the above guide to Putinboi nonsense MH17 conspiracy theories. :frusty:

 

[mandrill]

They may be fake, the information from the Ukrainians may be fake. Lets face it, both side do not have a great record of honesty.. Who took those photos? Who matched them to GPS? man, talk about licking ass!!!

The evidence of the photos and GPS stands for itself. Your only retort is to whimper that everything the West produces is "lies" and everything Putin says is guaranteed truth. What a pathetic loser you are!