Jacques Parizeau

Maybe someone can answer this for me.

I thought that Quebec was looking to be a sovereign nation, but still carry the same currency, military, federal support etc.

What was the position on that?

Quebec was a former defeated nation, assimilated into what is now known as Canada care of General Wolf in 1759, an agent and representatives of King George III. Fuck the treasonous shit disturber, Parizeau, our sovereign lady, Queen Elizabeth, “Del Gratis Regina" is on the currency used in the restaurant in the provincial legislature of Quebec erroneously named the National assembly, at least the last time I ate there.

Vive la pur laine putain!
 
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Del Gratis Regina and her depraved family can go fuck themselves.

And Parizeau cut Bouchard at the knees with his ethnic comment. Separation would have been a very messy business, English Canada would have flipped Quebec the bird on sovereignty association. Eventually an independent Quebec would achieve the same state as Puerto Rico.

It cannot be underestimate the importance of Stephane Dion to the Non side. Chretien underestimated PQ strength with Dion fighting alone. His strategy worked, Montreal would have lost influence to Quebec City if the Oui side won. And you have to admire Brian Mulroney, the man has a talent for grooming separatists.
 
Maybe someone can answer this for me.

I thought that Quebec was looking to be a sovereign nation, but still carry the same currency, military, federal support etc.

What was the position on that?

The position was that Quebec, with some 7 million inhabitants, had approximately 7 million different points of view. There isn't, wasn't and never will be a single "Quebec" position.

Mr Parizeau wanted out of out independence, and was prepared to issue an unconstitutional declaration of independence had he won the vote and the secession negotiations foundered. Mr Parizeau never believed that Canada would negotiate independence in good faith. He was the only Quebec secessionist leader who understood English Canada and understood that English Canadians are every bit as irrational and hotheaded as their latin French Canadian counterparts.

Mr Bouchard, despite having served in the federal cabinet, never "got" English Canadians, and never understood English Canadians' irrational desire to punish Quebec were it to vote for independence. One would think that the anti-Quebec English Canadians would be ecstatic to rid themselves of this most bothersome and expensive province, and so Mr Bouchard mistakenly thought that he would find good faith negotiators on the other side whose goal would be to achieve an amicable separation with the least possible disruption to commerce (many French Quebecers have this mistaken notion that English Canadians' main or only purpose in business and commerce). Thus he couldn't comprehend why Canadians would not want to negotiate a free-trade, customs and monetary union with an independent Quebec, and thus assumed that such a union would be achievable. The Bouchard amendment to the referendum question contemplated negotiations for the purposes of achieving such a union. Some Quebec voters viewed the referendum vote like a union strike vote - the union needs the strike vote to have a strong negotiating position even if no one wants to strike; these Quebecers somehow thought that a "yes" vote would strengthen the hand of Quebec within Canada - it was in referring to these voters that Parizeau made his "lobsters in a trap" comment.

In the end, Quebec voted for the status quo, so as to the question of what "Quebec" was looking to achieve, it was the status quo. Don't conflate the position of any particular government of the day or government leader with the views of "Quebec".
 
The separatists were pushing a concept call "sovereignty association" which basically means sovereignty with some links to Canada.


Sovereignty-association was René-Lévesque's project of the late 70s until the 1980 referendum. The early 90s movement was different.
 
I was fortunate enough to be eligible to cast my vote, I voted in favour, got in my car and drove to Ontario..
 
Some Quebec voters viewed the referendum vote like a union strike vote - the union needs the strike vote to have a strong negotiating position even if no one wants to strike; these Quebecers somehow thought that a "yes" vote would strengthen the hand of Quebec within Canada
Or, it's like the child who threatens to leave home unless he gets whatever he wants. It's a tactic that has worked time and again for Quebec. At some point one would have thought that English Canada would have drawn a "line in the sand" but that would be unCanadian.
 
Or, it's like the child who threatens to leave home unless he gets whatever he wants. It's a tactic that has worked time and again for Quebec. At some point one would have thought that English Canada would have drawn a "line in the sand" but that would be unCanadian.
Harper achieved the present majority government without Quebec. He also avoided getting into a pissing match with the pequistes, which would have been redneck versus redneck.
 
His legacy is that he encouraged English-speaking Canadians to be treated as second class citizens in Quebec. I'm, for one, not going to miss him.
On the other hand francophone Quebeckers who were tired of being treated as second-class citizens across Canada, and even in Québec itself, continue to vote PQ. When I'm in Québec, most recently last weekend, I have no sense of being treated as a second-class citizen when I speak English.

But he wasn't talking to us, and it's unlikely he'd care whether we would miss him or not.
 
I was fortunate enough to be eligible to cast my vote, I voted in favour, got in my car and drove to Ontario..


:biggrin1::biggrin1::biggrin1:

FAST
 
Only in it's earliest days could Quebec consider itself pure French, that's where Parizeau got it all wrong.

Irish immigrants started arriving in Lower Canada from the time of Cromwell's invasion onward. They were willing to trade the English language for their Catholic faith. The English treated their Irish subjects just slightly better than plantation slaves. The practice was banned in England by the mid 18th Century but they were still blissfully hanging drawing and quartering the Irish up until the Potato Famine.
 
Only in it's earliest days could Quebec consider itself pure French, that's where Parizeau got it all wrong.

Irish immigrants started arriving in Lower Canada from the time of Cromwell's invasion onward.…
But settled pretty much only where they first came ashore, and were always a minority there—about 5-6% today. To suggest they somehow make Quebec less French is like saying the Chinese signs in Agincourt mean Canada's not anglophone.
 
But settled pretty much only where they first came ashore, and were always a minority there—about 5-6% today. To suggest they somehow make Quebec less French is like saying the Chinese signs in Agincourt mean Canada's not anglophone.

Many quebecers have some or a lot of Irish in them.

In the Gaspé region there is a surprising number of English settlements.

New Carlisle

Jardins Metis

Douglastown

And even Gaspe (town of)


What is interesting is how the Separatists thought that they could alter the mindset by legislation. (forcing French). This they hoped would result in francophones with simply a British background.

Ironically what they got was fully bilingual Canadians.

The Anglos in Quebec have adopted to the Franco language but they have not become pequist in their outlook.
 
By the way, I just got back from Quebec.

I saw the most interesting thing. Where you had municipal buildings with both Canadian and Quebec flags, the Quebec flag was at half mast and the Canadian flag was at full staff
 
The Anglos in Quebec have adopted to the Franco language but they have not become pequist in their outlook.
Even if an Anglo is fluently French speaking, he or she will always be a second or third class citizen (like a Christian in Islamdom) in Quebec. Ever notice how few Anglos in the Quebec public sector?
 
"More recently, Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia stated, "If there was any constitutional issue resolved by the Civil War, it is that there is no right to secede"

American states (unlike Quebec and Scotland) have no legal right to secede. The last time a state tried to secede, President Lincoln sent in federal troops and started killing 100's of thousands of people.