Don't care about by-law, doesn't affect me, but those same 2 clubs today.... Only 1 is a hoehouse. You can put lipstick on a pig... I have found that not much changes, people are people.
Is MP a Public Place?
- Thread starter wanttodo
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What a load of garbage that post was! I'm laughing so hard!!! Hahahahaha!
1. My arguments (as you call them) have been a collection of many months of discussion. Filled with ample facts. Just because I don't repost it in every thread we get bickering in, doesn't eliminate all of that work. Nice try though sweetie.**
2. Sure. About some aspects. Like my desire for safety for all. Like my desire for sex workers rights. Like my desire for equality for both sexes. Etc. Doesn't change both my professional & personal stance/opinion/arguments. How quickly you forget that I was a sex worker for almost a decade. That's a bias too. But I'm not a man-hating c-36-er. I don't tote around saying "I survived!" What I can do is explain how & why Muse is compliant.**
3. Without anything to back it up?? Honey, keep up. I've posted in several threads, extensive explanations & descriptions of my fact-gathering, resources, etc. I am working as part of the team of improved trafficking investigation **techniques that have recently placed several traffickers behind bars & resuced some young ladies in trouble. I'm working with the city to form more efficient bylaws & resources. Etc. I don't need to reiterate all of this just because you choose to eliminate it from your memory to better serve your argument in this 1 thread. (I'm laughing again! Ur hilariously bias in your own regard).**
Not once have I claimed to be a legal expect. Kill me if I ever am one haha. Law is boring & frustrating. I'm in the business of simplified frustration reduction. Law isn't my interest.**
I can't make blanket statements about the industry or other businesses. I most certain can about my own! I know what Muse does & doesn't do because Riley & myself have formed it from nothing, from the ground up. Every rule, procedure, method, and tool comes from us. We do not sell sexual services. The 9pm bylaw is up in courts. Its at a stay for the time being in terms of enforcement. Period.**
Ok so you can use Vaughan as your magical reference but when I do, suddenly you are correcting me that it's not the same city?! Hahahaha I'm dying again hahahaha you Sir are friggin funny!**
Arrogance? Ya maybe. I know my shit. I'm a capricorn. Does that make what I say untrue? Nope.**
That made up quote of yours is disgusting. I encourage you to edit & delete that insulting false mess of crap.**
So, you've been in this for less time, assume I'm less educated, and don't speak to authorities.....yet you know more than me on the matter??? Ok, stop, I'm gonna pee myself if I keep laughing this hard!!! HAHA!**
Sweetheart, I'm just as educated as you, if not more so. I hold 2 degrees & 1 trade diploma. I have 20yrs of sale & management experience. Overlapping 15yrs in the adult biz. I own one of the best MP's in the country. And have the awards & credits to back it up.**
Now that we have exchanged resumes and I've laughed so hard at your weak "you don't know shit" arguments....can we get back on topic?**
You are boring me now. Zzzzzzzz
"I'm right because I know better than you" is her stand, and she has made it clear by the way she posts and the way she responds to other people who she does not agree with. Just like you said yourself her points are based on her business interests and nothing else. Do not waste your breath trying to explain things to her. I actually feel bad for her because if her lawyers are giving her the information that she claims she is getting she needs new lawyers.
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I entirely agree. Not really any point debating anything where the person on the other side isn't willing to succumb to reason. It's good to know that I'm not the only one who feels that a massage parlour which solely profits off the provision of sexual services cannot be compliant with a law that prohibits the commercialization of sexual services. To say that is possible is more backwards than bill C-36 itself...
I have the same problem with people making statements like "LE are only going after trafficking", I'm sorry trafficking is completely different than c36, it can be likened to by-law, trafficking is an international agreement, nothing to do with c36. Then some john gets charged, someone posts that they should be going after THOSE guys, they are just like us lookin for some snatch. It will go on and on, adjusting as things come up.
Whether LE decides to act upon an establishment, a dwelling or a street, whether it is complaint based or not is anybody's guess. It may be tomorrow, next month, year or never. If it happens, it probably won't be a slap on the wrist.
Giving people a false sense of security is wrong.
That being said, it is in the owners of MP best interest to terminate the ladies that jeopardize their business licence.
I don't believe LE will " go after" all MP, maybe just the ones that are going over the edge.
Keep up. We're talking about C-36 and LE as it affects customers.
Things changed in bylaw-land because a few enforcement officers got caught being too cozy. The new sheriff cleaned house.
I'm glad we agree that being licensed is not the same as being law-abiding.
Have you read the law or anything related to C36 from official sites?
Human trafficking: http://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/cj-jp/tp/legis-loi.html
"Trafficking in persons is about exploitation and does not necessarily involve movement. For the purpose of the trafficking offences, the Criminal Code states that a person exploits another person if they:
1.cause someone to provide, or offer to provide, labour or a service by engaging in conduct that, in all the circumstances, could reasonably be expected to cause the other person to believe that their safety or the safety of a person known to them would be threatened if they failed to provide, ..."
What I say is regardless of c36, Canada signed on to Human Trafficking, an international agreement. This is far different than Johns.
Even if C36 was struck down, there would be provisions to cover this as well as pimping.
If you are interested in having consensual sex for hire, then mixing trafficking and pimping with it doesn't help the cause. The government has and so have many terb members.
I may not be in favour of BJ/FS at SC or MP, but I am certainly in favour of escorts and agencies that represent them
Stay has a point. We didn't need C-36 to criminalize trafficking and linking nefarious behaviour to the buyers is bad news for us.
Capricorn? Happy Belated Birthday.
BTW, I always felt that Master Chef copied your logo. Now it seems that they changed it by wrapping more of a circle around their letter 'M'. I wonder. Just curious and nosy ha ha.
Well I hope your 2 degrees and 1 trade diploma should help you understand that informal discussions with public officials does not equal to a verifiable fact. There is absolutely no way to verify this information other than if we just choose to believe you when you suggest Muse is 100% compliant. Most people would find it quite convenient that a person in your position would say that their business is 100% compliant where this is logically not possible - an assertion which can't be backed up by any verifiable fact. As you love to say...keep up sweetie.
Your desire for safety for all in only in respects to your own business interests. I don't see you trying to help the mpa's in Vaughan in helping them win their bylaw challenge, nor do I see you going out to talk to the Saskatoon police department after their publicized John sweeps. No, your only interested in protected your employees, your clients, and ultimately your own business. In fact, I remember in an argument you had with Andy from Mirage where you insinuated that sex workers were better off at Muse because "they didn't need to do full service". Clearly, you are much more interested in protecting your own interests above other sex workers. When you try to come off as someone who is the valiant protector of the innocent sex workers it doesn't really seem genuine.
I'm glad you found my fake quote to be disgusting because that's also how I felt about it. The sad part is that it essentially sums up everything you've said thus far. If I'm wrong, please explain how.
Not to make this discussion too personal but I really doubt your education is anywhere close to being on par with mine.
I also like you how took this opportunity to tell everyone yet again how great Muse is. Not sure how you would quantify your spa as being the best in the country, and even if it was - I'm sure you could use your 2 degrees and 1 trade diploma to realize much of the success of the spa is due to a lax enforcement environment, and most importantly the City's licensing regime which acts as a barrier to entry for competitors. Really what you are doing that is so drastically different or innovative than any other spa? You have some unique sessions but it is predominately a pretty straight forward, industry standard business model. You touting your building is Muse to "20yrs of sale & management experience" is quite laughable as you make it seem like you started the next Lululemon or Facebook. Many spas which aren't that well run still make a lot of money. You can't really say the same for most other types of businesses.
You then claim I am somehow biased? How? I am just trying to bring a balanced counter argument to your narrative of rainbows and unicorns at Muse in the C-36 environment. I guess it doesn't fit your "agenda" so it makes it biased.
Well said. I am not knocking muse or mpasquared.
People have to understand and weigh the risks/benefits in light of a new law and possible enforcement.
Actually what I thought to myself as I read this was "what an idiot this guy is".
You are so blind. Have you read all the the c36 threads since it was presented by Peter? Because if you have, my extensive work for the entire sex trade is well documented. My position paper became a piece of discussion in the Senate readings. My website Happy Hookers of Canada made national news & it's submissions became evidence in all hearings for c36's committee & senate readings. I have a network of mp's, mpa's, & owners that spans from Newfoundland to Ottawa to Van City. National radio shows, national newspapers, and I now speak at several universities about sex work, trafficking, and legalization law debates. Pm me & i'll send u an invite to my next talk.
You are as naieve & clueless as your "I'm more educated" statement. My entire life is available on the net. My "resume" & it's backing is quite find-able on google honey.
Andy & I fought over something entirely different. And yes, I firmly believe fs is not required. Girls at my spa make just as much or more than agency girls. That's not because I'm so smart, that's because price-points are on par across the varrying industries. Those facts are easy to see by looking at price lists on websites & knowing how the splits & costs break down.
Muse has international media credits & business awards that back up my statements. Again, googleable. Or just ask to come see our wall of fame & tear sheets.
Every sex worker deserves better law than c36. Every sex worker deserves the right to choose how & where she works. My activism for sex workers rights has become a year-long crusade that has transformed my purpose in this industry. It has laid out a new direction for my know-how, and a new invigorated energy for me.
I don't give a shit about your understanding of me. You don't know me at all. You're too lazy to dig into it to see the facts laid out even here on terb. You aren't a client of muse. You're combative "I'm gonna prove she is stupid" quest is laughable. You don't have to like me, but stupid ain't it honey. My worst enemies even admit I'm bloody smart. You, Sir, are boring. This argument is boring. And you managed to derail yet another thread that had merit by attacking me. Again.
Get a life!
Me, I have reason to be here. I have presented multiple facts or methods to gain said facts. And I do not deny the bias when it comes from me. Hence why I have laid out the people & places I've gathered said facts so that others can do their research too.
Muses legal standing is also google-able.
Man, are you living in 2105 or 1990??
Lululemon is a troubled company. I wouldn't be impressed with that. But Muse changed the gta massage industry. Flipped comfy money makers on their heads. Rocked boats. And have spent our 5yrs watching every single spa change its business model to keep up. I invite you to join me for a coffee one day & i'll show you in black&white how exactly that happened.
In the mean time, spend less energy attacking me. You gain nothing but a pissed off woman who is much smarter than you, with more endurance, and more reason to battle than you should be. Don't you have a job? A family? Something better to be doing? For me, I am doing my job. And you make it easy & boring with your "you don't know anything, despite your experience" argument. It really is quite lame.
Now, get back on topic, or start a "I hate mpa2" thread & leave those concerned about sex workers, safety, & c36 alone to read c36 threads that don't stray off topic. I'm sure the community will be grateful if you would shut up. I know I would!
Actually, other posters probably seem to feel my responses are quite logically inclined. It seems that in your desperate attempts to discredit me, you have now resorted to attacking me personally which kind of says more about you then it does about me.
You again have put together a whole web of things, but where are the verifiable facts? Your position paper to the senate isn't a fact, it is a position. That's like me taking the position paper of an evangelical church group saying that all MPs should be shut down as a "fact". Your public outreach to newspapers and talk shows are a fact?? What university did you go to?? The only thing that is lame, is the fact that it appears that you cannot differentiate between a fact and an opinion. Specifically your opinion...
I'm sure a lot of Evangelical church groups have done lots of public outreach on TV and Radio as well. In fact, quite possibly as long as you have been doing this. Does it make what they say a "fact"? Get real, you sound less intelligent than I thought you were and probably just lost it.
How is Muse's legal standing googleable? What exactly did you google?? Am I supposed to find law firms endorsement of your activities? Am I supposed to find the Attorney General announcing that Muse Enterprises should not fear C-36? What am I looking for? Saying it is 100% legal for a commercial establishment which solely exists due to the provision of sexual services under a law which prohibits the selling and commodification of sexual services is kind of stupid you think? Being a little more realistic in saying that you've done your due diligence and there is only a small risk would make you sound much more credible. Even the agencies are willing to admit that what they do isn't exactly 100% perfect for the clients - there is most definitely a small risk as there always was under the old laws. But no - you just have to keep perpetuating a unbelievable story of rainbows and unicorns and attack those who say otherwise.
As for your attempts to insinuate that somehow MPs working for you are better than SPs that offer full service, I believe it is decisive comments like these that show how biased you are. In the same breath you would say that MPs are essentially of a higher standing than SPs and you then would say your work is to ensure "Every sex worker deserves better law than c36".
As for your need to advertise your business in this thread as the best, award winning, innovative spa the world has ever seen - I don't really care because I don't see the relevance. I'm sure there are many of this board that like other spas better but I don't get your point at all. Are you saying because you were so clever to make the worlds best spa, everyone should listen to you because you are so smart? No need to be so humble...
And no I don't hate you at all. I don't know you personally and I do respect much of the public outreach work you have done. I clearly don't agree with what could easily perceived as a biased, illogical point of view to create a false sense of security. I do find it funny you said I am desperate to prove you wrong because I have nothing to lose. I don't care how you respond to me. The fact this seems to be getting under your skin is probably because you are running out of insults and baseless "facts" to rebut me and fear some potential PR backlash. But don't worry, I don't think that many members care or even read this section. No need to get so worked up.
