Is 1933 German History repeating in the USA?

WoodPeckr

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Interesting article showing some scary similarities and tactics used in Germany back in 1933 and what is happening at present in the USA under Team 'w'......:eek:

"Just As 'Legal' As Hitler was in 1933"
Anonymous

First - Gonzales "Legalizes" Torture.
WASHINGTON, Jan. 4 - Alberto R. Gonzales, the White House counsel, intervened directly wi th Justice Department lawyers in 2002 to obtain a legal ruling on the extent of the president's authority to permit extreme interrogation practices in the name of national security.

A request by Mr. Gonzales produced the Justice Department memorandum of Aug. 1, 2002, which defined torture narrowly and said that Mr. Bush could circumvent domestic and international prohibitions against torture in the name of national security. The issue was whether al Qaeda and Taliban fighters captured on the battlefield in Afghanistan should be accorded the Geneva Conventions' human rights protections.

Gonzales, after reviewing a legal brief from the Justice Department's Office of Legal Counsel, advised Bush verbally on Jan. 18, 2002, that he had authority to exempt the detainees from such protections. Bush agreed, reversing a decades-old policy aimed in part at ensuring equal treatment for U.S. military detainees around the world. Rumsfeld issued an order the next day to command ers that detainees would receive such protections only "to the extent appropriate and consistent with military necessity."

On January 25, 2002, Gonzales wrote a memo to President Bush arguing that the terrorism fight "renders obsolete Geneva's strict limitations on questioning of enemy prisoners and renders quaint some of its provisions."

''My judgment was ... that it would not apply to al-Qaida or others - as they weren't a signatory to the convention,'' he said.

When the text was leaked to the public last summer, it attracted scorn from military lawyers and human rights experts worldwide. Nigel Rodley, a British lawyer who served as the special U.N. reporter on torture and inhumane treatment from 1993 to 2001, remarked that its underlying doctrine "sounds like the discredited legal theories used by Latin American countries" to justify repression." End of Quote

Second - Gonzales "Legalizes" Repression.
Quote: "WASHINGTON (Feb. 6) -- Attorney Gener al Alberto Gonzales insisted Monday that President Bush was "acting with authority" both under the Constitution and federal law in eavesdropping on Americans without warrants. In a statement prepared for the hearing, Gonzales called the monitoring program "reasonable" and "lawful."

Gonzales, who was not sworn in, told the committee, "As the president has explained, the terrorist surveillance program operated by the (electronic-monitoring National Security Agency) requires the maximum in speed and agility, since even a very short delay may make the difference between success and failure in preventing the next attack."

His arguments reiterated those defending President Bush's decision to allow the NSA to eavesdrop, without first obtaining warrants, on people inside the United States whose calls or e-mails may be linked to terrorism.

But in his prepared remarks, Gonzales said he could not discuss how the program works, as skeptics of the program have demanded . "An open discussion of the operational details of this program would put the lives of Americans at risk," he said.

Gonzales argued that Congress did, in fact, authorize the president in September 2001 to use military force in the war on terror.

He noted that the legislation "calls on the president to protect Americans both 'at home and abroad,'" and "to take action to prevent further terrorist attacks 'against the United States.'"

But congressional Democrats have said they did not intend to order domestic surveillance." End of quote

And so - as the Chicago Mafia Gangsters used to say - "The Fix Is In" -

The Bush "legal mouthpiece" has produced "Legalized Torture and Repression" - Just like Germany had in 1933.

Alberto Gonzales is a lot like Franz Gurtner, another conservative nationalist lawyer and judge - who was appointed by Hitler to head the Reich Ministry of Justice, and who got along - very well - with the Nazis despite not being a Nazi himself.

How did the German Legal system change as a result of Nazi 'leadership'?

Fear-mongering was the main tool used to change the law, and to undermine civil liberties. So, where the constitution was changed, the code of criminal procedure was also changed, extraordinary powers were vested in the Executive, including extensive police powers; and the powers of an independent judiciary were destroyed.

This was all done based on a "terrorist menace." And exactly what the menace was, shifted from time to time during the Nazi period. It was a matter of opportunism, or convenience.

Judges couldn't be impartial anymore. They used only Nazi interpretations in making their decisions. In the everyday practice of law the ideas of the Fuhrer (Hitler) were silently but loyally followed. People feared the legal system, but nobody could - legally - stop Hitler. And even Nazis no longer had the civil rights once guaranteed by the German constitution.

Hitler was asked - In September 1931: "How do you imagine the setting up of a Third Reich?" His reply was, " We will enter the legal organizations and will make our Party a decisive factor in this way. But when we do possess constitutional rights then we will form the State in the manner which we consider to be the right one." Hitler was asked: "This too by constitutional means ?" Hitler replied: "Yes."

Nazi conspirators participated in German elections, the legal system, and in the Reichstag to undermine the parliamentary and judicial system of the German Republic and to replace it with a dictatorship of their own.

On 30 April 1928, Goebbels wrote in his paper "Der Angriff": "We enter parliament in order to supply ourselves, inside the arsenal of democracy, with its own weapons. We become members of the Reichstag in order to paralyze the liberal Weimar sentiment with its own assistance. If democracy is so stupid as to give us free tickets and per diem for the this "blockade" (Barendienst), that is its own affair." Later in the same article he continued: "We do not come as friend nor even as neutrals. We come as enemies: As the wolf bursts into the flock, so we come."

Crucially, Gurtner - like Alito and Gonzales - ruled that vital "national interests" - as defined by Hitler as head of state - had precedence over the rule of law. Time and time again, Gurtner supported unlawful measures and even murders, because they had been declared by Hitler as crucial for the "survival of the state." That's what makes the efforts by some American lawyers - like Alito and Gonzales - and most GOP politicians - to argue that the president can and should be above the law - so disturbing.

It appears that the GOP has transformed America into a society where we are ruled by 'special men' - rather than by laws - so we are all subject to the whims of the president and his appointees.

A president or appointee who imagines himself to be ab ove the law is mentally and morally unfit to serve in public office; government lawyers who argue that the president is above the law are apologists for a dictatorship. They are the modern equivalents of Franz Gurtner, justifying the Nazi abuse of power and legal authority in the name of 'national security'.

[L]ike Hitler, the top police officials were open about the fact that they did not see themselves as bound by legal norms. In a speech to the Academy of German Law in October, 1936, Himmler bluntly stated: "Right from the start I took the view that it did not matter in the least if our actions were contrary to some clause in the law; in my work for the Fuhrer and the nation, I do what my conscience and common sense tells me is right."

Disregard for the letter of the law was seen as crucial to the Nazi defense of 'national interests.' The German police styled itself the "domestic army." Just as the German army on the battlefield could not be subject to legal regulat ion, so too, it was claimed, the fight of the German police at home must not be constrained by the rule of law.

American soldiers and government contractors continue to violate the Geneva Conventions and laws against torture to serve the interests of their president and his appointees. They do what their immediate superiors tell them to do - as directed by both implicit and explicit statements from others high up the chain of command. Their actions are wrong, and they justify themselves by the same excuses used by police and military officials in Nazi Germany.

[cont]
 

WoodPeckr

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Today domestic surveillance exceeds that which is permitted by US law. Police, FBI, and National Security personnel believe that their attempts to fight terrorism justifies ignoring the law - indeed, they argue that laws which protect the rights of the accused and the innocent simply hamper police investigations and need to be curtailed. Franz Gurtner and Alberto Gonzales certainly agree.

As Himmler explai ned to German army generals on 21 June 1944, he could not care less whether the actions were legal or not: "What is necessary for Germany will be done, however horrifying it may be."

The legal system, Hitler warned (in a speech to the Reichstag on 26 April 1942), must have only one thought: German Victory. It was high time, he continued, that the legal system realized that it did not exist for its own sake, but for 'national interests'.

Goebbels said, in 1935: "When democracy granted democratic methods for us in the times of opposition, this could only happen in a democratic system. However, we National Socialists never asserted that we represented a democratic point of view, but we have declared openly that we used democratic methods only in order to gain the power and that, after assuming the power, we would deny to our adversaries, without any consideration, the means which were granted to us in the times of opposition."

A leading Nazi writer on Constitution al Law, Ernst Rudolf Huber, later wrote of this period: "The parliamentary battle of the NSDAP had the single purpose of destroying the parliamentary system from within through its own methods. It was necessary above all to make formal use of the possibilities of the party-state system but to refuse real cooperation and thereby to render the parliamentary system, which is by nature dependent upon the responsible cooperation of the opposition, incapable of action."

And today, GOP appointees like Gonzales and Alito and virtually all GOP elected officials think - and act - exactly like Hitler, Himmler, Goebbels and Franz Gurtner - and no longer have to care whether their actions are legal or not, as they impose the "Rule of Bush" over the stupid US Sheeple.

And they're just as "Legal" as Hitler was in 1933.

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/justaslegal.php
 

papasmerf

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Been too warm for ice to form on the lake. I must assume you have been standing the cold water too long and hypotherma has taken its toll on your brain.
 

WoodPeckr

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papasmerf said:
Been too warm for ice to form on the lake. I must assume you have been standing the cold water too long and hypotherma has taken its toll on your brain.
LOL....
pops, you must be talking from personal experience no doubt.......;)
 
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Here's an equally relevant article, Pecker:


LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - A judge on Tuesday ordered Paris Hilton to stay away from a Los Angeles party planner who accused the celebrity heiress of bombarding him with angry phone calls, shoving him and threatening his life.

Brian Quintana won a restraining order in Los Angeles Superior Court against the 24-year-old socialite best known for her television reality show "The Simple Life" and for a sex video that showed up on the Internet.

Quintana, who claims to have introduced Hilton to her current boyfriend, Greek shipping heir Stavros Niarchos, said problems began after she started dating Niarchos.

He said she accused him of trying to get Niarchos to ditch her for Niarchos' former girlfriend, starlet Mary-Kate Olsen.

Quintana, who admitted under cross-examination that he committed perjury in a court case about a decade ago, said Hilton shoved him three times and made numerous phone calls threatening his life.

Hilton was not in court. Her spokesman, Elliot Mintz, told reporters after the hearing: "I've known Paris and worked with her, and the kind of person that was described on the stand this afternoon doesn't resemble the woman that I know."

Los Angeles Superior Court Judge Tim Murphy sided with Quintana, finding that despite his history of perjury, he had provided some evidence, and Hilton had not refuted it.

Hilton's lawyer Howard Weitzman said the ruling was also a victory for Hilton because she wants nothing to do with Quintana.

"This individual is meaningless in her life, and from her perspective ... he's continued to harass her and insinuate himself into her life. And she'd like him out of it, so we offered to do that," he said.


OMG Pecker!!!! Can you believe that!!!
 

WoodPeckr

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rogerstaubach said:
Here's an equally relevant article, Pecker:
.......

OMG Pecker!!!! Can you believe that!!!
Rogie,
Ya gotta lay off that OxyContin [Limbaugh Lemming-aid]!

Besides you have far more credibility and humor, when you slink back into your more natural homie 'Deliverance Mode'.......:p

Dubya liked Deliverane too....
reminded him of college and that
secret 'skull & Boner' club he was in !!!
 

WoodPeckr

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George W. Bush is No Adolph Hitler ......

arclighter said:
Can't you find more relevant and interesting articles like Woody's Bush equals Hitler thread?
archy,
Just had to jump in on this one and bring your quote over to this thread just for you.....;)

OK have to agree with you guys on this one that George W. Bush is No Adolph Hitler

A favorite pastime among the Bush-bashing crowd is to compare our current ethically-challenged President with the madman of all madmen -- Nazi leader Adolph Hitler.

Granted, valid comparisons exist: Bush, like Hitler, believes war is the most politically-expedient means to an end. Like Hitler, Bush has built a vast police state to spy on his countrymen (and women). Hitler called it the Gestapo. Bush calls his Homeland Security.

Both men exploited political division, polarization and fear. Both appealed to the extreme right wing. Like Hitler, Bush shows signs of cracking under the strain. A report by a prominent DC psychiastrist calls the American president a "paranoid, delusional meglomaniac." They called Hitler the same thing.

But Bush falls short in key comparisons to the German leader. Hitler served in the German Army and actually experienced real combat in WWI. Hitler also liked the excitement of fighting in a war. Hitler was given the job of despatch-runner. It was a dangerous job as it involved carrying messages from regimental headquarters to the front-line. Hitler won five medals including the prestigious Iron Cross during the First World War. His commanding officer wrote: "As a dispatch-runner, he has shown cold-blooded courage and exemplary boldness. Under conditions of great peril, when all the communication lines were cut, the untiring and fearless activity of Hitler made it possible for important messages to go through". Although much decorated in the war, Hitler only reached the rank of corporal. Although Hitler's IQ was never officially measured, doctors estimated it at around 145. Bush's IQ is a state secret. If it was ever measured, the result probably disappeared along with his military records but any close study of his actions suggests it can't be much above that of the average three-minute egg.

Hitler was a hypnotic speaker with a masterful command of the language. He could motivate huge crowds with his powerful speeches.

Bush has trouble stringing enough words together to complete a simple, declarative sentence and would have trouble talking a whore into bed even if he paid in advance.

So it's both unfair and insulting to compare George W. Bush to Adolph Hitler.

But unfair to whom?


Dubya, ain't no Hitler....
he's more like a Mussolini !!!
 

WoodPeckr

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WoodPeckr

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Asterix said:
It's like deja vu all over again.

ROTFLMAO!!!

Ain't it the truth........:D


Next stop Iran....gotta
take care of my MIC base !!!
 

DATYdude

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YOu could make your point more strongly

If you didn't resort to absurd comparisons. Just the title of the article makes it clear the article is not worth reading.

Look up the word HYPERBOLE.
 

langeweile

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Woody ...Wooody what happened to you. To many nightmares..trying to fix them with cheap drugs...

The whole premise is nonsense on way too many levels for me to go in to details. i suggest you read a bit of german history..and then read your post again.
 

benn

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It's an interesting article and people are denial not to reliase that it is a possibility that US is heading down the same path
 

langeweile

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benn said:
It's an interesting article and people are denial not to reliase that it is a possibility that US is heading down the same path
Rigghhtt..so let's see. Bush is going to ban the democratic party?Disolve the congress and senate. Disolve the supreme court?
Give the NSA jurisdriction over local law enforcement? Turn the FBI in to the next Gestapo and the CIA in to the SS?
and he is going to do this within the next three years, before he will be replace with another POTUS?
Should be interesting to see that, especially once the congress turns democratic.

I am not the smartest guy here, but this statement is completely illogical and stands in complete opposition to reality.
 

maxweber

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Spring Fallacies

benn said:
It's an interesting article and people are denial not to reliase that it is a possibility that US is heading down the same path
The argument from analogy is a fallacy. More importantly, Bush's career does not the fascist prosthesis to be revealed for the vile, evil crime against humanity that it is. Whether he's a new-style son of a bitch, or merely recycles the ugliness of an earlier monster, matters little in the scheme of things.

MW
 

Truncador

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Bobzilla

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benn said:
It's an interesting article and people are denial not to reliase that it is a possibility that US is heading down the same path
Compare any two periods in history & you will find similarities. The article is just a recognition of the fact that slagging Dubya is now more popular than football (soccer to anyone outside N. America).
 
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