Iran to hold Holocaust conference
- Thread starter Topol-M
- Start date
war is peace
But: had the matter not been open for discussion, the truth would never have come out. You don't mean "discussion," you mean "doubt"; but mistakes like this is exactly how legends get started, the soil that breeds pestilential bastards like Holocaust deniers and Intelligent Design schmucks.
MW
I'm afraid I might ask you the same. Your posting is a virtual one-man bureau of misinformation.The Mugger said:
1. The postwar trial transcripts do NOT contain anything like an accurate record of the Holocaust. The entire project was highly secret, largely improvised, and chaotic. Despote testimiony from direct mitnesses and perpetrators like Rudolf Höss and Oswald Pohl, the postwar picture was confused, incorrect (especially with respect to timelines), and laden with myths like using the fat of victims to make soap. Tragically as well as criminally, this chaos eventually made it possible for the Holocaust deniers to sow "reasonable doubt." The suberb 6-hour documentary shown last week in History channel shows that the last bits of confusion are at last being corrected in the story. It was the history itself that was confused and contradictory; no longer.
But: had the matter not been open for discussion, the truth would never have come out. You don't mean "discussion," you mean "doubt"; but mistakes like this is exactly how legends get started, the soil that breeds pestilential bastards like Holocaust deniers and Intelligent Design schmucks.
No, sir. That's the Armenian genocide of 1915, which was a direct inspiration to Hitler.
A nice, high-falutin' sentiment--confuted by those "pesky things" called facts. The atrocities aganist the Palestinians are on nothing like the scale of the Holocaust, nor do the vast majority of decent Israelis support any such thing. That said, there have been quasi-genocidal crimes from the beginning, and there continue to be Israelis and Israeli politicians--Sharon, Kahane--who think the lesson of the Holocaust is "how to"..
In particular, if we think "another Holocaust" can by definition happen only to Jews. There have been other genocides; plainly, what the world is doing, intellectually and morally, hasn't sufficed. It's a small part of it, I'm sure, but playing fast and loose with the historical record is a patrt of this nonetheless.
Complete and utter rubbish. "The truth is rarely plain, and never simple."
MW
"Quasi-genocidal" You mean like the "Jenin" massacre? You have a quasi-intellect.maxweber said:
'Israeli politicians--Sharon, Kahane--who think the lesson of the Holocaust is "how to".." You are like a broken record. How many more times do I have to tell you that if the Israelis wanted to rid the world of the Palestinians, they have the military capability to get the job done rather quickly. The continued existence of the Palestinians makes a mockery of your statement.
You have your doubts about the court historian's "version" of the Holocaust (of course you don't flat out deny the Holocaust you are just a little suspicious), but are certain that ID proponents are “schmucks”.maxweber said:
Bullshit . . the whole world would get rid of them so quickly that they wish they had never left their homelands to go to this waste land!arclighter said:
After all the only real friend Israel has in the world is the elite because half of them are Zionist and the other half are either corrupted by one or fatefully awaiting the Armageddon . . . "God wishes it!" so they say all !!!
MW claimed the Israelis were genocidal - "That said, there have been quasi-genocidal crimes from the beginning, and there continue to be Israelis and Israeli politicians--Sharon, Kahane--who think the lesson of the Holocaust is "how to".."cyrus said:
I pointed out the absurdity of this claim, which means I do not think the Israelis are genocidal.
I I had to guess, I would say your response bolsters the notion that the Israelis aren't genocidal? Although it is really hard to decipher. Perhaps some of the other anti-Semites on the board could lend you a hand with your response. Come on guys, what do you say?
There is a lot of misinformation in the world. Given that there are people on this very board that take concepts like creationism and intelligent design seriously, I don’t see why finding out that others take the claims of Holocaust deniers seriously is any big surprise. Some want to rewrite biology and others what to rewrite history. It is sad that there are so many uninformed people in the world, but it is also a fact of life.
You said it brother. There are even some idiots on this board that believe that the Law of Conservation of Mass can be violated! They further believe that this violation happened through a "natural" process. What a bunch of morons!
Given that they tend to have the misfortune of having a Jesusland education, it is understandable. Religious fundamentalism is religious fundamentalism regardless of the religion. (Although to be fair, holocaust denial likely has little to do with religion).
Anyway, I take it arc is still reading creation magazine.
Anyway, I take it arc is still reading creation magazine.
There is a scientific law called the Law of Conservation of Mass, discovered by Antoine Lavoisier in 1785. In its most compact form, it states:arclighter said:
matter is neither created nor destroyed.
In 1842, Julius Robert Mayer discovered the Law of Conservation of Energy. In its most compact form, it it now called the First Law of Thermodynamics:
energy is neither created nor destroyed.
In 1907 (I think), Albert Einstein announced his discovery of the equation E = mc2 and, as a consequence, the two laws above were merged into the Law of Conservation of Mass-Energy:
the total amount of mass and energy in the universe is constant.
Iran holding a confrence on the Holocost is like the french holding a week long BBQ and Chili cook-off.
Atleast there could come some understanding from thatscouser1 said:or Israel holding a conference on peace and tolerance
oh there is already an understanding it goes something like this we have the most tanks and fighter jets so what we say is right and well if you disagree with us obviously you are an anti Semite,neo- Nazi, Al Qaeda/Hamas loverpapasmerf said:
Israel, the Holocaust, and Anti-Semitism
Noam Chomsky
Excerpted from Chronicles of Dissent, 1992
http://www.chomsky.info/books/dissent01.htm
.....
QUESTION: What dimension does the Holocaust play in this equation? Is it manipulated by the Israeli state to promote its own interests?
CHOMSKY: It's very consciously manipulated. I mean, it's quite certainly real, there's no question about that, but it is also undoubted that they manipulate it. In fact, they say so. For example, in the Jerusalem Post, in English so you can read it, their Washington correspondent Wolf Blitzer, I don't recall the exact date, but after one of the big Holocaust memorial meetings in Washington he wrote an article in the Jerusalem Post in which he said it was a great success. He said, "Nobody mentioned arms sales to the Arabs but all the Congressmen understood that that was the hidden message. So we got it across." In fact, one very conservative and very honest Zionist leader, Nachem Goldman, who was the President of the World Zionist Organization and who was detested towards the end because he was much too honest -- they even refused to send a delegation to his burial, I believe, or a message. He's one of the founders of the Jewish state and the Zionist movement and one of the elder statesmen, a very honest man, he -- just before his death in 1982 or so -- made a rather eloquent and unusual statement in which he said that it's -- he used the Hebrew word for "sacrilege" -- he said it's sacrilege to use the Holocaust as a justification for oppressing others. He was referring to something very real: exploitation of probably the world's most horrifying atrocity in order to justify oppression of others. That kind of manipulation is really sick.
QUESTION: That disturbs you and...
CHOMSKY: Really sick. Many people find it deeply immoral but most people are afraid to say anything about it. Nachem Goldman is one of the few who was able to say anything about it and it was one of the reasons he was hated. Anyone who tries to say anything about it is going to be subjected to a very efficient defamation campaign of the sort that would have made the old Communist Party open-mouthed in awe, people don't talk about it.
QUESTION: I ask you this question because I know that you have been plagued and hounded around the United States specifically on this issue of the Holocaust. It's been said that Noam Chomsky is somehow agnostic on the issue of whether the Holocaust occurred or not.
CHOMSKY: My "agnosticism" is in print. I described the Holocaust years ago as the most fantastic outburst of insanity in human history, so much so that if we even agree to discuss the matter we demean ourselves. Those statements and numerous others like them are in print, but they're basically irrelevant because you have to understand that this is part of a Stalinist-style technique to silence critics of the holy state and therefore the truth is entirely irrelevant, you just tell as many lies as you can and hope that some of the mud will stick. It's a standard technique used by the Stalinist parties, by the Nazis and by these guys.
.....
This is an old article but clearly still relevant , and so true
Noam Chomsky
Excerpted from Chronicles of Dissent, 1992
http://www.chomsky.info/books/dissent01.htm
.....
QUESTION: What dimension does the Holocaust play in this equation? Is it manipulated by the Israeli state to promote its own interests?
CHOMSKY: It's very consciously manipulated. I mean, it's quite certainly real, there's no question about that, but it is also undoubted that they manipulate it. In fact, they say so. For example, in the Jerusalem Post, in English so you can read it, their Washington correspondent Wolf Blitzer, I don't recall the exact date, but after one of the big Holocaust memorial meetings in Washington he wrote an article in the Jerusalem Post in which he said it was a great success. He said, "Nobody mentioned arms sales to the Arabs but all the Congressmen understood that that was the hidden message. So we got it across." In fact, one very conservative and very honest Zionist leader, Nachem Goldman, who was the President of the World Zionist Organization and who was detested towards the end because he was much too honest -- they even refused to send a delegation to his burial, I believe, or a message. He's one of the founders of the Jewish state and the Zionist movement and one of the elder statesmen, a very honest man, he -- just before his death in 1982 or so -- made a rather eloquent and unusual statement in which he said that it's -- he used the Hebrew word for "sacrilege" -- he said it's sacrilege to use the Holocaust as a justification for oppressing others. He was referring to something very real: exploitation of probably the world's most horrifying atrocity in order to justify oppression of others. That kind of manipulation is really sick.
QUESTION: That disturbs you and...
CHOMSKY: Really sick. Many people find it deeply immoral but most people are afraid to say anything about it. Nachem Goldman is one of the few who was able to say anything about it and it was one of the reasons he was hated. Anyone who tries to say anything about it is going to be subjected to a very efficient defamation campaign of the sort that would have made the old Communist Party open-mouthed in awe, people don't talk about it.
QUESTION: I ask you this question because I know that you have been plagued and hounded around the United States specifically on this issue of the Holocaust. It's been said that Noam Chomsky is somehow agnostic on the issue of whether the Holocaust occurred or not.
CHOMSKY: My "agnosticism" is in print. I described the Holocaust years ago as the most fantastic outburst of insanity in human history, so much so that if we even agree to discuss the matter we demean ourselves. Those statements and numerous others like them are in print, but they're basically irrelevant because you have to understand that this is part of a Stalinist-style technique to silence critics of the holy state and therefore the truth is entirely irrelevant, you just tell as many lies as you can and hope that some of the mud will stick. It's a standard technique used by the Stalinist parties, by the Nazis and by these guys.
.....
This is an old article but clearly still relevant , and so true
Didn't Chomsky write the forward for a Holocaust Denial book by a widely discredited French "Academic" and then start to flip flop when it got out? He is also know as a personal friend of another French Holocaust denier. Sounds like he should reserve a seat in Terhan.
