Green Party vs. NDP: policies, platforms ????

LeatherDoll

More Than U Want Me to Be
I know there are some big time party supporters in the group. I would like you to please explain, if you can:
  • What distinguishes the Green Party from the NDP?
  • What makes them so different that it is necessary to declare themselves independent parties - and risking splitting an important swing vote?
 

Goober Mcfly

Retired. -ish
Oct 26, 2001
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Just a guess, but the environment is #1 to the Green party, while protecting unions/extreme spending/talking annoyingly-with-your-hands-while-keeping-your-elbows-against-your-body is the NDP's primary goal.

</still annoyed with that from last night>
 

mr. x

Member
Aug 17, 2001
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an interestin article in todays globe by murray dobbin, saying that the green party is closer to the old PCs in many ways - the leader is a former pc!

the ndp has close ties to unions - unions are guarranteed representation on the party executive and delegates at conventions. the ndp has been made up of a number of people from various lefty interest groups - labour, environment, womens advocates, social workers and non-profits, etc.

the green party is supposed to be an enviroment first party - go to their website at http://www.greenparty.ca/ to look at their platform.
 

tompeepin

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Winston said:
For one, the NDP are "in bed" with the unions, and unions are not pro environment. The NDP are socialists, the Green is more libertarian/anarchist. The NDP belives in big government, the Greens tend to believe in little government.
Good points.

The Green party seeks balanced budgets and are fiscally conservative.

The NDP want to spend spend spend.

Hopefully the Greens will do to the NDP what the Reform/Alliance did to the PC.
 

Goober Mcfly

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Oct 26, 2001
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tompeepin said:
The NDP want to spend spend spend.
...and talking annoyingly-with-your-hands-while-keeping-your-elbows-against-your-body.

</repeating myself>
 

tompeepin

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Goober Mcfly said:
...and talking annoyingly-with-your-hands-while-keeping-your-elbows-against-your-body.

</repeating myself>
Oh come on Goobie, Layton was almost as entertaining as Gilles Duceppe.

It would be too funny if with seat splitting the Bloc would form a minority Canadian government. :D
 

LeatherDoll

More Than U Want Me to Be
Thank you

Thanx boys. I now have a very clear picture - and all I wanted to know.

I will, in my good judgement, refuse to actually respond to some of the commentary on the NDP, which are not necessarily reflective. In general, the descriptions were sufficient (and close enough) to more than adequately answer my question.

Well Done! (Spankings for all of you!)
 

tompeepin

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Re: Thank you

LeatherDoll said:
I will, in my good judgement, refuse to actually respond to some of the commentary on the NDP, which are not necessarily reflective.
That is what you always say! :p Can we bait you? Did we malign your poor dear Socialist union interest driven NDP?

The NDP is to Unions what the Conservatives are for Big Corporations and the Liberals for their cronies!
 

Goober Mcfly

Retired. -ish
Oct 26, 2001
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tompeepin said:
It would be too funny if with seat splitting the Bloc would form a minority Canadian government. :D
Would be funny, but it won't happen.

There are 308 seats, and if all the 75 Quebec ridings are won by the Bloc, that would leave 233 seats. If all the rest of the major parties (NDP, Liberal and Conservative) split those seats, two will end up with 78 and one with 77.

The Bloc could be king-maker in a minority gov't. Nothing more.
 

Keebler Elf

The Original Elf
Aug 31, 2001
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Winston said:
As a Tory, I will comment that there are significant differences between the NDP and the Green Party.
Uhh, shouldn't we let someone from the NDP or Green Party speak for themselves? I mean, you're a self-confessed Tory. It's not like we're going to get the straight goods from you...
 

tompeepin

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Goober Mcfly said:
Would be funny, but it won't happen.

There are 308 seats, and if all the 75 Quebec ridings are won by the Bloc, that would leave 233 seats. If all the rest of the major parties (NDP, Liberal and Conservative) split those seats, two will end up with 78 and one with 77.

The Bloc could be king-maker in a minority gov't. Nothing more.
But what if the Greens started getting seats too? People dismissed the Reform party at first also. Strange things can happen ...

Come on LeatherDoll ... come out and play ... after all you started it.
 

happygrump

Once more into the breach
May 21, 2004
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Even the Conservatives - I don't call them Tories, because they're not - don't have as hard line of a right-wing fiscal agenda as the Greens, IMHO.

But does anyone know how closely tied the Canadian Greens are with their European counterparts?
 

LeatherDoll

More Than U Want Me to Be
Not really ...

You know I'm not really one to be baited Tom.

That being said .... I don't think you maligned the NDP, I just think your assertion that they are all union and only union is far too limiting a description. In fact, Winston is correct (sometimes even Tories get it right!), they are more socialist and government oriented - as in social service/safety net/health programmes, human rights and labour protection issues, and corporate regulating. These are not necessarily things that unions support in all circumstances. Further, the NDP are also strongly oriented to public consultation and participation in policy development - far more voices and positions than just unions.

As a quick example, I cite the Employment Equity Act (now defunct thanks to Harris). Without going into the pros and cons of such a policy - it was quite intrusive into traditional and standard hiring, promotion, and retention practices. This is in direct conflict with Union positioning, yet the Act was still enacted and implementation had begun in ernest while they were still in their very short reign in Ontario.

I don't deny that their historical foundations may have been more directly associated with only unions, but that is clearly no longer their only focus or support base.

Keebler - ordinarily I would agree with you about voice appropriation, but Winston's answer was clear and concise. The question was about their differences, not their actual policies - which he properly identified fairly accurately without inflammatory detail.

I may have started it Tom, but my question has been answered to my satisfaction. This thread is done as far as I'm concerned.

Would you like to start a new thread discussing party policies in general? Its a pretty big can of worms, Pandora.
 

tompeepin

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Re: Not really ...

LeatherDoll said:
You know I'm not really one to be baited Tom.

... they are more socialist and government oriented

... labour protection issues, and corporate regulating.

... far more voices and positions than just unions.

I don't deny that their historical foundations may have been more directly associated with only unions ...

I may have started it Tom, but my question has been answered to my satisfaction. This thread is done as far as I'm concerned.

Would you like to start a new thread discussion party policies in general?
I am the Master...baiter!

Oh come on leatherbaby! Don't be so serious!

Again as you say UNIONS!!! All about UNIONS. with tax tax tax and BIG government.

We can all run up credit, but someday it's gotta be paid for. And also grass root solutions with small governmnet is the way to go IMHO.

And no I want to use this thread to do that! ;)
 

johnhenrygalt

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It would be too funny if with seat splitting the Bloc would form a minority Canadian government.
Keep in mind that there is no rule, law or convention that the party with the most seats forms the government. In the British Parliamentary tradition, following an election, the Prime Minister may resign or may choose to face the House of Commons. Thus even if the Conservatives win more seats than the Liberals, but there is no majority, Paul Martin can remain Prime Minister if the House does not vote non-confidence.

If the Prime Minister resigns, the governor general typically asks the leader of the party with the most seats to form a government. However, if all of the other parties have expressed their intention to defeat such government at the first opportunity, she will typically search for someone else who can hold the confidence of the House. If no party leader fits the bill, a compromise candidate may be selected. In Canada we have never had to resort to such a compromise candidate.

Moreover, if non-confidence is voted, new elections do not necessarily follow. If the opposition parties voting non-confidence have made it clear that one of their number enjoys the confidence of the House, he may be asked to form a government without new elections.

Even if the BQ got the most seats, the Governor General (a Chrétien appointee) would never ask Gilles Duceppe to form a government. And if it's close between the Liberals and Conservatives, she may not do Paul Martin's bidding. She may actually have to do something to earn the salary she's been paid over the years.
 

tompeepin

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johnhenrygalt said:
if the House does not vote non-confidence.
Votes of non-confidence and new elections have been the way in the past. Besides JohnnyH it was just mentioned as a joke. ;)
 

LeatherDoll

More Than U Want Me to Be
Re: Re: Not really ...

Originally posted by tompeepin ...

Oh come on leatherbaby! Don't be so serious!
Don't be ridiculous, you know I am a feminist, and we have NO sense of humour!

... and DON"T call me "baby"

** "Why does that sound so familiar?"
LeatherDoll leaves the thread, shaking her head in disgust: "It's just NOT funny!" **
 

tompeepin

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Re: Re: Re: Not really ...

LeatherDoll said:
Don't be ridiculous, you know I am a feminist, and we have NO sense of humour!
:D See you do! ;-)
 
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