Girls' menu?

[legmann]

Guys, I've said this before...but maybe it's been lost...as hobbyists, we're responsible for at least 50% of our own enjoyment. Just like how it is on the massage side, if you go into a session with a SP with high expectations, you're setting yourself up for disappointment. If all you're looking for is a simple suck and fuck, then that's all you're gonna get. However, if you go in with low expectations, treat the lady with respect and let her body tell you what she likes and doesn't like, you'll go a long way to achieving your 50% if the enjoyment, and she'll handle the rest. All this talk of menus...sheesh, the ladies are not chopped liver being served for dinner! They are human beings, with thoughts and feelings. Treat them well, and they'll reciprocate!

That's all good and fine, but I think what is being discussed here is (explicit) knowledge of 'special' services (wink wink) that may or may not be available, uncontested and non-negotiable by the SP.

We already know that the general success of any session is up to both parties. But no matter how 'nice' you are, there are certain services that are not going to be on offer, ever.

 

[Goober Mcfly]

We've had it good for too long. Remember when there were no pictures, no websites, no reviews? You dialed up the number from the yellow pages and got a physical description of the lady from the booker. Then the lady arrived and was almost, but not completely, unlike what you pictured her as.

And you had no idea what you were getting because nobody discussed menus.

Don't get pissed at the ladies. Don't fuck them over for their fee - if you're booking in good faith, follow through. Remember, they're not discussing menu items for your protection, you dweebs.

 

[rhuarc29]

But what if that girl has 3 guys like that in 1 day? What if the menu demands are unsafe or above her previously stated mileage? That's extremely unfair to the lady.

This whole situation is extremely unfair to everyone involved. Walking away with the money really puts the lady out, but forking over the full $250 for unexpectedly lacking service is unfair to the client as well. There's no win here. It sets up situations where violent clients will get angry, and even non-violent clients may become disgruntled. Doesn't sound like a safe working environment to me. On the flip side, I'm sure the lady will also get tired of hearing "you do X, right?"

 

[MPAsquared]

Yes..YMMV was always there...
So was our right to walk...Before we hand over anything based on look, location or atmosphere (smoke filled room...messy...her obviously under the influence)

Why is it now bad form to walk if we are not pleased at the menu??( and I'm not talking about the dangerous shit i.e BBFS or something she has not offered before)

Certain guys want certain menu items.... no secret there thats why we contacted them in the first place!
Now.... no menu is available so we dont know if she has expanded or contracted her service level...and as I stated before in another thread
with the amount of money I drop on a session I'll be damned if I'm gonna get burned...AGAIN!

Hence, reviews. Pretty simple solution.

You aren't talking about smokey rooms. You are talking about menu's. I'm positive there are some agencies or indy's or BP girls that haven't adjusted a thing re: c-36...go see them. you can't have it both ways either law-compliant or not. Encouraging booking & walking is brutal. The entire mp biz is even more ymmv than escort-ville.....if you booked & walked, we wouldn't take your booking again. same price point. You are booking something that includes certain things. That is what you pay for. Added mileage is called ymmv for a reason...its not a sure thing or priced. For a terb member to say walk because there is no info is tacky, false, and unfair to the worker!!

Do your research. Don't waste people's time or fuck with their livelihood. That is not cool.

Guys having deal breaker tantrums need to chill. The ladies are being more discreet for good reasons.

Right!

Not unless they're selling something other than haircuts and dentures.

Who says anything about selling a chess partner. Come on, discretion doesn't equal stupidity. Again, book someone who isn't discreet then.

We've had it good for too long. Remember when there were no pictures, no websites, no reviews? You dialed up the number from the yellow pages and got a physical description of the lady from the booker. Then the lady arrived and was almost, but not completely, unlike what you pictured her as.

And you had no idea what you were getting because nobody discussed menus.

Don't get pissed at the ladies. Don't fuck them over for their fee - if you're booking in good faith, follow through. Remember, they're not discussing menu items for your protection, you dweebs.

This!

This whole situation is extremely unfair to everyone involved. Walking away with the money really puts the lady out, but forking over the full $250 for unexpectedly lacking service is unfair to the client as well. There's no win here. It sets up situations where violent clients will get angry, and even non-violent clients may become disgruntled. Doesn't sound like a safe working environment to me. On the flip side, I'm sure the lady will also get tired of hearing "you do X, right?"

This is a great argument to echo the bedford decision. An example of how criminalizing the client & communication puts the worker in more harms way.

 

[drstrangelove]

For me, kissing is an important component of an interaction with a SP. I've declined to meet with at least 3 otherwise good candidates for an encounter when they informed me kissing was not on the menu. I think my hobbying days will be quite limited now that I can't get this basic information up front.

 

[thumper18474]

Hence, reviews. Pretty simple solution.

You aren't talking about smokey rooms. You are talking about menu's. I'm positive there are some agencies or indy's or BP girls that haven't adjusted a thing re: c-36...go see them. you can't have it both ways either law-compliant or not. Encouraging booking & walking is brutal. The entire mp biz is even more ymmv than escort-ville.....if you booked & walked, we wouldn't take your booking again. same price point. You are booking something that includes certain things. That is what you pay for. Added mileage is called ymmv for a reason...its not a sure thing or priced. For a terb member to say walk because there is no info is tacky, false, and unfair to the worker!!

Do your research. Don't waste people's time or fuck with their livelihood. That is not cool.

Jesus Christ did you even read my post
All along its been walk if you thought the pics were fake
didnt meet your espectation when she opened the door
Room stunk or she stunk....its been posted here a thousand fucking times in Reviews about why a guy walked AFTER he had handed over the donation!!
But in the past we could always find out ahead of time what the menu was and decide then and there if we wanted to venture out
NOW almost every ad has removed that safety valve for us.
Yes we rely on reviews ....Yes we rely on the fellow pooners that we know
But its the TOFTT types that we have no intel on
THOSE are the ones we are talking about
And THOSE are the ones that this issue is about

As far as booking and ...this so called cheating them out of their fee??
Well excuse me apparently its OK to FUCK the clients out of their money?
Interesting slant if i do say so myself
Agreed this new law is Gonna FUCK someone...I guess we all have to decide who is gonna be the Fucker....and the Fuckee

 

[MPAsquared]

For me, kissing is an important component of an interaction with a SP. I've declined to meet with at least 3 otherwise good candidates for an encounter when they informed me kissing was not on the menu. I think my hobbying days will be quite limited now that I can't get this basic information up front.

Hence, reviews.

Hence, reviews. Pretty simple solution.

You aren't talking about smokey rooms. You are talking about menu's. I'm positive there are some agencies or indy's or BP girls that haven't adjusted a thing re: c-36...go see them. you can't have it both ways either law-compliant or not. Encouraging booking & walking is brutal. The entire mp biz is even more ymmv than escort-ville.....if you booked & walked, we wouldn't take your booking again. same price point. You are booking something that includes certain things. That is what you pay for. Added mileage is called ymmv for a reason...its not a sure thing or priced. For a terb member to say walk because there is no info is tacky, false, and unfair to the worker!!

Do your research. Don't waste people's time or fuck with their livelihood. That is not cool.

Jesus Christ did you even read my post
All along its been walk if you thought the pics were fake
didnt meet your espectation when she opened the door
Room stunk or she stunk....its been posted here a thousand fucking times in Reviews about why a guy walked AFTER he had handed over the donation!!
But in the past we could always find out ahead of time what the menu was and decide then and there if we wanted to venture out
NOW almost every ad has removed that safety valve for us.
Yes we rely on reviews ....Yes we rely on the fellow pooners that we know
But its the TOFTT types that we have no intel on
THOSE are the ones we are talking about
And THOSE are the ones that this issue is about

As far as booking and ...this so called cheating them out of their fee??
Well excuse me apparently its OK to FUCK the clients out of their money?
Interesting slant if i do say so myself
Agreed this new law is Gonna FUCK someone...I guess we all have to decide who is gonna be the Fucker....and the Fuckee

First of all why the fuck are you cursing at me??? Have some class.

2nd this thread is about MENU's! Not B&S. Not hygiene or being fucked around.

3rd, tofft has always been a risk. Do the community good & review if you choose to tofft.

4th, most guys are laying low or only seeing regs. So not that much tofft is happening.

5th, reviews & review.

Problem solved.


Now, if I was an sp & u swore at me like that, I'd cancel the damn session myself! Manners go a long way Sir.

And lastly, if you want a menu, see a girl who still freely posts/advertises/discusses menus.

 

[DB123]

For me, kissing is an important component of an interaction with a SP. I've declined to meet with at least 3 otherwise good candidates for an encounter when they informed me kissing was not on the menu. I think my hobbying days will be quite limited now that I can't get this basic information up front.

I've wondered that...I can't imagine why kissing would be a prohibited sexual act

 

[Goober Mcfly]

Jesus Christ did you even read my post
All along its been walk if you thought the pics were fake
didnt meet your espectation when she opened the door
Room stunk or she stunk....its been posted here a thousand fucking times in Reviews about why a guy walked AFTER he had handed over the donation!!

All these remain acceptable reasons to bail.

But in the past we could always find out ahead of time what the menu was and decide then and there if we wanted to venture out
NOW almost every ad has removed that safety valve for us.
Yes we rely on reviews ....Yes we rely on the fellow pooners that we know
But its the TOFTT types that we have no intel on
THOSE are the ones we are talking about
And THOSE are the ones that this issue is about

Go out to all TOFTT with low expectations. If that's what you get, well such is life. If you get more, awesome for you!

This is a completely different climate we're now in. It's not the ladies' fault. It's not fair to penalize them. If you want to be mad, be mad at the government for putting these laws in place.

Like I wrote earlier, I don't think there's much risk to the lady to say she does such-and-such and what-not, because what she is doing is completely legal. But when you ask - you're breaking the law, technically.

As far as booking and ...this so called cheating them out of their fee??

Technically, no. No services rendered, no fee payable. But it's not gentlemanly.

Well excuse me apparently its OK to FUCK the clients out of their money?

No, if there's genuine fraud/fake pics/etc., feel free to walk. If you book a lady and she says that, really, sorry, she doesn't like to do bbbj- be a man and don't run off like a spoiled brat.

Interesting slant if i do say so myself
Agreed this new law is Gonna FUCK someone...I guess we all have to decide who is gonna be the Fucker....and the Fuckee

Know who the fucker, and who the fuckee is? Harper and us, respectively.

Tender your outrage accordingly.

 

[kort]

It's a real problem - no menus. I will definitely be sticking to sps where I remember menus for the most part. Reviews are great but they are always much more YMMV than a menu. Menus offer a better "base line" of what to expect. Reviews always struck me as more situational. That's not even taking into account reviewers that are super vague, that lie or embelish or straight up shill.

Also, how many reviews are there going to be? I know that part of my adjustment to c-36 is that I'm going to stop reviewing because I don't want to leave a written account of my activities.

The people that come up with a way to communicate a menu in the current environment are going to do very well. At the very least a way to communicate what used to be known as PSE versus GFE services.

My best advice is to stick with known service stars. That's really not a solution for when the current generation of high level providers move on though...

 

[MPAsquared]

It's a real problem - no menus. I will definitely be sticking to sps where I remember menus for the most part. Reviews are great but they are always much more YMMV than a menu. Menus offer a better "base line" of what to expect. Reviews always struck me as more situational. That's not even taking into account reviewers that are super vague, that lie or embelish or straight up shill.

Also, how many reviews are there going to be? I know that part of my adjustment to c-36 is that I'm going to stop reviewing because I don't want to leave a written account of my activities.

The people that come up with a way to communicate a menu in the current environment are going to do very well. At the very least a way to communicate what used to be known as PSE versus GFE services.

My best advice is to stick with known service stars. That's really not a solution for when the current generation of high level providers move on though...

That's why it's critical for everyone to review. So that consistency & such can be established.

 

[Born2Star]

One of the most important features that made hobbying great was knowing what you were getting....

Well you can call me anything you want but I actually think one of the most important features that made hobbying great is NOT knowing what you gonna get

;-)

 

[Smallcock]

Hence, reviews.

There may be fewer reviews to go around. We're the source of reviews. If we're seeing less girls or none at all, the quantity of reviews will decline. Maybe the quality, too.

The law is unfair to everybody. Nobody is trashing the working girls over this.

But the reality is that the only adapting agencies and spas have done is change words, descriptors, and other important but relatively easy things that protect THEM as well as clients.

The other significant adjustment would naturally be price. A fair compromise in a radically different environment. Do you think it's fair for clients to continue seeing girls and paying the same rate in an environment that is increasingly hostile toward clients (i.e. makes them criminals)?

I won't pay the same rates with the same consistency. As somebody else said earlier, I'll lower my expectations when providers lower their rates. I'll spend $100 on two encounters where I have greater chance at success than $250 on one encounter. It's like investing, one should never put too many eggs in too few baskets.

 

[Smallcock]

We've had it good for too long. Remember when there were no pictures, no websites, no reviews? You dialed up the number from the yellow pages and got a physical description of the lady from the booker. Then the lady arrived and was almost, but not completely, unlike what you pictured her as.

And you had no idea what you were getting because nobody discussed menus.[/B]

We've lived through the Dark Ages. There is no need to return to it but that is what the law is forcing us to do.

Granted I was too young and lacked money in the Dark Ages. Even if I had funds, I would not have hobbied to the same extent when the only way to book a woman was through a newspaper ad. I probably wouldn't have entered hobbying at all. It's the convenience, efficiency, and anonymity of the internet that lured me in.

 

[MPAsquared]

There may be fewer reviews to go around. We're the source of reviews. If we're seeing less girls or none at all, the quantity of reviews will decline. Maybe the quality, too.

The law is unfair to everybody. Nobody is trashing the working girls over this.

But the reality is that the only adapting agencies and spas have done is change words, descriptors, and other important but relatively easy things that protect THEM as well as clients.

The other significant adjustment would naturally be price. A fair compromise in a radically different environment. Do you think it's fair for clients to continue seeing girls and paying the same rate in an environment that is increasingly hostile toward clients (i.e. makes them criminals)?

I won't pay the same rates with the same consistency. As somebody else said earlier, I'll lower my expectations when providers lower their rates. I'll spend $100 on two encounters where I have greater chance at success than $250 on one encounter. It's like investing, one should never put too many eggs in too few baskets.

Lol. If you are seeing providers in environments that are putting the clients safety 1st or 2nd, that is hardly a hostile environment! Lol!!

Also, the ladies are seeing less clients too my friend. So how is it fair to have your income slashed in half, then have dudes book you & leave?? Sorry honey but prices should not go down at all.

 

[Smallcock]

Also, the ladies are seeing less clients too my friend. So how is it fair to have your income slashed in half, then have dudes book you & leave??

When the fisheries on the east coast were unable to catch enough fish to support the fishing industry, the fishermen had to find new jobs to earn a living.

If I lose my job tomorrow and lose 100% of my income can I cry on your shoulders and tell you how unfair it is?

If you're unsatisfied with the money you're making, find employment elsewhere doing something that makes more money for you.

The government has undone what was a really good thing for all.

 

[MPAsquared]

When the fisheries on the east coast were unable to catch enough fish to support the fishing industry, the fishermen had to find new jobs to earn a living.

If I lose my job tomorrow and lose 100% of my income can I cry on your shoulders and tell you how unfair it is?

If you're unsatisfied with the money you're making, find employment elsewhere doing something that makes more money for you.

The government has undone what was a really good thing for all.

Geeze. You aren't getting it. This thread is about girls menu's. Not job loss.

And I'm not a sex worker anymore so it's not about the income I make thanks.

All I'm saying is, you can choose..... a worker with a menu & cop risk....or no menu & peace of mind.

Post reviews. Lurkers should be much less tolerated under this new landscape. Consistency of reviews will be key to establishing menu's.

 

[lakebear]

It is anew game now. New wording may develop?

 

[Jasmine Raine]

Jesus Christ did you even read my post
All along its been walk if you thought the pics were fake
didnt meet your espectation when she opened the door
Room stunk or she stunk....its been posted here a thousand fucking times in Reviews about why a guy walked AFTER he had handed over the donation!!
But in the past we could always find out ahead of time what the menu was and decide then and there if we wanted to venture out
NOW almost every ad has removed that safety valve for us.
Yes we rely on reviews ....Yes we rely on the fellow pooners that we know
But its the TOFTT types that we have no intel on
THOSE are the ones we are talking about
And THOSE are the ones that this issue is about

As far as booking and ...this so called cheating them out of their fee??
Well excuse me apparently its OK to FUCK the clients out of their money?
Interesting slant if i do say so myself
Agreed this new law is Gonna FUCK someone...I guess we all have to decide who is gonna be the Fucker....and the Fuckee

You and I were in a thread similar to this in the Durham section. I think you could tell from my post by me that I feel, like others, this whole new law sucks and not the good kind of sucking. I am sorry that clients and SP's alike are entering a new world of risks and all of us are feeling limited by it. I think going forward we, as in both companion/agency/spa and client, need to stop this rift that keeps tearing our sides further and further apart.

We know that menu's have been taken offline. Professional companions and agencies, or at least myself, are not trying to deceive or rip you off of your money. The reason that they/me are professional is because we are not trying to rip you off but instead trying to ensure you good value for your investment. I would be extremely upset if a client showed up looking for "menu" service that I don't provide and left wasting my time, just as much as you would like to show up to a companion's place and find out your deal breakers are not actually offered. We as a community need to come up with away to avoid this.

The way I think we do this is by communication and that means reviews. They don't have to be public at all. Private communication with other like-minded hobbyists will be key for you and other clients going forward. There really is not much that a lady or agency can do about this change in the law regarding public advertising. Not if we want to try and protect you from the law that criminalizes you. I can very well tell any clients that writes me, what my menu services are. That is not a problem for me. I will not get arrested if that info got found with you. However, I don't want to be the cause of your possible arrest, so I will not discuss those with you. It is not for me, it is for you.

Now I think from all I have read about you personally, finding ladies to match yourself up with will not be a problem. You are known, you review, you research, this is clear. You will do your due diligence before seeing a new companion. This does not negate your point, but I don't like seeing everyone getting all up in arms here and I think you are speaking more about the general aspects of the hobby and this new law, not necessarily how it will directly effect you because you are smart, discreet, and a gentlemen. I am quite sure that while you communicate with that new possible TOFTT, sharing a good amount of time conversing before meeting on likes and dislikes that range in topics from books to movies to food to sex, when speaking in a personal capacity, will get you the info you are looking for. However, I would not recommend sending a same day text request to an unknown BP girl asking if she is DFK and BBBJ friendly. LOL I said it in that thread - I am partially happy for this bill because gentlemen like yourself will be forced to communicate and research more and hopefully int he long run, that will lead to fewer misses and more hits with great providers. Communicating more with each other will assist greatly with the now no menu advertising.

I know for me, as I said, I do not want a client to show up looking for some service that is a deal breaker like {only hypothetically speaking here} PSE/GREEK and then after asking 2 mins into the door, leaving because I said no. There has to be some onus on the client to do some research on the companion before booking. I will be doing the same in my screening of new clients. Just as you fear that ladies will use this no menu as a money trap for guys, we have fears that the no menu issue will be a service trap for some of us ladies. That PSE/GREEK client can book 2 hours of my time, show up find out I don't offer that, not pay a cancellation fee, threaten to negatively review me, etc. The threat of negative reviews will be jumping through the roof because of this as well and that is something none of us have been discussing either. You have to remember, not every client is a good guy like you, just like I understand not every companion is a professional as others. We both have new issues to address and we should be trying to that together, not apart. We do it apart and Harper and Mackay win.

As a provider I can SELL sex. What I can't do is publicly advertise menu. Auto Reply emails will take care of that for all us. Come on ladies, think outside the box and learn how to run your business.

email me, and see how I have managed my business. Time for all to know what they can do.

yournsagfe@gmail.com

I guess that might work for some but I don't see how you are helping to protect your clients with this. Auto-replies that can get sent to ANYONE who contacts you without any screening to at least ensure it is not LE is not, in my humble opinion, the safety route for your clients.

It is rather insulting to be told to think outside of the box and learn how to run my business because that is exactly what I have done. I haven't even taken my first client yet I have spent a boat load of time and money learning how to navigate around this new law and the lawyers I have paid and met with have told me differently. Maybe you would like to share what your lawyers have told you when you met with them, or not.

However, to each their own. There are many ladies who have figured out ways to ensure that clients are in the "know" before they walk in that would be considered safer and much more discreet.

It is anew game now. New wording may develop?

I do not think that new terms will be helpful as they have the same meaning just a different title. As well, from my understanding, the introduction of terms like GFE/PSE created their own headaches as there was not one definition for all. GFE was then safe, true, full. PSE was before GREEK, CIMWS, FF. As time went on if a lady did GREEK once a year she listed herself as PSE. So I think new terms will help. I think this is not a one step fix but a mutli step solution. Discreet communication with companions and hobbyists alike, among trusted and creditable members and proven professionals will be the key. If we can all get past the fighting that is.

When the fisheries on the east coast were unable to catch enough fish to support the fishing industry, the fishermen had to find new jobs to earn a living.

If I lose my job tomorrow and lose 100% of my income can I cry on your shoulders and tell you how unfair it is?

If you're unsatisfied with the money you're making, find employment elsewhere doing something that makes more money for you.

The government has undone what was a really good thing for all.

These types of attitudes and opinions do not help the discussion. Your attempt at throwing bottom of barrel "realities" in a passive/aggressive manner to "win" the debate will not get you menu's listed or even lower prices. I know many hoped this law would bring down prices and I think those who search for those lower rates are going to get burned faster.

I understand your frustration regarding this new law, but if it is all about throwing realities to simply "win" the debate, a bitch/asshole can come up and tell you - TOO bad so sad, use your hand. Because you know, if you can't pay for sex openly anymore and will be criminal if you do, then either find free sex somewhere else, or use your hand. Right?

Ya, I agree, not very nice. So let's please try to come up with better ways together instead of being jerks to each other.

 

[doggystyle99]

I would stay away from any SP who communicates through text or emails and will only book SP's that communicate through phone calls. It is just too risky to have a written communication with SP's.

I have only seen one SP from BP in the last few years and would also stay away from BP as well as there is just too much more risk and would only see reviewed Indy SP's or reviewed agencies girls.
Just less of a chance of things going wrong.

In the past I have been very specific about the girls I see because I am very picky in what I like and that has helped with having very few bad sessions (2 that I can count) in all of the hobbying I have done. I am sure if you ask the SP's that I have seen they would say that I was a gentleman and a great time.
I date civilians quite often and am a single man, I hobby because I like variety and if it becomes too hard or too risky of being caught by LE then I would stop seeing SP's completely as it would have a huge impact on my clients providing me business and a negative effect on their business, and that would hurt my bottom line financially.