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Gas is $.12 (12 cents US) in Venezuala! Why am I getting ripped off?

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langeweile

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Sep 21, 2004
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DonQuixote said:
Sounds like short-term, self-interest, conservative, what's in it for me, republicanism.
Fuck the next generation. I want what I want. BS is my response. Maybe you
don't think about future generations, as in your grandchildren should they ever
be born and should you care about their futures.
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You are missing my point.

People will not change their behaviour unless they have to..until now we didn't have to.
There might be a few smart ones that saw it coming, but in general the problem had been ignored.
 
oldjones

oldjones

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Aug 18, 2001
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Gyaos said:
Answering 2 questions from 2 users on one post. You knew that before posting the above line. If not, get a massage.
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And you still don't get it: your post mentions me only. You completely blew off poor lang. Too many massages maybe?

I dunno, I have seen $.12 per gallon prices. I bet you're not so old afterall and that's good!
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OK. When and where was this 12¢/gallon gas? Nice of you to suggest I'm not that old, and I'm not; when I started driving my smokes and my gas were both 40¢. And that gas did come in gallons, not litres.

Poverty and hunger is illegal and is also a weapon of mass destruction. SUV's should require a new license class, not one for a basic "automobile". It's obvious oldjones you know the answers before writing your statements. So please, implement the $.12 a kilo w/ $50/hour minimum wage. I'll betcha that is exactly how much you make and adjusted for inflation, you do pay $.12 a kilo, right?
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Dunno where you live, that has a law against poverty, but the idea about a new SUV license class is a very good one.

Remember, the rich don't pay as much for gas as the poor, because the rich don't require the use and need for gas as much as the poor. So if the poor don't need gas, gas prices drop. And if vehicles are fuel efficient, the requirement, from the poor, doesn't need as much gas. So SUVs from the "middle class", which is, in essence, the poor, should be fuel efficient. The real poor, who have no cars, are the ones drowning in New Orleans from Bush Jr.'s new found responsibility. Resignation.

Okay, now you can pass go, now you can collect $200.00 for one hour with an SP.

Gyaos Balter
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Well I'm very keen on your offer of an hour w/ an SP, and your other points have made my head hurt enough to need it.

But I do grasp that you recognize our SUVs for the mislabelled, wasteful dinosaurs they are. As the more efficient mammals replaced them, so maybe your 50km/l wundercars will replace the SUVasauruses.
 
L

langeweile

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wollensak

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Hydrogen, Ethanol - No Go

It taskes energy to extract hydrogen from the air. It's highly explosive - witness the Hindenburg. I sincerely doubt if will ever be used to propel vehicles. Just too dangerous. I think this is just a massive con job to let people think everything is OK.

Ethanol is extracted from corn, which as any farmer well tell you, takes tons of chemical fertilizer to produce a decent yield. The production of chemical fertilizers requires a lot of oil.

The real answer is for Americans to conserve. The result would be lower oil prices, and a lot less chaos in the middle east, and a lot less terrorist activity. This is all a pipe dream, of course.
 
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Asterix

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Aug 6, 2002
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Explain to me how you would get any kind of clean burning fuel, even as clean as oil, from coal.
 
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papasmerf

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baci2004

Bad girl Luv'r
Mar 21, 2004
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At the range!!!
Asterix said:
Ah, I see. It's just the bad guys who are keeping us from it.
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Yes they are.


There is a big jump from the theoretical. to experimentation, to trial. to pracitical application, to mass use. I'm not saying it can't be done.
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It is a big jump I agree.

- At the moment working prototypes exist, we have them the yanks have them and I'm sure somewhere in Europe they have them too.

- We have the ability to produce hydrogen in several ways. Someone mentioned that the costs to produce hydogen are high; Could it possibley be more expensive then pulling up oil from the bottom of the ocean?? I highly doubt it, we all made it in science class.


I'm saying we're not even close. DQ says a decade, I say decades. To simply repeat hydrogen as some sort of mantra is pointless.
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Why? What is the future going to bring that will help facilitate the low cost in producing hydrogen and/or hydrogen vehicles? I'm not attacking you but why can't it start tomorrow?

Don - Your question of distributing is loaded, and you know it lol. The man with the biggest stick will control the new fuel...who else? (I really wanted to avoid saying that)
I personally don't really care who does it as long as it gets done. Let them charge whatever the hell they want; at least the killing will slow down a bit and maybe our grandchildren will at least be able to catch a glimps of the big dipper without having to go to the north pole.

Lang- Yur right. If people actually gave a shit beyond tomorrow things may change a bit faster.

Old Jones - Stop encouraging this reject!
 
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Asterix

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Aug 6, 2002
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baci2004 said:
It is a big jump I agree.



Why? What is the future going to bring that will help facilitate the low cost in producing hydrogen and/or hydrogen vehicles? I'm not attacking you but why can't it start tomorrow?
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The work to develope an alternative fuel can, or more accurately the process can, but it should have begun in earnest twenty years ago. All of this is going to take time, for the reasons I've previously indicated, and like most large scale human endeavors, will take even longer then we first supposed. Petroleum is in many was a perfect resource for us to manipulate. The number of products we use that rely on it staggering. It is not just a question of finding a new energy source. The increasing price, and eventual scarcity of oil, is going to cost us in more ways than we realize.
 
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anon1

anon1

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baci2004 said:
Someone mentioned that the costs to produce hydogen are high
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The problem with hydrogen production is that it's expensive in terms of energy. It takes electricity and lots of it, so you're not ahead in any way. You are just downloading your gasoline energy costs onto the powergrid.
The net gain is negative.
 
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wollensak

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Tar Sands

If there is enough oil in the Alberta Tar sands to supply ALL North American needs for the next 50 years, why the panic??

The oil question is not really about running out of the stuff, it's about who will control access to it.

The US won't give up on the cheap stuff, no matter how many wars ensue.
If they leave Iraq, the Chinese will get it! It's like little kids fighting over marbles in a sandbox. In this case, Iraq is the sandbox.
 
Gyaos

Gyaos

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Aug 17, 2001
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oldjones said:
And you still don't get it: your post mentions me only. You completely blew off poor lang. Too many massages maybe?
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You know, you're right. I went and made an re-edit back on page 2 and fixed that. Too much need for sex on my behalf, was the cause. :cool:

Thanks!

Gyaos
 
oldjones

oldjones

CanBarelyRe Member
Aug 18, 2001
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wollensak said:
If there is enough oil in the Alberta Tar sands to supply ALL North American needs for the next 50 years, why the panic??

The oil question is not really about running out of the stuff, it's about who will control access to it.

The US won't give up on the cheap stuff, no matter how many wars ensue.
If they leave Iraq, the Chinese will get it! It's like little kids fighting over marbles in a sandbox. In this case, Iraq is the sandbox.
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Because the Tar Sands oil just is too expensive to get out of the sand at yesterday's prices. At $50/bbl and up it turns a profit, and pays for the exploration to find more deposits and all that good stuff. TANSTAAFL

The point is, there ain't much cheap stuff left, cost of recovery keeps climbing, and barrels per buck-spent getting it out of the ground continues to fall, while the oil-thirst—all those Indians and Chinese buying their first cars, to say noting of what their industries and powerplants burn—goes ever upwards.

Maybe some new cheap energy's around the corner, but I think not. I remember my Grade 9 Physics teacher intoning the First Law: Energy cannot be created or destroyed, only transformed from one kind to another. Which means we might luck out and perfect a cheap new-tech (aren't you glad we're employing all those NASA-nerds now!) 'transformer' no one thought of before, but I'll keep taking regular breaths till then thanks.
 
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tompeepin

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Mar 17, 2004
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langeweile said:
I was under the impression that the current high prices of gasoline, are the result of a "lack of" refining capacity> Not a result of and oil shortage.

Does anyone know?
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The current price of gasoline is a result of market speculation and because gasoline distributors also see an opportunity to take advantage in this climate of speculation. There has been a drop in oil production in the Gulf of Mexico, however, this has been offset by the release of oil from strategic reserves as well as from donations from other countries. Today the US oil inventories are down but gasoline inventories are up.

World events get priced into energy prices as they happen in speculation of their effect. If there is no net effect the energy companies and speculators earn a healthy return. If there is an effect they raise prices even more. It is a very good business. Except when things are nice and stable and oil prices drop to below $40 a barrel, then speculators take a loss.
 
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WoodPeckr

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May 29, 2002
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Gasoline Price-Gouging

Don’t fall under the illusion that “refining” is the problem. As with every other area of the equation, this element too has been controlled, manipulated, and exploited. As Ryter points out:

Early in his career, John D. Rockefeller, Sr. learned that to control the price of oil nationwide he did not need to control the oil wildcatters who, from 1865 to 1876, threatened to bankrupt the fledgeling oil industry in Pennsylvania by pumping too much oil and causing the price of crude to drop below the cost to refine it. He only needed to control how much oil was refined. As long as demand exceeded supply, the oil industry would remain healthy—and profitable. Instead of attempting to buy out every wildcatter who sunk a well around Oil Creek, Pennsylvania, Rockefeller and his partner, Henry Flagler concentrated on either buying or bankrupting the independent refineries. By 1887, Standard Oil controlled 85% of all the oil that was refined in the United States.

Folks, what we’re witnessing today in the United States may possibly be the gravest example of a royal screwing that we’ve ever seen. The question now is: how long are we going to take it until all hell breaks loose?

http://www.wingtv.net/thornarticles/sevensisters.html
 
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