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FBI investigating death of suspect after Minneapolis police officer put knee on neck

mandrill

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2001
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_Canadians

Actually, I went and looked it up for you and you're 100% full of shit.

The Irish in Ontario did just fine and 1 of the Fathers of Confederation D'Arcy McGee was Irish.

You just posted a bunch of crap and then hoped no one would fact check you,
 

Darts

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2017
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The Irish in Ontario did just fine and 1 of the Fathers of Confederation D'Arcy McGee was Irish.
Just to set the record straight. There are TWO Irish. There is the "Orange" Irish (Ulster Protestant) and the Catholic Irish. The Orange Irish did well in Ontario in the 1800's and early 1900's. The Catholic Irish not so much.

BTW 1: Many (not all) of the slave owners in the deep south were Orange Irish.

BTW 2: Even in 2020, Northern Ireland is still occupied territory. The occupiers are the Orangemen backed by the British SAS.
 

derrick76

Well-known member
May 10, 2011
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Toronto, ON
The race baiters love to provide all kinds of race based statistics except statistics on black crime and black criminals.

BTW: You are wasting your time trying to reason with that other poster as his posts are nothing more than rants and false racist accusations. Thank you for trying anyway.
Again, what does black on black crime have to do with paid public servants committing crime and not being held accountable?? You still can't explain this?

Is it tax dollars well spent to have state sanctioned murder and brutality?

When black people kill each other, they go to prison. The cops who murder...DO NOT. Are you seeing the point yet, or do you need someone to draw you a picture to colour?

Or are you saying that since black people kill each other, it's only fair that police get to murder black people too? Fair enough. Everyone should get to murder black people, but they all should go to prison. DEAL????

Then there's the corrupt system that over charges and over punishes black criminals more than they do white ones for the same crime.

Please pay attention!!
 

mandrill

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2001
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Just to set the record straight. There are TWO Irish. There is the "Orange" Irish (Ulster Protestant) and the Catholic Irish. The Orange Irish did well in Ontario in the 1800's and early 1900's. The Catholic Irish not so much.

BTW 1: Many (not all) of the slave owners in the deep south were Orange Irish.

BTW 2: Even in 2020, Northern Ireland is still occupied territory. The occupiers are the Orangemen backed by the British SAS.

Sounds like the Green Irish did okay as well.

And don't get me started on your shit about Ulster.
 

Uncharted

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Aug 8, 2013
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The other thing I find interesting about this issue with the police and their treatment of Blacks is how many people view this issue as either black or white, pardon the pun, and refuse to see the overwhelming amount of grey in it.

Most people truly believe that the majority of police and police institutions are just people sitting around actively hating black people, trying to figure out how to make their lives hell.
Or that racism is instructed to police officers from the people who train and govern the policing system.

Nothing could be further from the truth. Most of the racism that happens by police is unintentional racism, carried out without Malice, and is a by-product of bad police policies that have nothing to do with race in and of themselves.

Let me point out a single instance of these polices and show you how it filters through a system that is not racist, but comes out racist in the end.

Lets look at the fact that Black people are harassed more by police.

Does anyone out there actually believe this is happening because the police are twirling their mustaches trying to figure out how to stick it to black people today?
The cops that do harass Black people are probably not even maliciously racist in their own intentions as they are doing it.

However, they are employing racial profiling.
Now, profiling in general is a very effective tool, regardless of how fair you think it is. It often gets results. That is why there has never been a terrorist incident on a plane out of an Israeli airport. Because they racially screen there. If you have an Arabic last name getting on a plane in Israel, you're probably getting strip searched. You may not think it is fair, and you may be right, but the results are concrete.

Also, profiling a single race doesn't just come out of thin air. A race is typically profiled for something because there is statistical and empirical evidence for a higher probability of finding that something within that race.
A higher percentage of overall crimes are committed by Blacks. Sorry, but that is statistically true.
Why that is the case is a completely separate social discussion, with it's own complexities that also needs addressing, but it is not in this discussion at this time.

So now we know why police tend to profile Black people. But why do individual police officers use profiling at all?
It isn't taught in the academy.
It isn't officially employed in police procedures. Officers aren't being told by their superiors that they have to arrest a certain amount of black people this month.
But they are being told they have to make a certain amount of arrests. And that is one of the biggest problems.
The quotas that police have to meet.

Our law enforcement system is based on a principle of giving people increased powers of authority and weapons, and then essentially having them work on commission.
That is the stupidest thing we could ever have allowed to happen. This puts cops at odds with their very mandate. They're primary concern is no longer to server the public, or protect the innocent. It's to make as many arrests as possible, at any cost.
That's like giving the Army a yearly quota on wars they need to fight in.
And anyone who doesn't think that police officers are extremely pressured to meet their arrest quotas is living in a fantasy land.

So now you have a policy, pressuring officers to make a certain amount of arrests per month. No racial malice or racial intention in this decision.
So the individual officers are naturally going to focus their attention to things that have a higher rate of crime. There is your use of profiling. Again, No racial malice or racial intention in this decision.
What is it that statistically has the higher rate of crime for the officer to profile? Black people/Black neighborhoods. No racial malice but a racial intention in this decision.
Officer harasses black people looking to fill his quota. No Racial Malice, but there is our racist act.

All of these are bad decisions but few of them are even racial at all, and none of them are motivated by actual maliciousness towards Black people. It's forced opportunism at play. And Black officers do the same thing.

If a person is being forced to catch a certain amount of fish in a day, they're going to go to the fishing hole where they are more likely to catch fish, and drop their line in.
Now, not every fish they pull out of the water will be a keeper, but they will probably have a better chance of catching their limit.
And they won't care if it is a Black fishing hole, an Hispanic fishing hole, or a White fishing hole. Just as long as they catch all the fish they're being forced to catch.

And that's how Grey it is.
You will never eliminate "systemic" black racism in a police force by scrutinizing white officers, looking for signs of malicious racism towards black people. Because for the most part, it doesn't exist. You have to look for stupid procedures and practices, things that don't even have anything to do with race. Policies that simply allow or provoke a person with increased authority to abuse it, with anyone. Then you eliminate the final result on the street.
 

Darts

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2017
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My ancestors were brutalized and oppressed by the Turks during the Ottoman empire, nobody is crying about it now.
The Ottoman Turks were brutal. They massacred over 1.5 million Armenian men, women and children. They also aggressively invaded southeastern Europe. At one point Ottoman headquarter issued an order to "kill all the Serbs".

Fortunately, a smaller Christian army defeated the Turks at the "Gate of Vienna". Thus, ended the Turkish invasion of Europe.
 

WyattEarp

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May 17, 2017
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I think this thread needs some levity. As Jimmy Rabitte said in The Commitments "The Irish are the blacks of Europe. And Dubliners are the blacks of Ireland. And the Northside Dubliners are the blacks of Dublin. So say it once and say it loud, I'm black and I'm proud."
 

Darts

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Jan 15, 2017
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However, they are employing racial profiling.
Now, profiling in general is a very effective tool, regardless of how fair you think it is. It often gets results.

Also, profiling a single race doesn't just come out of thin air. A race is typically profiled for something because there is statistical and empirical evidence for a higher probability of finding that something within that race.
A higher percentage of overall crimes are committed by Blacks.
Does anyone ever wonder why shoplifting at the LCBO and the Beer Store are not reported to police? Yes, they have videos. Guess who are the shoplifters.
 

Darts

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2017
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I think this thread needs some levity. As Jimmy Rabitte said in The Commitments "The Irish are the blacks of Europe. And Dubliners are the blacks of Ireland. And the Northside Dubliners are the blacks of Dublin. So say it once and say it loud, I'm black and I'm proud."
That also explains why over 60 million Americans and Canadians can trace their root back to Catholic Ireland. Anyone who confuses Catholic Irish (good guys) with the Orangemen (bad guys) simply doesn't know Irish history.

Note: There are actual living breathing black (aka dark) Irish. They are descendants of shipwrecked Catholic Spanish Armada sailors rescued by Irish Catholics. Not sure what happened to the sailors captured by the English but one can guess.
 

Uncharted

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Aug 8, 2013
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Does anyone ever wonder why shoplifting at the LCBO and the Beer Store are not reported to police? Yes, they have videos. Guess who are the shoplifters.
If you're going to only use out of context excerpts from my post to validate your own views.
Please don't quote my posts at all.

Nothing in my post was laying blame on Black people.
 

SchlongConery

License to Shill
Jan 28, 2013
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Again, what does black on black crime have to do with paid public servants committing crime and not being held accountable?? You still can't explain this?
Darts is an educated man as illustrated by his ability to refer to history and other areas. But his racism and alt-right posting are more likely attributable to his overly enthusiastic Rusty Trombone solos to benefit the racist right wing Tribe he has found on TERB. He desperately wants to belong...somewhere.
 

Uncharted

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Aug 8, 2013
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Do you see the hypocrisy introducing your argument?
Nope.

Most people do. That is why the term "systemic" racism, has become universal when talking about the police. That's why I put it in quotes in my post.
For systemic racism to be true, it would have to be that racist views and intentions are existing and influencing every level of the Law enforcement system and policies.
That just simply is not the case, yet everyone from the protesters, to the media, to politicians still use the term "Systemic" racism, because that's what they believe.

When in actuality, you have a system of stupid policies that exist, irrespective of race, that when they aggregate down through the nuances of the real world, result in a disproportionate amount of abuse of authority being visited upon a certain group of people. Simply because it is the path of least resistance to achieve said policies that had nothing to do with race in the first place.
 

Darts

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Jan 15, 2017
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If you're going to only use out of context excerpts from my post to validate your own views.
Please don't quote my posts at all.

Nothing in my post was laying blame on Black people.
Apologies. Your post was really long (hence the extracts) but you did mention black crime and racial profiling. I'll delete my post. You should delet your post as well since you quoted me.
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
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Nope.

Most people do. That is why the term "systemic" racism, has become universal when talking about the police. That's why I put it in quotes in my post.
For systemic racism to be true, it would have to be that racist views and intentions are existing and influencing every level of the Law enforcement system and policies.
That just simply is not the case, yet everyone from the protesters, to the media, to politicians still use the term "Systemic" racism, because that's what they believe.

When in actuality, you have a system of stupid policies that exist, irrespective of race, that when they aggregate down through the nuances of the real world, result in a disproportionate amount of abuse of authority being visited upon a certain group of people. Simply because it is the path of least resistance to achieve said policies that had nothing to do with race in the first place.
But that *is* what systemic racism means.
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
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But if the system is so racist, how come we have so many black police officers??
Who enforce racist outcomes because of the system. That's the argument. Systemic means your individual good will won't change it.
 

WyattEarp

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May 17, 2017
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But that *is* what systemic racism means.
I don't think that is exactly true. It depends on the policy. The nuances can be shown with two simple questions. Is it systemic racism that blacks are convicted of crimes disproportionately more than whites? Is it systemic racism that blacks are sentenced to longer sentences for the same crime than whites?

I have personally found people make ridiculous arguments of systemic racism in reference to common public policy. Do schools that punish black students disproportionately practicing systemic racism? Should schools strive to punish students in proportion to the school's racial composition? The Obama Administration thought so.
 
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