Crooked Cops?

[dj1470]

This happened in NYC when a NYPD cop almost kills a cyclist for no reason and then charges him with disorderly conduct and assaulting an officer until a video was posted on YouTube showing what really happened.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAkRweEQxxI

My question is this: How crooked are cops? Especially here in Toronto. How many times does this type of thing happen and the "law" takes the word of a cop over a citizen no matter what. When I was a teen I was pulled over for speeding and charged with 40km over when I did not do it. I was doing 75 in the 60 but he (cop) really did lie about what had happened. I took a court date but lost due to what the judge deemed, "due to lack of contrary evidence we take the word of the law officer over that of a citizen"

 

[ig-88]

DJ,

You may also be interested in Jimmy Justice videos.

He videotapes NYPD cops breaking the law and puts it on youtube.

I agree with his intentions, but not his methods.

He comes off as a real jerk when confronting the cops.

And mostly, he tends to catch black (and often female) street cops for breaking very minor traffic and parking laws.

http://www.youtube.com/user/JimmyJustice4753

 

[nottyboi]

Sadly, there are a fair number of bad eggs out their in Metro. I know of someone who knows a cop whos stated goal is to file one criminal charge a night. This way he gets lots of court appearance OT and can make more then 100K a year. The Peel police are really bad, they are really thugs with guns. I have, sadly, very little confidence in the Police. There are definitley some good cops out there, but the primitive tribal model of police organizations makes them tolerate the bad cops. On the whole, there are too many bullys in the force. Personally, I hope the guy in the Video gets a high powered NAACP lawyer a destroys the cop professional and financially. I think camera phones are a great thing for policing the police, and cops should know that there is ALWAYS someone watching. It's strange that cops wonder why the public is reluctant to cooperate, frankly I have NO DESIRE to interact with the police in any form. I would one be a witness in very limited circumstances...

 

[sailorsix]

I voted 75% but then I grew up in Montreal where all cops are presumed to be on the take. IF they get caught the french attitude is "oh well, too bad better luck next time"

 

[Esco!]

I think its about 50%

Does anyone remember the Aylmer (Quebec) police incident???
That entire town's cop force was corrupt, so the RCMP had to fire them all

 

[Esco!]

Best way is not have anything to do with them, dont befriend a cop ever.
I made that mistake in the 90's

Now I only interact with cops when I get a speeding ticket

 

[fuji]

I think very, very few of Toronto's cops are crooked.

However there are three caveats:

1. I think far, far too many otherwise honest cops turn a blind eye to the poor behavior of the very few

2. A very few crooked cops can represent a fairly big problem, given the amount of power and authority invested in the office

3. Depends what you mean by "crooked", if you mean doing outright illegal or criminal things that are harmful to individual members of the public, very, very few. If you mean logging bogus overtime and otherwise boosting their income legally but deviously... well, how many crooked CUPE union workers are there? It's not uncommon in any government job if that is what you mean by "crooked".

I'd distinguish between what I'd call "overbilling" and "crooked", when you say "crooked cop" that conjures up to me the image of someone involved in something criminal, accepting bribes, etc.

 

[RTRD]

Wow...

...I am surprised by the comments so far.


I am ABSOLUTELY no lover of the police, but I wouldn't put the number of corrupt ones at 50 or 75%.

Perhaps I am naive.

Of course, I guess it depends on your definition of corrupt / crooked. If it is one where you feel that ANY transgression of laws / by laws / rules puts them in the negative pile, well, yeah...I'd guess the percentage is AT LEAST 50%. I am confident that most cops at some point take advantage of the fact that they are cops (like the parking violations alluded to earlier).

Honestly, that stuff doesn't bother me too much. I guess because I am not so holier than thou to think I wouldn't do the same in the same position given the same opportunity.

The bar i had set was more along the lines of criminal or felonious activity. Not just SMOKING weed (hopefully off duty), but SELLING weed, for example. Not just seeing escorts, but being a pimp. Actually assaulting people, versus just being a jackass, like many cops are. That sort of thing.

I really hope THAT number is more like the 5% I guessed at in the poll.

Tarkus: This might give you some insight into why many minorities / minority groups have a fundamental distrust of the police.

 

[Aardvark154]

I think very, very few of Toronto's cops are crooked.

However there are three caveats:

1. I think far, far too many otherwise honest cops turn a blind eye to the poor behavior of the very few

2. A very few crooked cops can represent a fairly big problem, given the amount of power and authority invested in the office

3. Depends what you mean by "crooked", if you mean doing outright illegal or criminal things that are harmful to individual members of the public, very, very few. If you mean logging bogus overtime and otherwise boosting their income legally but deviously... well, how many crooked CUPE union workers are there? It's not uncommon in any government job if that is what you mean by "crooked".

I'd distinguish between what I'd call "overbilling" and "crooked", when you say "crooked cop" that conjures up to me the image of someone involved in something criminal, accepting bribes, etc.

I entirely agree with what Fuji wrote above. Furthermore police corruption varies regionally across North America and as a generalization tends to be more common in cities than in smaller towns.

 

[landscaper]

I have in fact had personal experience with cops lieing on statements, the defence lawyer says it happens all the time. I supeanad his note book and ticket records and the result was an absolute discharge.

Most police officers carry their badges right beside their drivers license so when they get pulled over for speedingf the badge accidently gets flashed when the license comes out.

The cop who got off on the impaired charge when some of his buddies swore under oath that he had not had enough to drink to blow over is another example.

If you look into it the list goes on.

 

[Keebler Elf]

The poll is biased against cops to begin with. Five negative options and one unbelievable one? No agenda there...

 

[Keebler Elf]

How many times does this type of thing happen and the "law" takes the word of a cop over a citizen no matter what.

If I were to guess, probably almost never. It's a myth that judges take the word of a cop over a citizen. They may take the word of a cop over a citizen the judge doesn't deem trustworthy, but that's apples and oranges.

Lawyers know some cops lie. So do judges. Just like some defendants lie. The trick is figuring out who is being more truthful.

Another part of this myth comes from people who think they can just show up to court, tell their side of the story, and win. It's called corroborating evidence folks. If the cop took notes at the scene and all you have is your word against his, his notes trump your lack of evidence.

 

[Never Compromised]

Try putting a crisp $50 in next to your license the next time you're pulled over. Try NOT doing that in Moscow, Bangkok, or San Paulo.

Yeah, a $50 here is just an insult and invitation to a criminal charge. A $50 in Bangkok is what a week's salary?

 

[Aardvark154]

Yeah, a $50 here is just an insult and invitation to a criminal charge. A $50 in Bangkok is what a week's salary?

The point is still quite valid. In fact it is one of the things that has to be "drummed into the heads" of new immigrants from countries where such behaviour is common THAT ONE DOES NOT DO THAT HERE inasmuch as 999 times out of 1,000 you will be arrested for attempted bribery or a similar charge.

 

[Aardvark154]

As far as cops being let off regularly for DUI. You've obviously never seen the OPP cruiser situated near the Metro Police Association clubhouse, have you? They wait for the boys to leave. Why do you think? To hand out invites to their next bash? Nope

Absolutely, perhaps in some big city forces, but not elsewhere. Yes one of the boys/girls may get out of a speeding ticket but DUI or an Indictable Crime - NOPE

 

[futurelegend]

I have quite a few friends who are cops and at one point was on the road to becoming one myself. There are very few of them that are actually crooked (using the definition that others have used here in conducting actual malicious, illegal activity), I would put the real number at about 2-3%. Keeping in mind that a lot of these guys/gals make upward of 75 - 80k per year (with 0 overtime), most view illegal activity as a stupid risk.

Most, however, are self-righteous jerks and I would put the number of them that feel that they are above the law and untouchable (to some degree) at about 75%. There are VERY few cops out there that are consistent, honest and by-the-book and the ones that are, are typically looked down upon by their peers. It's still an old-boy's club mentality and a lot of them play the hear no evil, see no evil role when it comes to each other. Admittedly, if I were one of them, I would likely use it to get off speeding tickets IF I happened to get one, but I would not speed around everywhere because I knew I could get off scott-free.

It also depends greatly on the leadership of the force. In my area I know that when our new chief was put in place, a few officers were investigated, charged and either suspended, demoted or terminated for various charges against them, ranging from domestic assault, to drug possession.

 

[landscaper]

Absolutely, perhaps in some big city forces, but not elsewhere. Yes one of the boys/girls may get out of a speeding ticket but DUI or an Indictable Crime - NOPE

The constable was arreasted by the OPP for driving his cruiser eratically. He failed a field sobriety test and then the breathalyzer. All in carefully controlled circumstanses.

At trial several of his friends took the stand a swore under oath that he did not drink enough to register what the breathalyzer said.

The judge agreed with them state the breathalyzer must be inacurate, the crown prosecutor's last statement was " We are not working with Radio Shack toys here".

 

[Hockey_MLnut]

I think that it was pretty bad in Toronto before (late 80's early 90's). Now it seems that the police have been cleaned up (for the time being).

 

[nottyboi]

They volunteer to put their life on the line so all of you can live the life you do.

Dude please don't continue to spread this propaganda. Being a cop in Canada is one of the safest jobs one can have. Working construction or in a factory is FAR more dangerous. The cops and police unions keep shoveling this BS so they can demand rediculous wages for a job that really is not that skilled or dangeous. It's a shitty job for sure, and we 100% need police, but lets not deify them.

 

[basketcase]

I think that part of the problem is that like the army, the police don't necessarily attract the best and brightest. The police requirements are getting better but there are many who are attracted to job for the power they can wield over others. There is also ample temptation to profit from actions that they think they can get away with.

I've met a bunch of cops who seem to be in the job for the right reasons but if the poll includes things like using the lights to avoid stopping at red lights and hitting on women while on duty, it does seem to fit may of them.