Conrad Black

[james t kirk]

****************************

To where. Iraq?

To any country where they do not have an extraditiion treaty with the USA.

Cuba comes to mind. Connie could get his ass down to Florida very easily, then charter a very fast boat to get him to Havana. There he could spend the rest of his years living the Ernest Hemmingway lifestyle. Hell, he could even write a book about it.

Why not.

If it's between that and 20 years in the polkie, he'd be stupid not to run.

I would if I were in his shoes.

 

[The Cunning Linguist]

To any country where they do not have an extraditiion treaty with the USA.

Cuba comes to mind. Connie could get his ass down to Florida very easily, then charter a very fast boat to get him to Havana. There he could spend the rest of his years living the Ernest Hemmingway lifestyle. Hell, he could even write a book about it.

Why not.

If it's between that and 20 years in the polkie, he'd be stupid not to run.

I would if I were in his shoes.

Would Cuba take him? I mean, the guy is a shining example of capitialist greed....and they don't take American currency anymore....

Does the Dominican have an extradition treaty with the US?

I agree though, screw the reputation and get out of Dodge....

 

[mandrill]

Cuba comes to mind. Connie could get his ass down to Florida very easily, then charter a very fast boat to get him to Havana. There he could spend the rest of his years living the Ernest Hemmingway lifestyle. Hell, he could even write a book about it.

Don't be silly. Cuba's commie-land. Castro would enjoy the PR op of parading CB around Havana, before having him flown straight back to FLA. CB's a prime capitalist with a commercial fraud conviction!

 

[Esco!]

Countries with no extradition treaty with the US:

Afghanistan, Algeria, Andorra, Angola, Armenia, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Brunei, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cambodia, Cameroon, Cape Verde, Central African Republic, Chad, China (People's Republic of China), Union of the Comoros, Congo, Democratic Republic of the, Cote d' Ivoire, Djibouti, Equatorial Guinea, Ethiopia, Gabon, Guinea, Guinea-Bissau, Indonesia, Jordan, Kuwait, Laos, Lebanon, Libya, Madagascar, Maldives, Mali, Marshall Islands, Mauritania, Micronesia, Moldova, Mongolia, Mozambique, Myanmar, Namibia, Nepal, Niger, Oman, Qatar, Russian Federation, Rwanda, São Tomé and Príncipe, Saudi Arabia, Senegal, Serbia and Montenegro, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, Togo, Tunisia, Uganda, Vanuatu, Vietnam, Western Samoa, Yemen, and Zimbabwe.

Countries with neither diplomatic relations or extradition treaties:

Bhutan, Iran, North Korea, and the Republic of China (Taiwan) (which the United States does not consider a country under the One-China Policy).


Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extradition_law_in_the_United_States

 

[Esco!]

Its funny, according to that list Cuba does have extradition treaties with the U.S.

 

[james t kirk]

Its funny, according to that list Cuba does have extradition treaties with the U.S.

I find that amazing as the US has no diplomatic relations with Cuba outside of the UN.

The Russian Federation then.

They'd welcome connie with open arms and he could have all the 6' tall Russian babes with legs like gazels he ever wanted.

 

[Esco!]

I find that amazing as the US has no diplomatic relations with Cuba outside of the UN.

You cant really trust Wiki, but I cant find any info on Cuba about this...very strange

The Russian Federation then.
They'd welcome connie with open arms and he could have all the 6' tall Russian babes with legs like gazels he ever wanted.

Andorra sounds good too, lots of skiiing there

 

[Esco!]

According to Answerbag Cuba is also on the list: http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/7231

But then this Wiki page shows otherwise: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradition_treaties

 

[zedzed77]

I am glad this has finally come to pass. He got what he deserved.

So I may appear to be prejudiced against him, but then again I have reason to.

I was a former acquaintance of someone who used to work for the Toronto Star as a columnist several years earlier. While I may have different political and economic views from her, I respect the fact that she is a columnist and the fact that a private paper has the right to publish the views of its reporters.

Said acquaintance drew the ire of Mr. Black at one point after publishing an article that he apparently didn't like. She doesn't understand it, the article was about a possible currency tax and had nothing to do with Black at all. But I heard that Mr. Black was on the warpath. Normally such people who post logical criticism of said views and perhaps get on with their lives.

Not Mr. Black. From several news sources, I read that Mr. Black demanded that the reporter "be taken to City Hall and publically horsewhipped" (or something like that). And not once too. Repeatedly.

Same Mr. Black apparently also criticized the Jury for not being an appropriate selection of his peers and criticizing the selection of "common folk". I'm assuming that none of the Jurors were named Trump.

Since 1997, I've had an interest in Mr. Black and his dealings, stopping to look at papers to see what is going on. And not just me too. Another acquaintance lost a substantial amount of money in Hollinger Stock. So it was with glee when we heard of Black being charged.

And now he's guilty. For being such a pompous ass, he gets what he deserved. The fact remains is that this man thought himself higher than anyone else in society. He believed himself to be THE Upper Crust and those who weren't to his level were ingrates. Philanthropy just wasn't his thing, since it involved mingling with the dreaded "common folk".

If Conrad Black would suddenly roll over and die tomorrow, there wouldn't be any mourning. No one would care for the fate of such an indignant person. When Ed Mirvish died (God Bless Mr. Mirvish's soul, he was a great man), his funeral had a lot of coverage, as walks from across society came to honour the man who was indeed Toronto's philanthropist. Even Kenneth Lay, who died after being convicted received some sympathy. Despite the aura of criminality around Lay, the common thing between Mirvish and Lay was that they both came from poor families and earned their wealth.

Truth be told, when Jeffrey Skilling and Bernie Ebbers were convicted on white collar crime and sentenced to jail, some people wondered how they would end up. Like Mirvish and Lay, both Skilling and Ebbers came from simple families. However, Mr. Black came from a rich, and privileged family, that and his lifestyle gave birth to his harshly negative attitude towards "common folk". He never had a real opportunity to work for his riches, it was already handed to him.

Simply put, to many people, including Canadians, Conrad Black is the epitome of the worst in corporate greed. He acted as if his company was his oyster, without regard to the people who were actually running it. Lay, Skilling and Ebbers may have brought down bigger companies, but it was Black who defined the absolute notion of Greed in society. It is no surprise that there are a lot of people who would agree to hope that Mr. Black SUFFERS in prison.

Maybe if he mingled with us "common folk" things would have turned out differently.

 

[danmand]

Newspapers have written about how he often have had dinners with various cardinals.

They must not have talked about the 10 commandmends.

 

[Esco!]

I'd say that if he got -say- five years that would be good.

WorldCom CEO Bernard Ebbers: 25 years

Enron CEO Jeffrey Skilling: 24 years, 4 months

Adelphia Communications chief financial officer Timothy Rigas: 20 years

Adelphia Communications founder John Rigas: 15 years

Tyco International CEO Dennis Kozlowski: 8 1/3 to 25 years

Tyco International CFO Mark H. Swartz: 8 1/3 to 25 years

Enron CFO Andrew Fastow: 6 years

ImClone Systems CEO Samuel Waksal: 7 years, 3 months

In todays political Enron climate I doubt he'll get 5 years.
More like 15 IMO but we'll have to wait till November.

 

[danmand]

At 62 years of age, even 10 years in jail is a large part of the rest of your life.

 

[Esco!]

BUT, this was not Enron. Billions were looted in a systematic wholesale deception to the public and to the employees of a biig shell game. Nor did Black embarass any political heavyweights as did the Enron crew.

Remember that he was only convicted -and therefore sentences will be based on- fraud UNDER $5 million. And of that $5m he stole, half was coming to him anyways as AFAIK he owned half the company he stole from.

So, IF the prosecutor goes for a home run and tries to lock him up for what would be essentially a life sentence... Black would have good grounds to appeal based on a capricious vendetta... not on a pattern of established rulings.

You seem to forget this is the United States, Rub.
They fry teenagers in Texas, and they hand out life terms over practically nothing.

The legal "experts" have already stated he'll get between 10 and 20 years.
Time will tell if they're right, I guess

 

[red]

I am glad this has finally come to pass. He got what he deserved.

So I may appear to be prejudiced against him, but then again I have reason to.

I was a former acquaintance of someone who used to work for the Toronto Star as a columnist several years earlier. While I may have different political and economic views from her, I respect the fact that she is a columnist and the fact that a private paper has the right to publish the views of its reporters.

Said acquaintance drew the ire of Mr. Black at one point after publishing an article that he apparently didn't like. She doesn't understand it, the article was about a possible currency tax and had nothing to do with Black at all. But I heard that Mr. Black was on the warpath. Normally such people who post logical criticism of said views and perhaps get on with their lives.

Not Mr. Black. From several news sources, I read that Mr. Black demanded that the reporter "be taken to City Hall and publically horsewhipped" (or something like that). And not once too. Repeatedly.

Same Mr. Black apparently also criticized the Jury for not being an appropriate selection of his peers and criticizing the selection of "common folk". I'm assuming that none of the Jurors were named Trump.

Since 1997, I've had an interest in Mr. Black and his dealings, stopping to look at papers to see what is going on. And not just me too. Another acquaintance lost a substantial amount of money in Hollinger Stock. So it was with glee when we heard of Black being charged.

And now he's guilty. For being such a pompous ass, he gets what he deserved. The fact remains is that this man thought himself higher than anyone else in society. He believed himself to be THE Upper Crust and those who weren't to his level were ingrates. Philanthropy just wasn't his thing, since it involved mingling with the dreaded "common folk".

If Conrad Black would suddenly roll over and die tomorrow, there wouldn't be any mourning. No one would care for the fate of such an indignant person. When Ed Mirvish died (God Bless Mr. Mirvish's soul, he was a great man), his funeral had a lot of coverage, as walks from across society came to honour the man who was indeed Toronto's philanthropist. Even Kenneth Lay, who died after being convicted received some sympathy. Despite the aura of criminality around Lay, the common thing between Mirvish and Lay was that they both came from poor families and earned their wealth.

Truth be told, when Jeffrey Skilling and Bernie Ebbers were convicted on white collar crime and sentenced to jail, some people wondered how they would end up. Like Mirvish and Lay, both Skilling and Ebbers came from simple families. However, Mr. Black came from a rich, and privileged family, that and his lifestyle gave birth to his harshly negative attitude towards "common folk". He never had a real opportunity to work for his riches, it was already handed to him.

Simply put, to many people, including Canadians, Conrad Black is the epitome of the worst in corporate greed. He acted as if his company was his oyster, without regard to the people who were actually running it. Lay, Skilling and Ebbers may have brought down bigger companies, but it was Black who defined the absolute notion of Greed in society. It is no surprise that there are a lot of people who would agree to hope that Mr. Black SUFFERS in prison.

Maybe if he mingled with us "common folk" things would have turned out differently.

was your acquaintance horse whipped? Probably not. She worked for the toronto star- so he wasn't her boss, so she should care?

another friend lost money in the stock market- well boohoo. did they lose money as a result of black or because of the board of directors. No seems to be charging them. why is that?

most people who hopes he suffers in prison have no connection to him, never met him and suffered not one iota because of his existence but they wish him ill. why? envy perhaps? who knows, but this case certainly has exposed a whole load of people with childish gripes.

 

[Esco!]

In documents filed yesterday, prosecutors said Black is facing a sentence of 24 to 30 years. "Black faces the potential of spending the rest of his life in a U.S. prison," the document said

Source: http://www.torontosun.com/News/Canada/2007/07/20/4353936-sun.html

 

[Esco!]

And his lawyers said he's not guilty.
And that's why they have a JUDGE!
Prosecutors ALSO categorically said that Conrad was a flight risk by their asking to have his bail revoked last week-objecting to him staying out until yesterday.
And the JUDGE disagreed.
And His Lordship showed up...
Ya gotta watch more Law and Order man!

All good points but I still think he'll get at least 15

 

[Perry Mason]

red...

It's not the greed in the man that people react to. Nor is it envy.

It is his arrogance, pomposity, overwhelming egotism, conceit, vindictiveness, self righteousness... while dipping his fingers into other people's pockets. Add lack of remorse now, too.

I can't even begin to fathom the kind of vanity that would cause him to trade Canadian citizenship for a piece of ermine!

This man is a walking catalogue of all that is dishonorable in a human being.

I have followed his career for about 30 years... he has pissed all over people all his life.

No matter how you slice it, the non-compete agreements are just a clever ruse... as it turns out, too clever by far. What value did he give, what contribution in exchange for the millions he syphoned off?

Whether or not there is or was sufficient evidence in law to support a conviction for fraud is a different question. There are thousands of cheats and frauds walking the sidewalks simply because there is not sufficient evidence to try them. But that does not mean the cheats and frauds are honest people!

But his removal of those boxes from that office in, shall we say, rather suspicious and incriminating circumstances says more about his character than words can say. Talk about candid camera! Black's Waterloo!

But the worst part is that he is a man with tremendous talents... he did not need to cheat to succeed... everything about him says he did it because he was so cocksure he could get away with it... because he thinks he is so much above and better than every one else.

Shakespeare could not have invented a more despicable character. He deserves what he's got coming... it might impress some lesser talent thinking about imitating him.

I wish I could find some basis for compassion. But I am finding it very difficult.

Perry

 

[JohnC]

red...

It's not the greed in the man that people react to. Nor is it envy.

It is his arrogance, pomposity, overwhelming egotism, conceit, vindictiveness, self righteousness... while dipping his fingers into other people's pockets. Add lack of remorse now, too.

This man is a walking catalogue of all that is dishonorable in a human being.

I have followed his career for about 30 years... he has pissed all over people all his life.

I can't even begin to fathom the kind of vanity that would cause him to trade Canadian citizenship for a piece of ermine!

No matter how you slice it, the non-compete agreements are just a clever ruse... as it turns out, too clever by far. What value did he give in exchange for the millions he syphoned off?

Whether or not there is or was sufficient evidence in law to support a conviction for fraud is a different question. There are thousands of cheats and frauds walking the sidewalks simply because there is not sufficient evidence to try them. But that does not mean the cheats and frauds are honest people!

But his removal of those boxes from that office in, shall we say, rather suspicious and incriminating circumstances says more about his character than words can say. Talk about candid camera! Black's Waterloo!

But the worst part is that he is a man with tremendous talents... he did not need to cheat to succeed... everything about him says he did it because he was so cocksure he could get away with it... because he thinks he is so much above and better than every one else.

Shakespeare could not have invented a more despicable character. He deserves what he's got coming... it might impress some lesser talent thinking about imitating him.

I wish I could find some basis for compassion. But I am finding it very difficult.

Perry

Totally agree. he believes the world and all in it exist just for him. We should prevent him from coming back to Canada, he threw away his citizenship for his only personal glorification, so he can do without it as far as I am concerned.

 

[Esco!]

for about 30 years... he has pissed all over people all his life.

And now its all coming back to him. Karma baby!!

But his removal of those boxes from that office in, shall we say, rather suspicious and incriminating circumstances says more about his character than words can say.

The clincher for me was when he tapped his finger towards the security camera (he assumed they didnt work) as he was removing the boxes.

Why would an innocent person worry about the camera??? He wouldnt, it doesnt make sense, therefore he's guilty IMO.