Confidence in toronto police crashes in wake of G20
- Thread starter fuji
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Metaphysics has never been one of my long suits, but it's good to know you like to speak in riddles and your long standing use of Lorem ipsum.Now let me 'plain the term "metaphorically speaking" in the context of being full of baloney...
"Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisicing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrud exercitation ullamco laboris nisi ut aliquip ex ea commodo consequat. Duis aute irure dolor in reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint occaecat cupidatat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum."
"Breach of Peace" is not a get-out-of-jail-free card for the police. There has to be reasonable grounds to believe that the person arrested would actually commit an offense. It is doubtful that there were any such reasonable grounds in the majority of the arrests, the police sure as hell haven't been able to demonstrate that's the case. Especially in the case of the mass arrest at Queen & Spadina where many of those people appear to have beem mere passers-by.
The police have plainly over-stepped their bounds at the G20 and there's a real possibility they are going to have the cuffs put on by the electorate if they continue down this path of wanton disregard for the rights of the public.
The police have plainly over-stepped their bounds at the G20 and there's a real possibility they are going to have the cuffs put on by the electorate if they continue down this path of wanton disregard for the rights of the public.
You couldn't more wrong and a number of my past of posts have shown it to be the case, but you weren't around when they were posted, so i won't hold that against you. I've not once defended kettling in my posts in this thread, if so find where. It's not hard as there are only a 100 or so posts in it. Now you at least understand, at least that what the police did by detaining was not illegal, as you claimed, but then your go on by spitting hairs as you did in the last cop thread. I admitted it was done smoothly but that's all. I've never defended to removal of badges and said the cops should be properly sanctioned. I wasn't at these protest areas, so don't know what went on away from the cameras. i told i don't make a habit of second guessing first responders. People have a right to peaceful protest and i've defended tha as well it's hard to tell how peaceful things really were from the snap shots and video that been presented thne you lok at the throngs of wrongfully treated that stampeded the 3 public hearing. The public screamed for public hearing and when there up and running very few show up and even fewer make presentations. That says what to you?
All I said was they weren't illegal. As for my support of the detentions, the front page evidence is damaging, but i doubt told the whole story, just the juicy bits. I'm sure there were more confrontations that didn't made the headlines and stand on their own. I certainly won't make the blanket statement that you intend.
The forum were a sham? They were a venue for those wronged to air their grievances. The forums were there to give the oportunity for the public to vent/denounce/give voice for the victims, no need for subpoenas. It doesn't matter who started it, few took part when they were given the chance. What was/is done with that information has yet to be seen, but perhaps you have the gift and can tell the future.
Blair's report makes interesting and disappointing reading. Touted at 70 pages which suggests some thoroughness, it's mostly a simple chronology. Useful enough, but it short-shrifts the two issues of concern: Police did not forsestall or swiftly contain the violence Saturday, then over-compensated for their inaction by mistreating ordinary people and conducting abusive mass arrests the next day.
And it entirely ignores the real issue for the country: Who was in charge? Why have they not taken any responsibility? What are they doing to see such a national botch isn't repeated?
Two points stand out: Blair asserts the 'success' of the black bloc was due to their study of police tactics and adoption of techniques to thwart them. Where was the equivalent police study of their tactics? He says they were known, why was the response so inneffective?
He also says the abusive conditions at the Eastern Avenue Jail were due to an unexpected prisoner load. Which means that security management did not foresee and prepare for the numbers arrested. That suggests they were short-sighted, but the fact that over a thousand were arrested with fewer than a hundred charges being processed says that in fact their projections were right.
The arrests in the field were wrong. The supervision there was clearly not on the same wavelength as the pre-planning. Given that many of the supervisors failed to see their officers had removed name-tags, and could not recognize who they were supervising, that is not surprising. Street-level supervision was confused and inadequate. How far up the ranks that goes, who can say? Blair didn't
It is not surprising Blair's standing with his service, and asserting they were fine, but for a few unhappy occurances caused by the rush and confusionof preparation. His effort to explain them is commendable, but seriously flawed.
For $700million, I'd think the feds owe us an equivalent effort, or at least a whitewash. I'm getting tired of Mounties' bums waving in the air while they breathe sand. And Harpo, Clement and Baird look no better for all their fine tailoring.
And it entirely ignores the real issue for the country: Who was in charge? Why have they not taken any responsibility? What are they doing to see such a national botch isn't repeated?
Two points stand out: Blair asserts the 'success' of the black bloc was due to their study of police tactics and adoption of techniques to thwart them. Where was the equivalent police study of their tactics? He says they were known, why was the response so inneffective?
He also says the abusive conditions at the Eastern Avenue Jail were due to an unexpected prisoner load. Which means that security management did not foresee and prepare for the numbers arrested. That suggests they were short-sighted, but the fact that over a thousand were arrested with fewer than a hundred charges being processed says that in fact their projections were right.
The arrests in the field were wrong. The supervision there was clearly not on the same wavelength as the pre-planning. Given that many of the supervisors failed to see their officers had removed name-tags, and could not recognize who they were supervising, that is not surprising. Street-level supervision was confused and inadequate. How far up the ranks that goes, who can say? Blair didn't
It is not surprising Blair's standing with his service, and asserting they were fine, but for a few unhappy occurances caused by the rush and confusionof preparation. His effort to explain them is commendable, but seriously flawed.
For $700million, I'd think the feds owe us an equivalent effort, or at least a whitewash. I'm getting tired of Mounties' bums waving in the air while they breathe sand. And Harpo, Clement and Baird look no better for all their fine tailoring.
