All true. But if you ask the right questions, you can get a good sense as to what kind of condo it is and get a real sense as to where they're at with status of construction/approvals, etc.Mia.Colpa said:
Condo sales - Do these bastards tell you it is 90% sold when it is not?
- Thread starter Doctor Zoidburg
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Oh yea, know that, being buying new condos for over 10 years now and learned the games the developers play, I do know a lot of the developers personally now, wish I didn't, lol. I know what to ask, but still not good enough, they tell you what you want to hear and many times they really don't know themselves or it's beyond their control due to government bureaucracy. It's who you know and how you use that relationship. Oh, and I also pay off some spies working in their offices, lol, that always helps.iamthegucc said:All true. But if you ask the right questions, you can get a good sense as to what kind of condo it is and get a real sense as to where they're at with status of construction/approvals, etc.
I have been following this thread and contributing. I am really not sure what the point is. What is the difference whether the project is 90% or 75% sold out. If you like the project and think you are making a reasonable purchase why do you care how much is sold. Under the Condominium Act if you buy and then change your mind you have 10 day cooling off period. Unless the project achieves a minimum of 60-65% pre-sales it is not going to be built. Your deposit is insured by Tarion. Are my missing something?
I think the point is don't believe the BS the sales people tell you that the units are virtually sold out and into pressuring you into buying right there and then as there is probably more inventory they are holding back before releasing them later. Yes I know about the cooling off period and it's great as I use it all the time as I buy everything in sight, lol, and then review the Declaration and for the most part I don't like what I read so I cancel.
Well, in the developments I have been involved with there are penalties for delayed closings etc. In the last one the developer/builder had to put people up in hotel rooms until their unit was ready. This development was YEARS behind schedule......Cassini said:I would insist on construction start and end dates to be included in the contract, ideally with penalties. Also, I would get my lawyer to look over the fine print. Ensure the units have to be completed to my satisfaction.
Unfortunately, at least when Toronto's market was riding high, I have a feeling I would be laughed out of the condo office. The way things are now, you might have more success.
I've heard stories of couples winding up homeless or living with relatives because "new" homes arrived months (or years) late.
One other thing: it would be illegal for them to "lie" about how many units were or are sold. They could easily get into legal trouble. As others have stated, they do have set amount of units to be released at certain times. otherwise there would be a glut of units on the market and affect selling prices.
Yes, they require about 60% of units sold before they can even think about construction. Even then actual start times are very flexible. For example: a developer could start selling units long before all the site issues are worked out....
One other thing about units "sold". The developer could be "buying" x number of units to hold onto for investment purposes. I know in the building I'm in they hung onto 4 or 5 which was about 10% of the total units.
Supposedly the R/E market is heating up again so it IS possible that 90% of units that are for sale are actually sold. Mortgage rates are at the lowest they've been in decades and with (as stated) many projects being cancelled, there could be a shortage of units on the market.
The ability of a developer to delay or extend closing dates is strictly regulated and every Agreement of Purchase and Sale is required to have the limits included. If someone feels pressured into buying they should not buy or if they do and then reconsider they should exercise their right to rescind. If they like the deal they should like it and feel good about it whether 90% or 1% are sold.
I actually think the deposit is held in escrow until closing. If the building doesn't get constructed for whatever reason you are guaranteed to get your money back.....toguy5252 said:I have been following this thread and contributing. I am really not sure what the point is. What is the difference whether the project is 90% or 75% sold out. If you like the project and think you are making a reasonable purchase why do you care how much is sold. Under the Condominium Act if you buy and then change your mind you have 10 day cooling off period. Unless the project achieves a minimum of 60-65% pre-sales it is not going to be built. Your deposit is insured by Tarion. Are my missing something?
Date
I remember back in 1998 on site or lot that was empty. A sign went up and said to start building in Sep 1998. Half sold.
They didn't start building until 2002.
Another guy he told me his story, this happen in St Catherines. They told him it would be ready by july 2005 a year later. He sold his old house, closing date July 2005, so he would just move to his new place right away.
He didn't move in until Oct 2005 and he was living in a hotel for a month and found a place for 2 months somewhere and he was trying to get the developer to pay for his expense that he incurr for their delay.
I have never seen or heard of a Condo finished on time.
I remember back in 1998 on site or lot that was empty. A sign went up and said to start building in Sep 1998. Half sold.
They didn't start building until 2002.
Another guy he told me his story, this happen in St Catherines. They told him it would be ready by july 2005 a year later. He sold his old house, closing date July 2005, so he would just move to his new place right away.
He didn't move in until Oct 2005 and he was living in a hotel for a month and found a place for 2 months somewhere and he was trying to get the developer to pay for his expense that he incurr for their delay.
I have never seen or heard of a Condo finished on time.
Read the fine print, there are extensions to closings in very small letters, lol, that developers use to their advantage. They are allowed a couple of delays and then it's game over for them. However, most purchasers make arrangements based on the initial occupancy date, ie. sell their house, get movers, financing, new furniture, etc.... but most of the time it's delayed. I've had this happen well over a dozen times over the years, in fact one as we speak, Boutique Hotel downtown, they have revised occupancy once, they have another chance but looks like they might make it now.toguy5252 said:The ability of a developer to delay or extend closing dates is strictly regulated and every Agreement of Purchase and Sale is required to have the limits included.
When you buy a condo you should assume that the closing date is just a target. As the date approaches you will be given notice of the closing date. There are many, many issues that arise that are beyond the control of the developer. The developer cannot make the project appear by magic. It is a complicated process. the closing date in the agreement is just a pretty good guess. You should not assume that the developer is trying to take advantage of you. It is subject to the realities of the construction process.
Keep in mind that it is only the purchase deposit on the base unit that is held in trust. Any money you pay for upgrades is not considered part of the deposit and is not protected. There was just a project here in Ottawa that was nearing completion after five years, and it's now kaput. People get their deposits back, but are SOL for what they paid in upgrades (and some paid a lot).tboy said:I actually think the deposit is held in escrow until closing. If the building doesn't get constructed for whatever reason you are guaranteed to get your money back.....
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/ottawa/story/2009/08/26/ottawa-ecocite-seized-mortgage.html
