China ups the ante
- Thread starter seth gecko
- Start date
Yikes. To be expected with the gradual decline of the American empire, but still yikes.
Who needs any more new wars over the planets declining resources.
China, Japan dig in heels as rhetoric escalates over islands
By Chris Buckley and Kiyoshi Takenaka | Reuters – Wed, Sep 12, 2012
BEIJING/TOKYO (Reuters) - China kept up its tough talk on Wednesday while Japan showed no sign of yielding in a dispute between the world's second and third biggest economies over uninhabited islets that has raised alarm in Washington and protests from Beijing to Taipei.
The long-running territorial dispute flared last month when Japan detained a group of Chinese activists who had landed on the islands, known as Senkaku in Japanese and Diaoyu in Chinese.
Tension increased on Tuesday when Japan, which controls the islands, said it had bought them from a private owner, ignoring warnings from China which responded by sending two patrol ships to reassert its claim, state media reported.
Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Hong Lei blamed Tokyo for the "grave condition" of China-Japan relations and warned that Japan must "pull back from the precipice".
"China will take necessary measures based on developments, and will staunchly protect national territorial integrity," he told a news conference, declining to be more specific.
Luo Zhaohui, the head of the Chinese Foreign Ministry's Asian department, met Shinsuke Sugiyama, Japan's visiting director-general of the Asian and Oceania Affairs, and vowed China would "never accept Japan's illegal occupation or so-called 'actual control' of the Diaoyu Islands".
But the ministry said both sides would "continue to keep in communication".
The Liberation Army Daily, the chief newspaper of China's military, rained scorn and warnings on Japan. Retired Major General Luo Yuan, a prominent foreign policy hawk, said China's forces were ready to defend its sovereignty.
Luo's comments echoed a warning from China's Ministry of Defense the previous day, and while the risk of military confrontation remained slim, the fiery words illustrate the domestic pressures for a tough response from Beijing.
"The Japanese government should not place its hopes in its so-called air and sea advantage. Chinese and Japanese forces have exchanged blows before," wrote Luo. "Nowadays, China's defense forces have achieved advances that nobody can belittle."
State television reported on Chinese military exercises that included amphibious landings.
NO RECONSIDERING
Japanese Foreign Minister Koichiro Gemba rejected Chinese demands that Japan reverse its decision to buy the islands.
"There is no way we would reconsider the transfer, acquisition and possession of their ownership right," Japan's Kyodo news agency quoted Gemba as saying.
Japan's coastguard said it was monitoring the seas around the islands but had not seen any Chinese patrol vessels.
A coastguard official said foreign ships approaching Japan's waters would be warned and asked to change course. If they failed to comply and entered Japanese waters, the coastguard would try to force them to change course.
U.S. Assistant Secretary of State Kurt Campbell cautioned China and Japan on Tuesday against escalating the dispute, saying the stakes "could not be bigger" and tension could have global repercussions.
The row led to anti-Japanese protests in China last month and on Wednesday groups of people approached the heavily guarded Japanese Embassy in Beijing, carrying banners denouncing Japan and shouting slogans.
"Stamp Japan into the ground. Leave Japan with nothing. The whole world should boycott Japanese people and their products," protesters chanted.
Protestor Wang Shuo said the government should consider using force if needed. "Japan is hurting the Chinese people," he told reporters.
Small groups protested at the Japanese consulate in Shanghai, while in Hong Kong, about a dozen activists scuffled with police as they attempted to march into Japan's consulate.
In Taiwan, which also claims the islands, about 50 protesters gathered outside Japan's representative office, a day after Taiwan recalled its representative to Japan.
Shanghai sports authorities said they were dropping the name of a Japanese company that sponsors their municipal marathon, Toray Industries Inc, in light of the dispute.
But despite the angry words and gestures, economic ties between Japan and China are deeper than ever and both are believed to want to keep the feud from getting out of control.
(Additional reporting by Ben Blanchard in Beijing, Sisi Tang in Hong Kong, Jonathan Standing in Taipei and Tomasz Janowski in Tokyo; Writing by John Ruwitch; Editing by Robert Birsel)
By Chris Buckley and Kiyoshi Takenaka | Reuters – Wed, Sep 12, 2012
BEIJING/TOKYO (Reuters) - China kept up its tough talk on Wednesday while Japan showed no sign of yielding in a dispute between the world's second and third biggest economies over uninhabited islets that has raised alarm in Washington and protests from Beijing to Taipei.
The long-running territorial dispute flared last month when Japan detained a group of Chinese activists who had landed on the islands, known as Senkaku in Japanese and Diaoyu in Chinese.
Tension increased on Tuesday when Japan, which controls the islands, said it had bought them from a private owner, ignoring warnings from China which responded by sending two patrol ships to reassert its claim, state media reported.
Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Hong Lei blamed Tokyo for the "grave condition" of China-Japan relations and warned that Japan must "pull back from the precipice".
"China will take necessary measures based on developments, and will staunchly protect national territorial integrity," he told a news conference, declining to be more specific.
Luo Zhaohui, the head of the Chinese Foreign Ministry's Asian department, met Shinsuke Sugiyama, Japan's visiting director-general of the Asian and Oceania Affairs, and vowed China would "never accept Japan's illegal occupation or so-called 'actual control' of the Diaoyu Islands".
But the ministry said both sides would "continue to keep in communication".
The Liberation Army Daily, the chief newspaper of China's military, rained scorn and warnings on Japan. Retired Major General Luo Yuan, a prominent foreign policy hawk, said China's forces were ready to defend its sovereignty.
Luo's comments echoed a warning from China's Ministry of Defense the previous day, and while the risk of military confrontation remained slim, the fiery words illustrate the domestic pressures for a tough response from Beijing.
"The Japanese government should not place its hopes in its so-called air and sea advantage. Chinese and Japanese forces have exchanged blows before," wrote Luo. "Nowadays, China's defense forces have achieved advances that nobody can belittle."
State television reported on Chinese military exercises that included amphibious landings.
NO RECONSIDERING
Japanese Foreign Minister Koichiro Gemba rejected Chinese demands that Japan reverse its decision to buy the islands.
"There is no way we would reconsider the transfer, acquisition and possession of their ownership right," Japan's Kyodo news agency quoted Gemba as saying.
Japan's coastguard said it was monitoring the seas around the islands but had not seen any Chinese patrol vessels.
A coastguard official said foreign ships approaching Japan's waters would be warned and asked to change course. If they failed to comply and entered Japanese waters, the coastguard would try to force them to change course.
U.S. Assistant Secretary of State Kurt Campbell cautioned China and Japan on Tuesday against escalating the dispute, saying the stakes "could not be bigger" and tension could have global repercussions.
The row led to anti-Japanese protests in China last month and on Wednesday groups of people approached the heavily guarded Japanese Embassy in Beijing, carrying banners denouncing Japan and shouting slogans.
"Stamp Japan into the ground. Leave Japan with nothing. The whole world should boycott Japanese people and their products," protesters chanted.
Protestor Wang Shuo said the government should consider using force if needed. "Japan is hurting the Chinese people," he told reporters.
Small groups protested at the Japanese consulate in Shanghai, while in Hong Kong, about a dozen activists scuffled with police as they attempted to march into Japan's consulate.
In Taiwan, which also claims the islands, about 50 protesters gathered outside Japan's representative office, a day after Taiwan recalled its representative to Japan.
Shanghai sports authorities said they were dropping the name of a Japanese company that sponsors their municipal marathon, Toray Industries Inc, in light of the dispute.
But despite the angry words and gestures, economic ties between Japan and China are deeper than ever and both are believed to want to keep the feud from getting out of control.
(Additional reporting by Ben Blanchard in Beijing, Sisi Tang in Hong Kong, Jonathan Standing in Taipei and Tomasz Janowski in Tokyo; Writing by John Ruwitch; Editing by Robert Birsel)
hey fuji, check it out, where do you think that picture is taken?
yes it is.
http://imageshack.us/a/img341/6884/72147467.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img84/5109/49235811.jpg
yes it is.
http://imageshack.us/a/img341/6884/72147467.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img84/5109/49235811.jpg
Just curious why the title of the thread isn't, "Japan ups the ante". It takes two to tango. I don't believe China was doing anything about its claim until Japan started trumpeting to the world that it had "bought" the islands, after detaining a bunch of Chinese who had gone there. On the other hand, once slapped in the face, the Chinese aren't exactly the type to turn the other cheek. It would have been better for everybody if Japan had let this sleeping dog lie.
Canada and Denmark have an ongoing dispute over Hans Island, but we manage to have that dispute without arresting each other--we take turn erecting flags and tearing down each other's flags, but we have the good sense to avoid both being on the island at the same time. Why did Japan feel it necessary to actually detain some Chinese nationals there? And then follow up on that by doubling down on its land claim?
Canada and Denmark have an ongoing dispute over Hans Island, but we manage to have that dispute without arresting each other--we take turn erecting flags and tearing down each other's flags, but we have the good sense to avoid both being on the island at the same time. Why did Japan feel it necessary to actually detain some Chinese nationals there? And then follow up on that by doubling down on its land claim?
hey fuji, check this one out, not exactly related but still interesting.
http://www.aviationweek.com/Blogs.a...79a7Post:95449fed-12dd-49d2-8479-a6e20a1cb3e5
http://www.aviationweek.com/Blogs.a...79a7Post:95449fed-12dd-49d2-8479-a6e20a1cb3e5
True and false in this case. Those guys were debating about it, and the design of this jet is different although it looks like a raptor. Also, the other rumour about this jet is there is a tail hook, which people speculation about a carrier based stealth jet.
They still believe in the people's war too. Check this one out. We know where they are going.
http://bbs.wforum.com/upfile/201209/20120916122135557823.jpg
http://bbs.wforum.com/upfile/201209/20120916122135557823.jpg
I like the look of the J-20 than the new so-called J-31 protype or whatever
http://imageshack.us/a/img208/3821/20120916013852479652.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img208/3821/20120916013852479652.jpg
besides the 85 city nation wide anti-protest over the weekend on the mainland, looks like Taiwan getting into the act
if the pic does not work, just hit refresh.
http://www.antiwar.com/photos/china-protest-091712.jpg
if the pic does not work, just hit refresh.
http://www.antiwar.com/photos/china-protest-091712.jpg
Quite good article on this by Sir Max Hastings: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...te/columnists/columnist-464/Max-Hastings.html
And now they have an aircraft carrier. An old creaky soviet one, but nevertheless, a mobile platform from which to launch fighters from, which gives them a force projection capability they have not previously had:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...ceives-first-aircraft-carrier/article4561868/
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...ceives-first-aircraft-carrier/article4561868/
Japan is a declining power and sometimes declining powers do silly things to try to restore their past prestige. The Japanese and Chinese are rational people, this matter will get resolved without a shooting war (no jihad here).
a peek inside
http://imageshack.us/a/img94/2540/20120925134857698573989.jpg
skid marks touch and go, sounds like what you would do in a Yonge Street establishment, all within house limits, lol
http://imageshack.us/a/img99/9361/t134857414194243.jpg
:Eek:
Chinese Nationalists in a water cannon fight.
http://imageshack.us/a/img708/3784/rdn5061220f8b8f6.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img708/3784/rdn5061220f8b8f6.jpg
That's not a bad idea, as a resolution to this current crisis.
In general, though, what really needs to happen is the Japanese need to open up and be a little more honest about their war crimes in the Second World War. What should be minor issues are flaring up into major confrontations in part because of all the latent anger the Chinese feel over those events.
You may think that they are long ago and should be forgotten, but I have met many people who have grandfathers nobody ever talks about. People from the Nanjing area. It's surprisingly common there. The legacy of that sort of crime is literally going to live on for generations, and it's going to go on generating intense anger in China until the Japanese start fessing up to what they did.
If that issue could be put into the past, I think it would be a lot easier for the two nations to sit down and negotiate sensible solutions to minor grievances.
