Chilcotin River landslide question

[Zoot Allures]

Over-top move of water at B.C. landslide site expected within hours, says government (msn.com)



The landslide has dammed the river meaning when it breaks it could be a catastrophe with torrents of waters carrying the refuse downstream

So, why did they not blow the dam up before the waters created a
lake behind the dam? If need be blow it up with missles

 

[SchlongConery]

Have a look at the scale of that amount of earth. It's wayyyyyyyyy too big to blow up. Not just the extreme mass of the slide, but its consistency.

There was likely discussions about bringing in a few 30-40 ton excavators and digging a channel to control the water. But from the size of the dig, the water would probably top the earth dam before they could get equipment in and start excavating.

Even if they did get a channel dug, once the water started flowing it would erode the banks and start cutting back the banks etc and creating a bigger problem with unrestricted erosion.. Probably best was to leave it alone and let the water top the dam along the entire face and let whatever channels develop will more gradual.

Time will tell.

But short of a buried nuclear bomb, seriously, you ain't going to move that much dirt with conventional explosives.

 

[Zoot Allures]

Have a look at the scale of that amount of earth. It's wayyyyyyyyy too big to blow up. Not just the extreme mass of the slide, but its consistency.

There was likely discussions about bringing in a few 30-40 ton excavators and digging a channel to control the water. But from the size of the dig, the water would probably top the earth dam before they could get equipment in and start excavating.

Even if they did get a channel dug, once the water started flowing it would erode the banks and start cutting back the banks etc and creating a bigger problem with unrestricted erosion.. Probably best was to leave it alone and let the water top the dam along the entire face and let whatever channels develop will more gradual.

Time will tell.

But short of a buried nuclear bomb, seriously, you ain't going to move that much dirt with conventional explosives.

Yeah, I can see that, but in my defense I was not thinking blowing the whole slide up just a path where the water could drain . The key point is reducing the build up of water as the bigger that lake gets ... It is a desperate move but I thought they could try something and it would be fun to watch

Start bombing where the lake starts then the waters would rush in
while they bomb a path for the water. It would be a contest between the energy of water vs the strength of the dam

I must sound like Donald Trump when he tweeted the President of France to water bomb Notre Dame , at best such an act would of destroyed the very building they were trying to save

BTW, my proposal is really an exercise in creative thinking,

The rules of such an exercise is no ridiculing allowed as often what seems like a stupid idea can be honed down to something productive

Some of the ideas will be stupid, they are supposed to be, but the exercise is not

It is done all the time in serious think tanks

 

[SchlongConery]

Yeah, I can see that, but in my defense I was not thinking blowing the whole slide up just a path where the water could drain . The key point is reducing the build up of water as the bigger that lake gets ... It is a desperate move but I thought they could try something and it would be fun to watch

Start bombing where the lake starts then the waters would rush in
while they bomb a path for the water. It would be a contest between the energy of water vs the strength of the dam

I must sound like Donald Trump when he tweeted the President of France to water bomb Notre Dame , at best such an act would of destroyed the very building they were trying to save

BTW, my proposal is really an exercise in creative thinking,

The rules of such an exercise is no ridiculing allowed as often what seems like a stupid idea can be honed down to something productive

Some of the ideas will be stupid, they are supposed to be, but the exercise is not

It is done all the time in serious think tanks

I agree with your points about thinking out of the box.

I hope I didn't come across as criticizing *you*, just analyzing the earth moving. I must sound like the biggest BS artist but believe it or not, I owned a smallish limestone quarry and also have done several medium sized civil works projects, one moving 20,000 yards of material with scrapers, dozers and excavators. And I was consulting on a company involved in the oilsands so saw some of the largest, HUGE excavators in the world operating up close! All these required blasting and moving massive amounts of material. To put it in perspective, have a look at any downtown condo excavation and imagine how many thousands of buckets and truckloads that one parking garage takes to dig.

I learned that brute force can only be used to some extent. Moving dirt requires thinking and planning. The best man on the excavator is not the guy that can comb your hair with the bucket, but the one who can think how to swing the least and move the most efficiently.

In this case, I think the water will top the landslide at the lowest point(s) and then create a series of trickle creeks through the contours. I really don't think that the river is going to blow open that much material like say the Ukrainian dam the Russians blew up. But it WILL fuck up the salmon and every other aquatic animal that relies on a silt-free river bed.

 

[Zoot Allures]

I agree with your points about thinking out of the box.

To be more precise, my idea is about how to think outside the box,
What you do is consider the ridiculous then hone the idea down to something practical as you consider the idea

I hope I didn't come across as criticizing *you*, just analyzing the earth moving.

We are on the same page. I appreciate your insights

I must sound like the biggest BS artist but believe it or not, I owned a smallish limestone quarry and also have done several medium sized civil works projects, one moving 20,000 yards of material with scrapers, dozers and excavators. And I was consulting on a company involved in the oilsands so saw some of the largest, HUGE excavators in the world operating up close! All these required blasting and moving massive amounts of material. To put it in perspective, have a look at any downtown condo excavation and imagine how many thousands of buckets and truckloads that one parking garage takes to dig.

I learned that brute force can only be used to some extent. Moving dirt requires thinking and planning. The best man on the excavator is not the guy that can comb your hair with the bucket, but the one who can think how to swing the least and move the most efficiently.

In this case, I think the water will top the landslide at the lowest point(s) and then create a series of trickle creeks through the contours. I really don't think that the river is going to blow open that much material like say the Ukrainian dam the Russians blew up. But it WILL fuck up the salmon and every other aquatic animal that relies on a silt-free river bed.

I was thinking the same thing about the salmon migration

As to whether the dam is gonna explode is unknown. A slide dam has happened before but not with this big of a slide so we charting new waters, pun intended
.

This is a very interesting situation as they are preparing for the worse and hoping it does not happen

 

[wigglee]

Trump should throw them some paper towels!

 

[Zoot Allures]

Trump should throw them some paper towels!

This is not a politics thread but , yeah, Trump is a meglomaniac who thinks he knows more than the experts just because he thinks it, from global warming to covid to election stealing to blowing up mexican drug cartel headquarters with patriot missles ( patriot missiles are ground to air not ground to ground) to economics ( increasing import duty taxes are paid by the importer not exporter) international affairs
( Russia, Afganistan, NATO) , border security, Christianity etc so I suspect Trump come up with an idea about the slide that he thinks is ingenious then we could help Schlong tear him apart.

Schlong has convinced me the best solution is to do nothing except get people out of the way and plan to deal with the aftermath as a lot of the logs and dirt may need to be cleaned up, but we will not know that until the crying is over

 

[Zoot Allures]

The dam has broken.

Major concern is impact on Salmon, trees floating downstream, bridge collapses and erosion esp where rivers turn

Apparently, it just gave way instead of slow ebbing out of waters