Ashley Madison

At least 62 killed in plane crash at South Korea airport

Ginomore

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Jul 8, 2011
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Interesting take. A lot about the pilot's behavior doesn't make sense. For one thing, he was travelling extremely fast, I don't know if he could have stopped before hitting the wall even if he had proper landing gear deployed.
He may have tried to get airborne again after realizing the landing gear was not down.
 
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poorboy

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Interesting early analysis by Juan Brown.

Most interesting to me is one of the comments, and those following that comment that resonates with me in my experience. (Bold added by me)


ORIGINAL COMMENT :

"18 year 737 Captain here. Nice analysis Juan. They rushed this approach for unknown reasons and failed to drop the gear or extend the flaps. I can’t foresee any reason for this except if you think both engines are failing. Even then, you can drop the gear quickly and electronically extend some flaps.

This accident is why I won’t fly on any airline with non-western trained pilots.

As a human factors instructor (formally known as CRM), there have been way too many avoidable crashes with Asian crews. Usually due to the FO refusing to speak up to an authoritative Captain even when they know a bad outcome is likely. In the west, we learned these lessons the hard way and started teaching CRM and empowering the FO to speak up."



FOLLOW ON COMMENTS TO THE ABOVE;



"Definitely a cultural aspect to this. When I was an instructor at Mitsubishi Aerospace, we taught promising people to build wings and center fuselage for a couple of bizjets. Students from Philippines, India, Pakistan - all had the same reaction to my asking yes/no questions of them on a one-on-one basis - they ALWAYS answered "yes." Regardless of their understanding of a process just described or demonstrated. "Did you understand?" Answer was always "yes" even when it was clear they did not grasp it yet. They were afraid of saying "no" to anyone perceived to be in authority. I had to spend some time explaining to them that it was okay, even encouraged to say "no" or admit you didn't know something. This is a nut to be cracked if you want safety in aerospace everywhere."


- "The FO not speaking is a cultural issue that caused a Korean crash several years ago."


- That was the exact issues with Asiana 214. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asiana_Airlines_Flight_214




It's not just Asian cultures, and speaking up is not enough. They need to take control. The PIC ignored the copilot on this Canadian owned airline operated by Canadians which resulted in this crash.

First Air captain ignored co-pilot's warnings before Nunavut crash | CBC News
 
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SchlongConery

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It's not just Asian cultures, and speaking up is not enough. They need to take control. The PIC ignored the copilot on this Canadian owned airline operated by Canadians which resulted in this crash.

First Air captain ignored co-pilot's warnings before Nunavut crash | CBC News
I agree with you 100% that it is not JUST Asian cultures. I'm sorry if I implied that. But southpaw's link better explains why certain cultures are reluctant to speak up etc.

The FO in the FA crash pretty much did all that he could given the circumstances but he did it all too late. @wiskey bravo mentioned that pay (and being junior in Seniority ?) has an effect too. Too bad there are guys who made it as Captain simply by putting in the hours and time to get promoted. There are some Captains that simply don't have the aptitude to be the leader.
 

Conil

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Apr 12, 2013
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Nova Scotia

Passengers report flames as Air Canada flight suffers ‘suspected landing gear issue’ after landing


An Air Canada Express flight “experienced a suspected landing gear issue” after arriving at Halifax Stanfield International Airport in Nova Scotia on Saturday night, though no injuries were reported, according to the airline.

Flight AC2259 – which took off from St. John’s, Newfoundland – was subsequently “unable to reach the terminal and customers were offloaded using a bus,” Air Canada spokesperson Peter Fitzpatrick said in a statement to CNN. The flight, operated by partner PAL Airlines, was carrying 73 passengers, the statement said.

The plane – a De Havilland DHC-8-402, according to the Transportation Safety Board of Canada – skidded down the runway for a “decent” distance, and passengers saw flames on the aircraft’s left side, passenger Nikki Valentine told CNN newsgathering partner CBC.

“The plane shook quite a bit and we started seeing fire on the left side of the plane and smoke started coming in the windows,” Valentine said.

The Halifax incident echoed a far more severe – and deadly – incident in South Korea on Sunday morning local time, when a Jeju Air flight crash-landed at Muan International Airport, killing 179 people. Officials and aviation experts say a landing gear malfunction appears likely in that incident.

While no one was hurt in Halifax, “we appreciated this incident was unsettling for customers and we remain available to assist them,” Air Canada’s statement said.

The airfield was closed for about 90 minutes before one of its two runways was cleared for flight operations, Tiffany Chase, a spokesperson for the Halifax International Airport Authority, said in a statement.

“Four flights were diverted and there were a handful of cancellations and delays while the airfield was closed,” she added.

The incident will be investigated by the Transportation Safety Board of Canada, which in a notice Sunday said it was deploying a team of investigators to the airport. They are expected to arrive later Sunday.

In the meantime, the aircraft remains on the runway, Chase said. Air Canada is waiting for the Transportation Safety Board to release the aircraft before returning customers’ belongings.

The cause of the suspected landing gear issue is unknown, the airline said, adding, “Out of respect for the investigative process we cannot speculate and have no additional information to provide at this time.”

 

JeanGary Diablo

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Aug 5, 2017
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The antennae at the end of runways are supposed to be freestanding, not embedded on concrete walls, for the very reason of avoiding disasters like this.
They were talking with an aviation expert on the news and he said it's unfathomable that a major airport would have a concrete wall anywhere near a runway.
 
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