Assault Rifles for Miami Police

[LancsLad]

I don't know if JMW was for or against the cops being equipped but as for my opinion, give the cops whatever they need to do their job effectively.

As for an AR, not the best weapon for a frontline officer to have. The 223 round is so light it probably wouldn't go through a door. I know in Vietnam that soldiers were complaining that it would hit a twig or small branch and deflect away from the target.

Now sub-machine guns like the MP5 or MP7, they are spray and pray weapons. Because of the high rate of climb when on full or semi auto after the first two shots, you're lucky to be shooting anything but the ceiling.

DQ can speak to the 'Nam use of the .223 , we used the FN 7.62mm which packed a mean punch. In combat training where you are encouraged to always be alert in your surroundigs for potential cover. The effectiveness of each weapons potential to penetrate different materials was demonstrated. The .223 would get lodged in a small tree but the 7.62 round would go thru and be a bloody wide slug coming out the other side. Same with water barrels. Cong used to fighting Americans were in for a big surprise when they later encountered Aussies with the FN.

As to full auto climb, thats why you are taught three shot bursts.

 

[Keebler Elf]

I thought assault rifles were relatively standard issue for police officers these days and kept in the trunk of the cruiser.

Guess not as commonplace as I thought.

 

[ig-88]

Maybe I'm a bleeding heart, but I believe in continuing research on non-lethal weapons.

There are rubber bullets, sprays, odor weapons, even smoke that causes people to puke and crap.

I think the job of police is to subdue and apprehend the suspect; they are not the military. I would hope that future advancements in technology would allow this to be done without resorting to lethal force.

 

[tboy]

IG...you can't be serious.....so, the bad guys are letting loose with AK's and assault weapons and you want to shoot rubber bullets at them? Or throw a stink bomb?

Hell, why don't we just take all weapons off the cops and just tell them to use harsh words!

I can see it now: some perp has a 10 gauge pistol grip shotgun or a .44 desert eagle and is taking out cops left and right and they are yelling: PUT DOWN YOUR WEAPONS OR YOU'RE GOING TO GET SCOLDED WITHIN AN INCH OF YOUR LIFE!!!

Dude: I guess you never saw that video of the guy taking multiple hits from rubber bullets and STILL standing and waving his gun around....

 

[l69norm]

..The 223 round is so light it probably wouldn't go through a door...

Ford police cars can now be ordered with ceramic armored doors and fire suppression systems
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KT9nP_3ULJ8
https://www.fleet.ford.com/downloads/CVPI/BallisticDoorHC_LR.pdf

 

[Bear669]

I think what cops really need..

...is ceramic body armour!

But yah, all in favour of giving them whatever they need to shoot back. BUT they also need constant training. Read an expert article last year that noted most cops range time with shotguns is a joke (but not funny).

 

[tboy]

...is ceramic body armour!

But yah, all in favour of giving them whatever they need to shoot back. BUT they also need constant training. Read an expert article last year that noted most cops range time with shortguns is a joke (but not funny).

Funny as it may sound, and unbelievable, is the fact that the majority of police officers never have to draw their weapon throughout their entire career.

What we see on the news and internet are the worst case scenarios and really, is a cop giving out a ticket newsworthy? No...so what we see is the actions taking place in the high risk/high crime areas.

I used to moor my boat next to a cop and he always had his cop buddies over. One night we were shooting the shit and the subject came up (drawing their weapon) and not a one had ever drawn it while on duty.....

 

[LancsLad]

...is ceramic body armour!

But yah, all in favour of giving them whatever they need to shoot back. BUT they also need constant training. Read an expert article last year that noted most cops range time with shortguns is a joke (but not funny).

ceramic plate armour is OK in the right instances. Perhaps for the SWAT 4 man room entry team but it is generally cumbersome, heavy and severely restricts mobility. While the breast and back plate provide proper protection you are still exposed above, below and at the sides. When I have used it I was surprised that something so good at stopping a bullet was so fragile if it was dropped on its end. very brittle.

Last fall doing a tactical course that included some police officers paying for it with their own money I was amazed at how little range time and tactical draw situation training many officers receive.

 

[KBear]

Cops are more trained to diffuse a situation, they are not really trained to be effective in gunfights. A shotgun would be good for the average cop to keep in their trunk. Not sure about putting an assault rifle in the hands of the average cop walking about in the city.

Believe to qualify for pistols the cops have to hit a target about the size of a stop sign at fifteen feet. Shooting a handgun rapid fire and hitting a target, like seen on TV, takes dedicated almost daily training. Being in a gunfight is not really something a cop is expected to do.

 

[tboy]

Kbear: I thought I saw somewhere that the police are regularly tested to insure they can continue to hit that stop sign.... I think it was on TVO, a show about a couple of female OPP officers....maybe it's different for city/provincial police.....

 

[KBear]

Don’t know the details, think they do have to be retested. Point was that cops are not required to be very skilled in the use of guns. Giving cops assault rifles that they would be carrying around in public does not sound like a great idea.

 

[tboy]

I mean, you'd have to assume that before they get to carry one they'd have SOME training lol...but hey, stranger things have happened!

 

[laytexlover]

Lock N Load...........

 

[baci2004]

I say give them what they need. If I were a cop I would want everything at my disposal, who knows what might happen on any given day? It's better to have a gun and not need it than to need a gun and not have it.

That being said I think a 12 gauge is a great secondary weapon for a city cop. They have a variety of rounds for different situations, and they can also fire safe rounds as well. I think the most important thing that a shotgun offers over a rifle is that it is less likely to kill an innocent bystander because of it's range limitations.

 

[Mack Bolan]

He is a weapon that they should get
http://world.guns.ru/smg/smg96-e.htm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2kEg8rEPl8