Indulge in Toronto, continue to work on marriage or both?

Newjackoff24 · Jul 12, 2026

forest said:
The issue of distractions is discussed in the book Come as You Are by Emily Nagoski where she explains women have sex accelerators and brakes. Despite how much someone tries to turn on a woman, if there are major brakes going on the car isn't going anywhere. It seems from what the OP has written, his wife's strong religious beliefs, concerns about the kids, and other life issues are holding her back so it is that much more difficult to press the pedal to get her moving.

Based on the book's recommendations, try to address some of the brakes before focusing on the accelerators. The book is pretty dry in that it does not describe any sexual techniques but I believe for anybody in a long term relationship, it explains the physiological issues that many women have that men just don't know about. Regardless of what the OP does, I hope he and his wife find something that makes both of them happy.

Yes, and we have experienced some real brakes in our marriage/sexual relationship, stressors with family and raising kids and priorities, which we have openly discussed. Those are largely in the past now so things are looking up.

Imo, the other big hurdle was religion and we have had a number of discussions about that as well, navigating faith and fantasy. I feel like I've been pretty open about my ideas and based on our conversations, and her positive experiences (both in orgasms, her demeanor afterwards, very at ease and no awkwardness at all, and our day to day) it's just a matter of both of us continuing to follow through.

I think her masturbating and cumming during the erotic infidelity fantasy story I read to her while massaging her earlier this week shows that she capable of trusting fantasy as an outlet for pleasure, letting go, and having creative fun. Went to church today, too. I actually made a reference to our sexual play on the way to church and she was laughing about it good naturedly.

signo_log · Jul 12, 2026

Newjackoff24 said:
Club Dynasty had some ladies on there that I was eyeing. Emma, Roxanne, Melina, Demi, Gia, Veronika, Carmen. Nice facilities.

Flirt: Adriene, Emily, Leena.

For me, it would be no kissing and topless only. I would ask about fetish play and by that I simply mean I would have shown my masseuse pics of my wife (clothed), recounted my sad journey, and played some audio of my wife cumming when I pounded her pussy with a dildo, and after a nice massage just jerk off while staring at my pretty masseuse and then enjoy them cleaning me up. In my head, I would do three spa girls in one day, am at opening. 2 or 3 pm and then a very late evening. Not sure if that is realistic? I don't care about the money, just looking for the experience in a safe setting.

Also a visit to Club M4, assuming I'm not exhausted, to get a lay of the land. Next day I would do another spa gal and save the rest of my cum for a Thu Bukkake, assuming I could join in. Or I would just watch.

Departure day I would visit another spa for one last load.

I had a hotel central to the airport and spas. Burner phone and Life 360 ready to go. Already prepped her for a late arrival on Friday (even though conf already ended).

thanks for sharing! Sounds like it would have been a packed trip!

forest · Jul 12, 2026

Newjackoff24 said:
Yes, and we have experienced some real brakes in our marriage/sexual relationship, stressors with family and raising kids and priorities, which we have openly discussed. Those are largely in the past now so things are looking up.

Imo, the other big hurdle was religion and we have had a number of discussions about that as well, navigating faith and fantasy. I feel like I've been pretty open about my ideas and based on our conversations, and her positive experiences (both in orgasms, her demeanor afterwards, very at ease and no awkwardness at all, and our day to day) it's just a matter of both of us continuing to follow through.

I think her masturbating and cumming during the erotic infidelity fantasy story I read to her while massaging her earlier this week shows that she capable of trusting fantasy as an outlet for pleasure, letting go, and having creative fun. Went to church today, too. I actually made a reference to our sexual play on the way to church and she was laughing about it good naturedly.

Ack, I just realized my post said physiological instead of psychological but I assume you got the point. It's good that you feel progress is being made and both of you are working towards a mutual goal. Your response reads very similar to examples of couples the author of the book wrote about where both are trying to figure out how each can be happy with their sex life.

dudeman77 · Jul 16, 2026

Newjackoff24 said:
I'm the kind of person who would want to go on a $8-$10K trip with my wife as opposed to her going with someone else. She asked to go, and I wasn't about to essentially forbid it. I was curious whether she would actually do it. We hadn't been on an extended trip together in years so doing it over our 25th is pretty tacky and she has admitted as much. I'm not saying it's a green light for me to screw around, I'm saying it provides some context for what's going on in the marriage. I would never even dream of doing that with a buddy. Ever.

late to the thread but where exactly did she go overseas? and how do you know she didn't cheat on you while she was abroad? i would have hired a PI to tail and double check this. I would also hire one anyways and check if she is cheating with you at home.

Its sad because she sounds like the perfect wife but doesn't seem to want to satisfy you, check out the twitter account The Transformed Wife, she gives a lot of biblical advice to women on how they should be in marriage, including satisfying their husbands, maybe it can help her realize sex is a glue that keeps a marriage together. you mentioned she's italian, i'd probably find other older italian women (a grandma or such) and hire them to figure out why she's like that, is it common with italian women as they get older, whats the cure etc.

also you getting into shape/fit can help, as other women notice it and may act flirty with you, she may pick up on that and decide to be more sexually competitive (there is a whole long art to this called dread game, basically just the thought of other women competing for you makes them put out more, but its tricky to do)

Otherwise, if I were you, I would keep the marriage together (since you say everything else is good) and just use escorts without telling her.

xix · Jul 16, 2026

dudeman77 said:
late to the thread but where exactly did she go overseas? and how do you know she didn't cheat on you while she was abroad? i would have hired a PI to tail and double check this. I would also hire one anyways and check if she is cheating with you at home.

also you getting into shape/fit can help, as other women notice it and may act flirty with you, she may pick up on that and decide to be more sexually competitive (there is a whole long art to this called dread game, basically just the thought of other women competing for you makes them put out more, but its tricky to do)

Otherwise, if I were you, I would keep the marriage together (since you say everything else is good) and just use escorts without telling her.

Wow this is good.

Maybe he will find or can find a Italian woman - which the priest may recommend - at her own church. That way it will be more comfortable for her.

Newjackoff24 · Jul 16, 2026

dudeman77 said:
late to the thread but where exactly did she go overseas? and how do you know she didn't cheat on you while she was abroad? i would have hired a PI to tail and double check this. I would also hire one anyways and check if she is cheating with you at home.

Its sad because she sounds like the perfect wife but doesn't seem to want to satisfy you, check out the twitter account The Transformed Wife, she gives a lot of biblical advice to women on how they should be in marriage, including satisfying their husbands, maybe it can help her realize sex is a glue that keeps a marriage together. you mentioned she's italian, i'd probably find other older italian women (a grandma or such) and hire them to figure out why she's like that, is it common with italian women as they get older, whats the cure etc.

also you getting into shape/fit can help, as other women notice it and may act flirty with you, she may pick up on that and decide to be more sexually competitive (there is a whole long art to this called dread game, basically just the thought of other women competing for you makes them put out more, but its tricky to do)

Otherwise, if I were you, I would keep the marriage together (since you say everything else is good) and just use escorts without telling her.

She was with a friend and a family member the whole time. She didn't cheat. If she had, at least that would have been exciting. It was much more boring than that, just spending lots of my money for a trip on her own.

I'm in decent shape, do need to drop another ten pounds but agree that's important for my own self image and her sense of attraction.

If I felt it was going downhill after all this renewed effort I would keep the marriage together but just find some play time on the side.

castoffpearl · Jul 19, 2026

@Newjackoff24

glad to hear you cancelled the trip and you continued to work on your relationship. I had the opportunity a couple weeks ago when my wife was out of town and I (barely) resisted the urge.

Sad to say that my relationship is worse. Every time I try something to repair it, I feel stuck even deeper in a hole. every time.

So, glad you took my advice, but I'm starting to wonder why I can't listen to myself.

John_John · Jul 24, 2026

Newjackoff24 said:
Hello, looking for some advice. I realize I could hire a therapist (and I have spoken to one) but I bet there are some people here in similar circumstances so I'm curious about what you all may think about my options.

I'm a married man in his late 40s, my wife is a good person but she admits her priorities during our marriage aren't what they should have been. She's a very conservative Catholic and she spent last 10 years focusing on everything but me (kids, church ministry, school and her friends). By way of example, she chose to spend our 25th anniversary overseas-- without me. We have uncreative sex every 2 to 3 weeks over last 20 plus years, and I finally had enough. I finally told her I jack off to porn frequently but that my preference would be for us to better connect in and outside the bedroom.

We have had a lot of talks and since then, and I think we have made strides (like reading erotic stories, erotic role playing, she jacks me off to pictures of sexy women, and we get away at least once a month together). We were much better for a time but the last few months it's fizzled. She rarely takes any initiative for sex or just spending time together as a couple or to continue what we started.

When she was overseas two years ago during our 25th, I planned a sex vacation in Toronto. Tickets, hotel and a list of female masseuses I was going to hire in addition to visiting a sex club. I cancelled my trip last minute to instead work on our marriage. But I could have gone wild if I wanted to. Well, I have another trip that I could take a detour in Toronto and I'm debating whether I should fulfill my earlier desires. I don't want to have sex with other women (I'm serious, I don't) but I'm very happy to do a lot of other things like visiting a sex club and just watching all the glorious fucking and also go to an erotic massage and just jack off to my hearts content. I won't get many chances for a cover story so if I'm going to be stuck in a marital rut, I want to take advantage of this Toronto opportunity.

Or I could instead go back to the drawing board (again) and see if I can our relationship back on track. I mean, when I think about some of the erotic things we have done in the last 2 years as compared to last 20 or so, it's pretty impressive. I'm proud of that. And her. But I feel like it could all fall apart and sometimes I'm tired of being the only one to pursue and prioritize our relationship

Or, heck I just do both.

Thoughts?

I was in the same boat 3 years ago, we went to a sex therapist and slowly started communicating our needs more. This opened her up to trying new things slowly and then we went to a sex club and that opened things up further as it was a turn on for her. Three years later l, we've been to two sex resorts and are slowly increasing our repertoire.

I highly recommend a sex therapist, not a couples therapist. It helped to rationalize the religious part of her upbringing.

Newjackoff24 · Jul 25, 2026

John_John said:
I was in the same boat 3 years ago, we went to a sex therapist and slowly started communicating our needs more. This opened her up to trying new things slowly and then we went to a sex club and that opened things up further as it was a turn on for her. Three years later l, we've been to two sex resorts and are slowly increasing our repertoire.

I highly recommend a sex therapist, not a couples therapist. It helped to rationalize the religious part of her upbringing.

that's incredible. I would love to do that but I think she would insist on a Christian therapist and my bet is most of them have cliches and vanilla responses to offer. I'm curious, how religious is your wife? It's central to my wife's identity...

Jami77 · Jul 25, 2026

A few of the posters on here have mentioned getting fit etc. The idea of working on yourself to make yourself attractive to your wife again. I agree totally and it make sense t step back and see how women in general work so you can see where you are going wrong...

There's a few books on the psychology of women that I could recommend that would allow you to see just how her brain works - I've found reading these a real eye opener and when you start understanding women you can see how you can... man I don't want to say it but... manipulate her...

You learn how to act around her and how to manipulate the relationship. Lots of the books will tell you that you have to continue to game your wife after getting married and failure to do so will result in divorce..... So get fit, get outside hobbies, manly hobbies (martial arts etc) and make yourself attractive once more....

Tucker Max wrote a book called "Mate" alongside a psychologist and it says basically you have to be the best you can be to attract women. It applies in marriages too.

The other books I would recommend are -
- The Mans Guide to Women by John Gottman - This is a top #1 recommendation - Gottman is a leading marriage/relationships researcher and has followed couples for years to find out how to make things work. Its not boring - its actually a key book for the pick up artist community too.

Also...
- The Married Man Sex Life Primer by Athol Kay
- Why Women Have Sex by Cindy M Meston
- Mating in Captivity by Esther Perel - Instead of going to see a sex therapist - just read the book written by the worlds best one. She is basically the sex counsellor to the rich and famous - costs $100,000s of dollars just to get in the room with her.

(FYI - A quick trick if you have AI - Chatgpt, claude etc... ask the AI to summarise the books and give key takeaways.... saves having to buy and read them)

Finally I would also recommend a course called Shogun Method Married Game - it covers all the basics such as making yourself a better man etc... but then it goes into more controversial stuff - basically there are stages - start with working on yourself and then go down different levels until something works - the mid range things might involve self improvement and hanging out with other women (cooking classes etc), then onto a bit of flirting, then onto flirting with your wife's friends... then the extreme things might involve fractionation, dread game, gaslighting, having affairs etc.

Definitely worth the money - https://shogunmethod.net/shogun-method-for-married-men-info/

Just reading the sales page is hugely entertaining and will give you some pointers...

The key thing is your wife hasnt given up - some men dont have sex at all - so the fact that she does shows she still has interest... now you just have to stoke those flames!

lurkerjoe · Jul 25, 2026

Newjackoff24 said:
I've usually branched out (cam to cam and strip club) when I've been frustrated with her. Moving forward, if I do this, I would rather just enjoy the extracurricular playtime minus the feelings of irritation. There are times she seems very free spirited about sex and other times it's like her memory was wiped, and that drives me nuts. What's the point of progress if she acts like it's the first time I'm bringing up the thing we did or talked about? But either way, it's not worth it. I don't want to live feeling disgruntled. I don't hide it well so it's not benefiting anyone.

If I do the extracurricular playtime, I'm just going to resolve to also enjoy the challenge of trying to see how far we as a couple can branch out with erotica and fantasy, etc. even if we have to take a step forward and one back from time to time.

Women sometimes have cycles of cold and hot. Have you tried tracking her free spirited times and when she shuts down? If there’s a pattern there’s nothing much you can do. Unlike men who are pretty much down for sex any day, women aren’t like that and are held much more of a hostage to her hormonal cycles.

Jami77 · Jul 25, 2026

lurkerjoe said:
Women sometimes have cycles of cold and hot. Have you tried tracking her free spirited times and when she shuts down? If there’s a pattern there’s nothing much you can do. Unlike men who are pretty much down for sex any day, women aren’t like that and are held much more of a hostage to her hormonal cycles.

Strangely enough I have a friend who swears he can track his wife's moods and cycles based on the phases of the moon. I've tried period tracker apps to keep an eye on the moods...That does work well... But now every time I notice a bad mood in the evening I look out the window to see what the moon is doing...

Someone should create an app -a mood/moon tracker.

Newjackoff24 · Jul 25, 2026

Jami77 said:
A few of the posters on here have mentioned getting fit etc. The idea of working on yourself to make yourself attractive to your wife again. I agree totally and it make sense t step back and see how women in general work so you can see where you are going wrong...

There's a few books on the psychology of women that I could recommend that would allow you to see just how her brain works - I've found reading these a real eye opener and when you start understanding women you can see how you can... man I don't want to say it but... manipulate her...

You learn how to act around her and how to manipulate the relationship. Lots of the books will tell you that you have to continue to game your wife after getting married and failure to do so will result in divorce..... So get fit, get outside hobbies, manly hobbies (martial arts etc) and make yourself attractive once more....

Tucker Max wrote a book called "Mate" alongside a psychologist and it says basically you have to be the best you can be to attract women. It applies in marriages too.

The other books I would recommend are -
- The Mans Guide to Women by John Gottman - This is a top #1 recommendation - Gottman is a leading marriage/relationships researcher and has followed couples for years to find out how to make things work. Its not boring - its actually a key book for the pick up artist community too.

Also...
- The Married Man Sex Life Primer by Athol Kay
- Why Women Have Sex by Cindy M Meston
- Mating in Captivity by Esther Perel - Instead of going to see a sex therapist - just read the book written by the worlds best one. She is basically the sex counsellor to the rich and famous - costs $100,000s of dollars just to get in the room with her.

(FYI - A quick trick if you have AI - Chatgpt, claude etc... ask the AI to summarise the books and give key takeaways.... saves having to buy and read them)

Finally I would also recommend a course called Shogun Method Married Game - it covers all the basics such as making yourself a better man etc... but then it goes into more controversial stuff - basically there are stages - start with working on yourself and then go down different levels until something works - the mid range things might involve self improvement and hanging out with other women (cooking classes etc), then onto a bit of flirting, then onto flirting with your wife's friends... then the extreme things might involve fractionation, dread game, gaslighting, having affairs etc.

Definitely worth the money - https://shogunmethod.net/shogun-method-for-married-men-info/

Just reading the sales page is hugely entertaining and will give you some pointers...

The key thing is your wife hasnt given up - some men dont have sex at all - so the fact that she does shows she still has interest... now you just have to stoke those flames!

I agree on the fitness. I'm in decent shape, work out 4 days a week but still could drop 10 pounds. I just need to follow through and get it done. I don't want to go the old grandpa route of continuing to put on weight year after year.

I'm actually thinking of seeing a sex coach on the side. Online. She's cute and open minded, actually talked with two just to get a feel for their approach. I plan to share some of my story and see how they can help, ideas.

Newjackoff24 · Jul 25, 2026

lurkerjoe said:
Women sometimes have cycles of cold and hot. Have you tried tracking her free spirited times and when she shuts down? If there’s a pattern there’s nothing much you can do. Unlike men who are pretty much down for sex any day, women aren’t like that and are held much more of a hostage to her hormonal cycles.

Interesting. I haven't. But might be worth it.

I tend to attribute most of the down periods to her apathy and then just bad memory. I sometimes honestly thinks she forgets how she was in the moment. I'm wonder if she has a different recollection of what happened during the last erotic story and that was not even a week ago. I kid you not, but when I read the climax of the story when she is riding this very hot native born guy's large, circumcised cock, and he's sucking her breasts, and I wrote that he starts ejaculating thick ropes of cum deep in her married pussy, I kid you not my wife was literally masturbating and having a very loud orgasm as I read it. I mean loud, her eyes were closed, mouth open, she was quivering and shaking as she rubbed it out. I was close to her ear, speaking all the dirty filthy words about this other guy's hands on her ass helping her slam into him, his cream dripping out of her and them French kissing and just loving on each other in -our- bedroom. Thank goodness I audio recorded it, ha.

John_John · Tuesday at 3:39 PM

Newjackoff24 said:
that's incredible. I would love to do that but I think she would insist on a Christian therapist and my bet is most of them have cliches and vanilla responses to offer. I'm curious, how religious is your wife? It's central to my wife's identity...

Very religious, that's what took so long to come around, separating religion, identity and human sexuality

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Indulge in Toronto, continue to work on marriage or both?

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