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European Leaders Warn That Conscription Will Be Necessary As The EU Launches An $840 Billion Program To Prepare For War With Russia

oil&gas

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Apr 16, 2002
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Ghawar
March 4, 2025

If you were drafted, would you willingly go to the killing fields of eastern Ukraine? What about your children? The war in Ukraine has been an endless “meat grinder” that has already claimed hundreds of thousands of Russian lives and more than a million Ukrainian lives. Those that are sane want to see if there is a peaceful way out of this mess so that the killing can stop. Unfortunately, vast numbers of leftists all over the United States and western Europe have been transformed into rabid pro-war lunatics that are absolutely obsessed with “defeating” Russia. So gigantic mountains of dollars and euros have been poured into the war in Ukraine, but it hasn’t worked. The Russians are winning, and so now European leaders are preparing to take things to the next level.

On Tuesday, Ursula von der Leyen unveiled a brand new $840 billion program that will be known as “Rearm Europe”…

The European Union will free up $840 billion in funding to funnel into defense across the bloc, European Commission chief Ursula von der Leyen announced on Tuesday.

Interestingly, this new effort was announced just a few hours after President Trump paused all U.S. military aid to the Ukrainians…

Dubbed “Rearm Europe,” the remarks from the European Commission’s president came hours after President Donald Trump suspended all U.S. military aid to Ukraine, widening the gulf between Washington and Kyiv and going against the fresh commitments of support from Europe for Ukraine in recent days.

“I do not need to describe the grave nature of the threats that we face, or the devastating consequences that we will have to endure if those threats would come to pass,” von der Leyen told reporters.

Of course money won’t be enough to accomplish what European leaders have planned.

They are going to need warm bodies as well.

As most of you know, elections were just held in Germany, and the group that won is apparently pushing for a rapid reintroduction of “compulsory military service”…

Germany’s conservatives, who are set to lead the next government, on Tuesday argued that the country should quickly reintroduce compulsory military service.

Friedrich Merz, head of the CDU/CSU bloc that topped last month’s elections, has argued that in the era of US President Donald Trump, Europe will have to better handle its own security.

If I was a young person in Germany right now, I would be extremely concerned.

A spokesperson for the group that will be heading up the new government has publicly stated that the first new conscripts “will have to walk through the barracks gates in 2025”…

The defence policy spokesman of his centre-right alliance, Florian Hahn, told Bild daily that Germany’s “suspension of conscription no longer fits the current threat situation”.

“The first conscripts will have to walk through the barracks gates in 2025,” Hahn told the daily. “We cannot stand by and watch as the world around us becomes more unsafe.”

That is this year.

Why are they in such a rush?

Do they know something that the rest of us do not?

A British military official that once served in one of the top positions in NATO says that the UK must also “make plans for conscription”…

A former NATO commander has suggested that Donald Trump’s recent remarks on Ukraine could lead to the reintroduction of conscription in the UK. Trump has shocked international leaders by suggesting that Ukraine is responsible for the intensifying conflict with Russia.

Adding to the tension, US Secretary of Defence Pete Hegseth announced at a conference in Brussels last week that America’s focus was shifting away from European security. “(I am) here today to directly and unambiguously express that stark strategic realities prevent the United States of America from being primarily focused on the security of Europe,” he declared.

These developments have raised concerns about the potential outbreak of World War 3, with NATO’s former Deputy Supreme Allied Commander Europe, Sir Richard Shirreff, considering the possibility of conscription returning to the UK. In a recent Daily Mail article, Sir Shirreff expressed his grave concerns: “Though many will find it unthinkable, we must be prepared to call up our reservists – and make plans for conscription. Trump has left us no other choice.”

Is he nuts?

See also Will You Get a $5,000 DOGE Stimulus Check?
Young people in the UK don’t want to die in Ukraine.

For a moment, I would like for you to consider what life is like in the trenches in eastern Ukraine.

Imagine standing in extremely cold muddy water that comes up to your knees. Your teeth are chattering because you can never get warm, and at night the temperature gets way below freezing. You would love to climb out of the trench, but it is your only source of cover. Massive explosions rattle your bones night and day, and there is a constant threat that the Russians could advance in your direction. You have seen countless other soldiers get shot or have limbs get blown off, and you are just praying that you can make it to the next day.

Most westerners that are rabidly pro-war would change their tune very quickly if they had to spend a single hour in those trenches.

Personally, I am very thankful that President Trump is trying to see if there is a peaceful way to resolve this conflict.

On Monday evening, he suspended all shipments of weapons and ammunition to Ukraine…

U.S. weapons deliveries to Ukraine came to an abrupt halt on Monday evening after President Donald Trump ordered a pause on all aid to the war-torn country, the Pentagon confirmed on Tuesday.

After the order was given, all U.S. weapons shipments to Ukraine came to a stop, as of 6 p.m. on Monday evening, according to a defense official. Planes carrying supplies en route to Ukraine would have had to turn around, the official said.

This was an ultra-aggressive approach, but Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy was not being cooperative.

So President Trump called his bluff.

Zelenskyy understands that the Ukrainians will get routed by the Russians without U.S. assistance, and so he was forced to fall in line with what Trump wants. On Tuesday, Zelenskyy issued quite a groveling apology…

‘My team and I stand ready to work under President Trump’s strong leadership to get a peace that lasts.

‘We are ready to work fast to end the war, and the first stages could be the release of prisoners and truce in the sky — ban on missiles, long-ranged drones, bombs on energy and other civilian infrastructure — and truce in the sea immediately, if Russia will do the same.

‘Then we want to move very fast through all next stages and to work with the US to agree a strong final deal.

‘We do really value how much America has done to help Ukraine maintain its sovereignty and independence. And we remember the moment when things changed when President Trump provided Ukraine with Javelins. We are grateful for this.

Now that Zelenskyy has seen how far Trump is willing to go, he has decided to sign the minerals deal, and it was expected that Trump would announce this during his speech to Congress on Tuesday night…

U.S. President Donald Trump’s administration and Ukraine plan to sign the much-debated minerals deal following a disastrous Oval Office meeting Friday in which Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy was dismissed from the building, four people familiar with the situation said on Tuesday.

President Donald Trump has told his advisers that he wants to announce the agreement in his address to Congress Tuesday evening, three of the sources said, cautioning that the deal had yet to be signed and the situation could change.

Now that Zelenskyy has been forcibly convinced to cooperate, Trump will turn his attention to the Russians.

See also Trump says "interesting days ahead" with Iran, saying something's going to happen very soon
Unfortunately, the Russians are in no mood to compromise, and they have all the leverage because they are winning the war.

I expect that Trump and his team will be quite diplomatic with the Russians at first, but when the Russians repeatedly refuse to give them what they want that will change.

The Trump administration is envisioning a very large force of European soldiers in Ukraine after a ceasefire is declared. The Russians are adamantly against this, and they have repeatedly stated that they will never accept western forces in Ukraine under any circumstances.

In addition, the Russians intend to keep every inch of territory that they have already captured. In fact, according to Newsweek the Russians actually want Ukraine to concede major cities that the Ukrainians currently control…

Trump has suggested that both Russia and Ukraine must make concessions in the war. Kyiv has rejected any idea of ceding territory to Moscow, while Putin has demanded that Ukraine give up its aspirations of joining the NATO military alliance, and cede its Luhansk, Donetsk, Kherson and Zaporizhzhia regions.

The ISW think tank, based in Washington D.C., noted that there are several large cities in these regions that Russian forces “do not currently occupy and have no prospect of seizing.”

Russia’s occupation of the remainder of the four Ukrainian oblasts would include large cities such as Kherson City (pre-war population of about 275,000), Kramatorsk (147,000 people), and Zaporizhzhia City (706,000)—all of which remain under Ukrainian control,” the think tank said.

If this is what the Russians are actually asking for, they are being very foolish, and they are seriously overplaying their hand.

On the other side, the Ukrainians and our allies in Europe want the Russians to return much or all of the territory that they have conquered.

Needless to say, that simply is not going to happen.

As I stated the other day, the Russians and the Ukrainians are not even in the same universe as far as what an “acceptable deal” would look like.

The Russians figure that time is on their side because their forces are continually moving forward.

The longer it takes to reach a peace agreement, the more territory they will end up with.

This is going to greatly frustrate Trump.

He doesn’t really have any leverage on the Russians. If he tries to create leverage using an ultra-aggressive approach, it will backfire severely.

In recent weeks, we have seen Trump take an ultra-aggressive approach with nations all over the globe.

In many cases, that has worked out very well.

If he tries a similar approach with the Russians, it will not work.

For more than a decade, I have been relentlessly warning about what a final showdown with Russia would look like.

We must not go down that road.

Unfortunately, at the moment both sides are making all sorts of unrealistic demands.

I am extremely alarmed by the insane demands that the Russians are making, the Europeans are being wildly unrealistic, and the Ukrainians are simply being delusional.

Trump is determined to get a deal done, but I see no possible way that he is going to be able to come up with a deal that is acceptable to everyone.

So at some point Trump will be tempted to put his foot down, and that would be a tragic mistake.

Finding a peaceful way out of this mess is going to require a tremendous amount of diplomatic finesse, and it literally would be a major miracle if a peace agreement is ever signed.

 
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danmand

Well-known member
Nov 28, 2003
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March 4, 2025

If you were drafted, would you willingly go to the killing fields of eastern Ukraine? What about your children? The war in Ukraine has been an endless “meat grinder” that has already claimed hundreds of thousands of Russian lives and more than a million Ukrainian lives. Those that are sane want to see if there is a peaceful way out of this mess so that the killing can stop. Unfortunately, vast numbers of leftists all over the United States and western Europe have been transformed into rabid pro-war lunatics that are absolutely obsessed with “defeating” Russia. So gigantic mountains of dollars and euros have been poured into the war in Ukraine, but it hasn’t worked. The Russians are winning, and so now European leaders are preparing to take things to the next level.

On Tuesday, Ursula von der Leyen unveiled a brand new $840 billion program that will be known as “Rearm Europe”…

The European Union will free up $840 billion in funding to funnel into defense across the bloc, European Commission chief Ursula von der Leyen announced on Tuesday.

Interestingly, this new effort was announced just a few hours after President Trump paused all U.S. military aid to the Ukrainians…

Dubbed “Rearm Europe,” the remarks from the European Commission’s president came hours after President Donald Trump suspended all U.S. military aid to Ukraine, widening the gulf between Washington and Kyiv and going against the fresh commitments of support from Europe for Ukraine in recent days.

“I do not need to describe the grave nature of the threats that we face, or the devastating consequences that we will have to endure if those threats would come to pass,” von der Leyen told reporters.

Of course money won’t be enough to accomplish what European leaders have planned.

They are going to need warm bodies as well.

As most of you know, elections were just held in Germany, and the group that won is apparently pushing for a rapid reintroduction of “compulsory military service”…

Germany’s conservatives, who are set to lead the next government, on Tuesday argued that the country should quickly reintroduce compulsory military service.

Friedrich Merz, head of the CDU/CSU bloc that topped last month’s elections, has argued that in the era of US President Donald Trump, Europe will have to better handle its own security.

If I was a young person in Germany right now, I would be extremely concerned.

A spokesperson for the group that will be heading up the new government has publicly stated that the first new conscripts “will have to walk through the barracks gates in 2025”…

The defence policy spokesman of his centre-right alliance, Florian Hahn, told Bild daily that Germany’s “suspension of conscription no longer fits the current threat situation”.

“The first conscripts will have to walk through the barracks gates in 2025,” Hahn told the daily. “We cannot stand by and watch as the world around us becomes more unsafe.”

That is this year.

Why are they in such a rush?

Do they know something that the rest of us do not?

A British military official that once served in one of the top positions in NATO says that the UK must also “make plans for conscription”…

A former NATO commander has suggested that Donald Trump’s recent remarks on Ukraine could lead to the reintroduction of conscription in the UK. Trump has shocked international leaders by suggesting that Ukraine is responsible for the intensifying conflict with Russia.

Adding to the tension, US Secretary of Defence Pete Hegseth announced at a conference in Brussels last week that America’s focus was shifting away from European security. “(I am) here today to directly and unambiguously express that stark strategic realities prevent the United States of America from being primarily focused on the security of Europe,” he declared.

These developments have raised concerns about the potential outbreak of World War 3, with NATO’s former Deputy Supreme Allied Commander Europe, Sir Richard Shirreff, considering the possibility of conscription returning to the UK. In a recent Daily Mail article, Sir Shirreff expressed his grave concerns: “Though many will find it unthinkable, we must be prepared to call up our reservists – and make plans for conscription. Trump has left us no other choice.”

Is he nuts?

See also Will You Get a $5,000 DOGE Stimulus Check?
Young people in the UK don’t want to die in Ukraine.

For a moment, I would like for you to consider what life is like in the trenches in eastern Ukraine.

Imagine standing in extremely cold muddy water that comes up to your knees. Your teeth are chattering because you can never get warm, and at night the temperature gets way below freezing. You would love to climb out of the trench, but it is your only source of cover. Massive explosions rattle your bones night and day, and there is a constant threat that the Russians could advance in your direction. You have seen countless other soldiers get shot or have limbs get blown off, and you are just praying that you can make it to the next day.

Most westerners that are rabidly pro-war would change their tune very quickly if they had to spend a single hour in those trenches.

Personally, I am very thankful that President Trump is trying to see if there is a peaceful way to resolve this conflict.

On Monday evening, he suspended all shipments of weapons and ammunition to Ukraine…

U.S. weapons deliveries to Ukraine came to an abrupt halt on Monday evening after President Donald Trump ordered a pause on all aid to the war-torn country, the Pentagon confirmed on Tuesday.

After the order was given, all U.S. weapons shipments to Ukraine came to a stop, as of 6 p.m. on Monday evening, according to a defense official. Planes carrying supplies en route to Ukraine would have had to turn around, the official said.

This was an ultra-aggressive approach, but Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy was not being cooperative.

So President Trump called his bluff.

Zelenskyy understands that the Ukrainians will get routed by the Russians without U.S. assistance, and so he was forced to fall in line with what Trump wants. On Tuesday, Zelenskyy issued quite a groveling apology…

‘My team and I stand ready to work under President Trump’s strong leadership to get a peace that lasts.

‘We are ready to work fast to end the war, and the first stages could be the release of prisoners and truce in the sky — ban on missiles, long-ranged drones, bombs on energy and other civilian infrastructure — and truce in the sea immediately, if Russia will do the same.

‘Then we want to move very fast through all next stages and to work with the US to agree a strong final deal.

‘We do really value how much America has done to help Ukraine maintain its sovereignty and independence. And we remember the moment when things changed when President Trump provided Ukraine with Javelins. We are grateful for this.

Now that Zelenskyy has seen how far Trump is willing to go, he has decided to sign the minerals deal, and it was expected that Trump would announce this during his speech to Congress on Tuesday night…

U.S. President Donald Trump’s administration and Ukraine plan to sign the much-debated minerals deal following a disastrous Oval Office meeting Friday in which Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy was dismissed from the building, four people familiar with the situation said on Tuesday.

President Donald Trump has told his advisers that he wants to announce the agreement in his address to Congress Tuesday evening, three of the sources said, cautioning that the deal had yet to be signed and the situation could change.

Now that Zelenskyy has been forcibly convinced to cooperate, Trump will turn his attention to the Russians.

See also Trump says "interesting days ahead" with Iran, saying something's going to happen very soon
Unfortunately, the Russians are in no mood to compromise, and they have all the leverage because they are winning the war.

I expect that Trump and his team will be quite diplomatic with the Russians at first, but when the Russians repeatedly refuse to give them what they want that will change.

The Trump administration is envisioning a very large force of European soldiers in Ukraine after a ceasefire is declared. The Russians are adamantly against this, and they have repeatedly stated that they will never accept western forces in Ukraine under any circumstances.

In addition, the Russians intend to keep every inch of territory that they have already captured. In fact, according to Newsweek the Russians actually want Ukraine to concede major cities that the Ukrainians currently control…

Trump has suggested that both Russia and Ukraine must make concessions in the war. Kyiv has rejected any idea of ceding territory to Moscow, while Putin has demanded that Ukraine give up its aspirations of joining the NATO military alliance, and cede its Luhansk, Donetsk, Kherson and Zaporizhzhia regions.

The ISW think tank, based in Washington D.C., noted that there are several large cities in these regions that Russian forces “do not currently occupy and have no prospect of seizing.”

Russia’s occupation of the remainder of the four Ukrainian oblasts would include large cities such as Kherson City (pre-war population of about 275,000), Kramatorsk (147,000 people), and Zaporizhzhia City (706,000)—all of which remain under Ukrainian control,” the think tank said.

If this is what the Russians are actually asking for, they are being very foolish, and they are seriously overplaying their hand.

On the other side, the Ukrainians and our allies in Europe want the Russians to return much or all of the territory that they have conquered.

Needless to say, that simply is not going to happen.

As I stated the other day, the Russians and the Ukrainians are not even in the same universe as far as what an “acceptable deal” would look like.

The Russians figure that time is on their side because their forces are continually moving forward.

The longer it takes to reach a peace agreement, the more territory they will end up with.

This is going to greatly frustrate Trump.

He doesn’t really have any leverage on the Russians. If he tries to create leverage using an ultra-aggressive approach, it will backfire severely.

In recent weeks, we have seen Trump take an ultra-aggressive approach with nations all over the globe.

In many cases, that has worked out very well.

If he tries a similar approach with the Russians, it will not work.

For more than a decade, I have been relentlessly warning about what a final showdown with Russia would look like.

We must not go down that road.

Unfortunately, at the moment both sides are making all sorts of unrealistic demands.

I am extremely alarmed by the insane demands that the Russians are making, the Europeans are being wildly unrealistic, and the Ukrainians are simply being delusional.

Trump is determined to get a deal done, but I see no possible way that he is going to be able to come up with a deal that is acceptable to everyone.

So at some point Trump will be tempted to put his foot down, and that would be a tragic mistake.

Finding a peaceful way out of this mess is going to require a tremendous amount of diplomatic finesse, and it literally would be a major miracle if a peace agreement is ever signed.

This is foolery. The European population will not tolerate a general mobilization, which will be needed to create an army to invade Russia.

It will take them 12 years to indoctrinate young people a la Hitler jugend in order to be able to recruit enough recruiters.
 

Mandel

Active member
Mar 29, 2004
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This has been a topic in Europe since Russia invaded Ukraine back in 2022. Many countries already have it, while others have been examining whether to re-introduce it.

It's a logical step for Europe given recent events. With their existing armies and large population, it shouldn't be a big lift. A strong show of force and capability is needed to shift the balance and ensure the security of Ukraine and Europe.
 

Bucktee

Well-known member
Jan 26, 2024
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Under a draft, most of Europe's young male immigrant population will return to their home country.

The rabid pro-war leftists will all go AWOL.

So, who will fight?
 

nottyboi

Well-known member
May 14, 2008
23,789
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If they want to stand a chance to defeat Russia they will need to raise and army of 35-40M people. 885m is not enough to equip such an army. You are talking 4-5T to field such and army and triple that when combat ops start.
 

Mandel

Active member
Mar 29, 2004
155
130
43
There are some ridiculous Putin shills on this board LMAO
Russia has about 1.5M active duty and 2M reserves according to multiple sources. Europe doesn't even need to match these numbers to win.
 
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Mandel

Active member
Mar 29, 2004
155
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What attack? Europe will not go past reclaiming Ukraine's land. Russia has been struggling to recruit and has resorted to enlisting North Korean soldiers. They won't have the will or motivation to be fed into the meat grinder against a stronger united European force.
 
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oil&gas

Well-known member
Apr 16, 2002
14,139
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Ghawar
European troops will be Ukraine's North Korean troops. After Ukraine
is no longer able to recruit fresh troops in sufficient number European
troops will fill in. For Ukraine they are better than Putin's North Korean
troops. Zelensky won't have to pay their salaries and coffins.
 

southpaw

Well-known member
May 21, 2002
752
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The rabid pro-war leftists will all go AWOL.
They don't need to. They will suddenly realize they are women, and change their pronouns. They didn't do it before because of all the transphobia, but now they won't be able to live a lie any longer.
 
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danmand

Well-known member
Nov 28, 2003
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I am sorry to burst your bubble, this is not 1940 anymore. Western European countries will not be able to recruit or draft enough soldiers willing to take on Russia.

I don't know about the former eastern European countries that were part of the SSSR, but even there I am wondering. 7,000,000 mostly men left Ukraine instead of defending their own country against Russia.
 

oil&gas

Well-known member
Apr 16, 2002
14,139
2,326
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Ghawar
Why are people interpreting this as "raise conscripts to go into Ukraine and then attack Russia"?

After all the sacrifices Ukraine has made defending the future of
Europe's security it will be a travesty of justice and honor for Europe
not to come to the rescue of Ukraine to fight Russian invaders. If they
are unable to defeat Putin's armies at least get a handful of them (and
their own troops) killed as a way to pay tribute to the heroic resistance
to Putin's soldiers put up by the Ukrainians.
 

danmand

Well-known member
Nov 28, 2003
46,964
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I left Europe too long ago to be able to understand that all of Europe is wanting Germany to build a large army.
 

southpaw

Well-known member
May 21, 2002
752
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I left Europe too long ago to be able to understand that all of Europe is wanting Germany to build a large army.
Things change.
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
34,270
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After all the sacrifices Ukraine has made defending the future of
Europe's security it will be a travesty of justice and honor for Europe
not to come to the rescue of Ukraine to fight Russian invaders. If they
are unable to defeat Putin's armies at least get a handful of them (and
their own troops) killed as a way to pay tribute to the heroic resistance
to Putin's soldiers put up by the Ukrainians.
So... delusion?
 

oil&gas

Well-known member
Apr 16, 2002
14,139
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Ghawar
Please elaborate on your armchair military analysis here.
Being an armchair analyst I am at best I won't be able to
give any elaborate analysis on what expenses incurred in
an all out war with Russia may amount to.

That being said, I think with common sense it is reasonable to make
a wild-ass guess of military funding around a ten-fold increase
of total aid provided to Ukraine by U.S., Canada, UK and
Europe combined. So suppose $500 billon has been the total expenditure
in funding the proxy war over 3 years I would say 5 T for waging a
real war fought by our own troops against Russia is not unrealistic.
 

Shaquille Oatmeal

Well-known member
Jun 2, 2023
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Being an armchair analyst I am at best I won't be able to
give any elaborate analysis on what expenses incurred in
an all out war with Russia may amount to.

That being said, I think with common sense it is reasonable to make
a wild-ass guess of military funding around a ten-fold increase
of total aid provided to Ukraine by U.S., Canada, UK and
Europe combined. So suppose $500 billon has been the total expenditure
in funding the proxy war over 3 years I would say 5 T for waging a
real war fought by our own troops against Russia is not unrealistic.
A wild ass guess, is just a wild ass guess.
 
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