Sex work payment enforceable in court

[xix]

Seriously, did any one actually read the article?

I did.

IT is weird and the part that it got public banned until a few days ago, I became suspicious. But there is a case in federal court that caught my eye when they mention.

"In 2021, the alliance sued the federal and Ontario provincial governments, arguing that the conditions of criminalization allow exploitation to flourish. That case had its first hearing in October 2022, and is awaiting a judgment. If successful, it could result in the law being struck down, paving the path to full decriminalization of sex work. "

So was ban for the federal govt to decide on the case before them?

Well the client doesn't have to pay her at all anyways. The paper may say pay but you don't have to.
At the same time I understood the girl can say I provide this but doesn't have to. So this make her/him a scammer.

I can say she was buying my service and she didn't pay. Of course I need proof of this.

 

[William St]

I'm guessing that it's an illegal contract, but the law presumes that the girl is "exploited".

There are cases which say that the protected person can sue to enforce an illegal contract, but the other party cannot sue.

Yes, maybe so.

 

[xix]

Sex worker wins in Nova Scotia court, but ruling leaves sex industry conflicted

HALIFAX — In a legal decision described as the first of its kind in Canada, a Halifax sex worker successfully sued a client for nonpayment of services, but actors in the industry are conflicted about the ruling's impacts. Former sex worker Brogan Sheehan took Bradley Samuelson to small claims...

ca.news.yahoo.com

So I read this part that caught my eye.

"Sex work remains criminalized in Canada, but a 2014 law removed criminal penalties for people, like Sheehan, who sell sexual services. Paying for sex, however, remains illegal."

It's almost like the Govt back then in 2014 guessed that women can advertise - like in Las Vegas the little pictures given out on the street - or OnlyFans / Twitter, but you can't go there and buy it.

Unless you are hanging around a bar and she just happens to be there and give her the key card to a hotel.

 

[Amber Glory]

You guys make me laugh!

Not so long ago, paying upfront was extremely rare.

I have seen many dozens of SP's and only a very few requested money upfront. I never went back to those few that requested it.

In fact, I was finished with an SP one time and as we're laying bed relaxing, she tells about the guy the night before that ran off without paying her.

I had not yet paid her. I was shocked at that, but it's the perfect example of past times.

It's only because of all those white-night punters that enforce/encouraged paying upfront that has allowed all of these scammers to get a foothold. If we do not pay upfront, we do not get scammed nor do we have law enforcement questions.

Just saying!

Ciao!

This is false; providers started asking for rates upfront because of being continually ripped off.
Think about it: when you guys get scammed, you're out money(that's not a good thing, but that's all you're losing).
When we get ripped off at the end, we not only lost a part of our income since this is our job, but we also had sex that we otherwise wouldn't have agreed to have without the rate.

We always teach new providers getting into the business to always take payment upfront; not because of "white-knights", but because every single one of us has experienced being ripped off by waiting to take payment at the end.

Even the most respected and consistent regulars have still tried to take advantage when we get too comfortable and start allowing the rate to be collected at the end.

If you have every intention of paying, you should have no problem paying the rate upfront(and I know you've personally met plenty of providers who ask for the rate up front, withpassion).
If you want to avoid being scammed, do thorough research before meeting a provider.

Getting the rate at the end is called a rookie mistake for a reason - we're certainly not about to change the steps we take to protect ourselves just to make clients who potentionally want to take advantage more comfortable.

 

[Amber Glory]

I did.

IT is weird and the part that it got public banned until a few days ago, I became suspicious. But there is a case in federal court that caught my eye when they mention.

"In 2021, the alliance sued the federal and Ontario provincial governments, arguing that the conditions of criminalization allow exploitation to flourish. That case had its first hearing in October 2022, and is awaiting a judgment. If successful, it could result in the law being struck down, paving the path to full decriminalization of sex work. "

So was ban for the federal govt to decide on the case before them?

Well the client doesn't have to pay her at all anyways. The paper may say pay but you don't have to.
At the same time I understood the girl can say I provide this but doesn't have to. So this make her/him a scammer.

I can say she was buying my service and she didn't pay. Of course I need proof of this.

So this is the current ongoing Constitutional Challenge against the Canadian government for the current sex work laws.

If you don't like being criminalized for buying our services, I recommend you all put your support behind this court challenge - the goal is to get it to the Supreme court and strike down some laws similar to Bedford.

Here's where you can find more info:

Our Constitutional Challenge to PCEPA

In 2013, the SCC in Bedford v. Canada deemed three prostitution prohibitions unconstitutional because they caused harm to sex workers and contravened their rights to liberty and security. In 2014, …

sexworklawreform.com

 

[Yggdrasil]

Bedford.

Bedford Stuyvesant! The livest one! Representing BK to the fullest! Gats I pull it. Bastards ducking when BIG be bucking. Chicken...I like to pay upfront so that I can just walk out in a comatose state at the end and not be accused of trying to rip anyone off. I am in no state of mind to be dealing with money after a good appointment.

I wanna make a movie about a guy who finds himself in court fighting a sex worker over a payment. And it starts with guy thinking to himself "Shit, how the fuck did I end up here?" Then we cut away, opening credits role, and we start at the beginning of the story. With like a guy tying his shoes on the sidewalk or something mundane.

 

[Scarlettechar]

If y’all just pay for the services that you receive from a SP like a decent human being, why do you even care about that article or what’s enforceable or what law is debatable?

 

[Davrem]

Excellent article, glad to see this case set precedent in small claims court. Who knows, this may lead to full decriminalization of providing and procuring companionship services in the future.

Of course, the politicians and religious/right wing nut bars will make a crap ton of noise hiding behind "won't someone think of the children".

Our bodies, our choice.

The irony being that plenty of politicians and sexually repressed nutjobs probably use companion services. It's like when you see someone publicly speaking out about homosexuality, you know he takes the D when the camera stops rollin'.

 

[Davrem]

This is false; providers started asking for rates upfront because of being continually ripped off.
Think about it: when you guys get scammed, you're out money(that's not a good thing, but that's all you're losing).
When we get ripped off at the end, we not only lost a part of our income since this is our job, but we also had sex that we otherwise wouldn't have agreed to have without the rate.

We always teach new providers getting into the business to always take payment upfront; not because of "white-knights", but because every single one of us has experienced being ripped off by waiting to take payment at the end.

Even the most respected and consistent regulars have still tried to take advantage when we get too comfortable and start allowing the rate to be collected at the end.

If you have every intention of paying, you should have no problem paying the rate upfront(and I know you've personally met plenty of providers who ask for the rate up front, withpassion).
If you want to avoid being scammed, do thorough research before meeting a provider.

Getting the rate at the end is called a rookie mistake for a reason - we're certainly not about to change the steps we take to protect ourselves just to make clients who potentionally want to take advantage more comfortable.

These are all beautifully articulated points, but let's compare to the rest of society...gas? Pay first. McDonald's? Pay first. Theme parks? Pay first. You get the picture. It's not like companions are setting a new standard for the exchange of goods and services in Canada. And lets face it, the services we get from SPs are better than the ones I just listed. So drop the cash, forget about it, enjoy your time.

 

[Hands95]

These are all beautifully articulated points, but let's compare to the rest of society...gas? Pay first. McDonald's? Pay first. Theme parks? Pay first. You get the picture. It's not like companions are setting a new standard for the exchange of goods and services in Canada. And lets face it, the services we get from SPs are better than the ones I just listed. So drop the cash, forget about it, enjoy your time.

McD - order itemized before payment. I know exactly what I'm getting.
Theme park - pay to enter; can go anywhere and do anything (per the posted, pre-payment, information map).
Gas - up front, you are usually authorizing a maximum amount. The actual amount charged exactly matches what was delivered.

 

[Amber Glory]

McD - order itemized before payment. I know exactly what I'm getting.
Theme park - pay to enter; can go anywhere and do anything (per the posted, pre-payment, information map).
Gas - up front, you are usually authorizing a maximum amount. The actual amount charged exactly matches what was delivered.

Hence "if you don't want to get scammed, do your research".
Also worth noting that sometimes the power of getting everything promised delivered lies in the clients hands when it comes to respect and hygiene - you're way less likely to have issues if you're respectful and clean when arriving.

All your examples above also come with YMMV nuances to them as well(Pay for theme park, but get kicked out for groping people. McDs you pay for your order, but sometimes they get it wrong or mess it up or forget something, or you might even be refused service if you're mistreating the employees)

 

[Davrem]

McD - order itemized before payment. I know exactly what I'm getting.
Theme park - pay to enter; can go anywhere and do anything (per the posted, pre-payment, information map).
Gas - up front, you are usually authorizing a maximum amount. The actual amount charged exactly matches what was delivered.

Movies and sporting events, pay first. What if your team loses amd it's a shit game? Money back?

 

[surfer83]

Movies and sporting events, pay first. What if your team loses amd it's a shit game? Money back?

yeah movie companies were found liable for falsely advertising that a certain actor was in the movie and ended up not in it for selling extra tickets

 

[Davrem]

yeah movie companies were found liable for falsely advertising that a certain actor was in the movie and ended up not in it for selling extra tickets

But we'd call that a bait and switch, which is bad. We're just talking about the ethics of paying for service first, which I'm ok with