Ukraine war - how we got here

poker

Everyone's hero's, tell everyone's lies.
Jun 1, 2006
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Niagara
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nottyboi

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May 14, 2008
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and by collateral… you mean targeted strike. War crime.

Stop cheering for the enemy.
Russia is not my enemy. What has Russia done to me that should make it my enemy? What has Ukraine done for me to make them my friend? In terms of the current situation, I see NATO and Ukraine's desire to confront Russia as a big causal factor for the current war. Both Russia and Ukraine are paying a terrible price for this. And we will all pay a price in terms of inflation. I am convinced that a compromise was available to provide security for both sides as well as statehood and autonomy for Ukraine. That is lost. Ukraine is lost and thousands will die and millions will live in squalor. I blame NATO and the US for this.
 

nottyboi

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Collateral damage is when something close to a target inadvertently gets hit/damaged. Kyiv is nowhere close to eastern Ukraine which is hundreds of miles away. In no way can it be considered collateral damage. Nothing happened accidentally.

Your lame excuse is total BS. Your dwindling reputation on TERB is the collateral damage from your constant lying.
Who said nothing in Kiev is a target? In case you didn't notice Russia is at war with ALL of Ukraine. Any military activity in Ukraine is a legitimate target.
 

Frankfooter

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Apr 10, 2015
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Russia is not my enemy. What has Russia done to me that should make it my enemy? What has Ukraine done for me to make them my friend? In terms of the current situation, I see NATO and Ukraine's desire to confront Russia as a big causal factor for the current war. Both Russia and Ukraine are paying a terrible price for this. And we will all pay a price in terms of inflation. I am convinced that a compromise was available to provide security for both sides as well as statehood and autonomy for Ukraine. That is lost. Ukraine is lost and thousands will die and millions will live in squalor. I blame NATO and the US for this.
Why are you so against NATO, which is a peaceful alliance?
 
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nottyboi

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No, none of it is a legitimate target.
This is all a war of choice, a war of aggression by Putin and none of it is justified, justifiable or lawful.
Every war is a war of choice. Every war requires at least one belligerent to conclude that it can create a more favorable future for itself though war and that the current trend is highly unfavorable. Which war involving Western nations in the last 40 years has not been a "war of choice" ? When Canada sent F-18's to bomb Syria, was there a risk Syria was going to bomb Toronto?
 

nottyboi

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nottyboi has made a moral stance against imperial/colonial wars of aggression by standing up and defending the 3rd most powerful imperial/colonial power.
No I am just saying its no different then all the others and the outrage is massively hypocritical.
 

poker

Everyone's hero's, tell everyone's lies.
Jun 1, 2006
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Who said nothing in Kiev is a target? In case you didn't notice Russia is at war with ALL of Ukraine. Any military activity in Ukraine is a legitimate target.
“Nottiboy the Traitor”…. Got it.
 
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mandrill

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Why? Ukraine is not my country. I am not linked to either of the warring kleptocracies.
Russia is the aggressor. Ukraine is a smaller, weaker country which is being attacked. You support the large, aggressive, imperialistic, bully-country which is murdering women and children and bombing another country's cities because you preen yourself as being "anti American" and that means gloating and strutting while democratic, westernized countries which are our friends are genocided by non-democratic klepto-dictatorships.
 
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poker

Everyone's hero's, tell everyone's lies.
Jun 1, 2006
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Niagara
Why? Ukraine is not my country. I am not linked to either of the warring kleptocracies.
Because you have chosen to side with murderous dictator. You didn’t have to take any side…. You didn’t have to post any articles. You did. Choices matter. You side with the enemy, that makes you a traitor.
 
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Frankfooter

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No I am just saying its no different then all the others and the outrage is massively hypocritical.
No, you're actively defending Russian imperialism because you appear even more upset about American imperialism, even though this is happening in Ukraine and not in the US.
 

nottyboi

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No, you're actively defending Russian imperialism because you appear even more upset about American imperialism, even though this is happening in Ukraine and not in the US.
It the act of imperialism that is underway and I see how the US has set this up to support its greater act of imperialism (which you CLEARLY do not see). So I know you will not accept it. But this war is to carve the EU and Russia apart, and to solidify EU dependence on the USA. also the EU will be much less competitive then the US as its energy costs will soar. Anoher major goal its to confront China. Its Road and belt and AIB includes all major EU nations (57 nations in all) but not the USA. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asian_Infrastructure_Investment_Bank#Members. In fact the only major non members are the USA and Japan. Without Russia, the Road and Belt cannot span the Eurasian continent, so you can see how hard the USA is pressuring China to condemn Russia and how hard China resists. They know what is up, and they are prepared to weather whatever the US can throw at them to stick with Russia. The US is not a reliable ally. Its "cancel Culture" politics have made any long term agreement with it impossible. The world is changing, and Ukraine is but one act.
 

nottyboi

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Russia is the aggressor. Ukraine is a smaller, weaker country which is being attacked. You support the large, aggressive, imperialistic, bully-country which is murdering women and children and bombing another country's cities because you preen yourself as being "anti American" and that means gloating and strutting while democratic, westernized countries which are our friends are genocided by non-democratic klepto-dictatorships.
No actually I recognize we are part of a block that does the same things and that we are part of the system that fomented this war. We are just pouring weapons into Ukraine and inciting the Ukrainians to fight to their own oblivion. To me that is making things much worse.
 

basketcase

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Dec 29, 2005
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...Russia is not "alturistic" nor can the Kremlin allow Russians to be attacked in Ukraine....
I though the Sudetenland argument went out of fashion 80 years ago. But as they say, history doesn't repeat itself but it does rhyme.


(p.s. the ethnic Russians in Ukraine aren't Russian citizens)
 
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basketcase

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Now that even Zelensky says a huge battle is about to happen in the east, what were all those troops doing there, if not to attack the Donbass?
They moved there after the Russian encirclement of Kiev was repulsed?
 
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