What if... we ended Anonymous Free Speech?

[curr3n_c1000]

IP address is an easy work around with a proxy.

That's what you think. It you are not doing anything illegal they wont act on it. Cross the line and they'll show you what they are capable of.

Second, what would stop a criminal from using some other persons ID? or worse how would you regulate this in a foreign country?

A lot of people use mobile, and a lot of mobile users have shared IP addresses now. Short of MAC addresses, they are easily arguable in court.

Mobile is worse because you have a IMEI.

 

[poker]

Should the masses suffer for the few?

Should millions lose rights for the few who abuse them?

On the surface, it seems great. Hold people accountable but the loss of privacy is huge.

I’m not the no side. As much as I would love to see some people held accountable for their postings, I can’t agree with giving up privacy rights. Not yet anyway.

You don't a "right" to privacy online though. It's a privilege at best. is it not? I mean, they allow it. How fast could change if "they" want it to change.

I am just the Americans gave each citizen a "Right to Free Speech". Nowhere does it give us a right to hide behind fake names and throw mud.

 

[poker]

That's what you think. It you are not doing anything illegal they wont act on it. Cross the line and they'll show you what they are capable of.

Second, what would stop a criminal from using some other persons ID? or worse how would you regulate this in a foreign country?


Mobile is worse because you have a IMEI.

Truth be told... I have not given it a ton of thought. Thought of free speech vs anonymous free speech ran across my mind. Then the thought of how fast the anonymity part could be taken away, and how would they go about it?

Then I thought (yes, some alcohol may have been invovled)... if they wanted to crack down... an actual crisis (civil war?)... how fast would the mobile networks go down? The GPS in the phones to stop working. The ability we have to communicate and coordinate with strangers hundreds, if not thousands of miles away. How fast will those abilities be shut down?

Many of you said China. I agree. However... legally, what online rights are we guaranteed?

 

[Mr.Know-It-All]

If and when such ideas are implemented most people will oblige. Covid has shown us how easy it is to get people to fall in line, even in the Information Age.

 

[NotADcotor]

I am just the Americans gave each citizen a "Right to Free Speech". Nowhere does it give us a right to hide behind fake names and throw mud.

In American terms it says Freedom of Speech. Not Freedom of Speech except if you are being a dick, or freedom of speech that I don't like or etc.
The rights are pretty clear, sure they get ignored by the government and the courts instead being changed and modified [like can be done via amendment] but that's another story.
Personally it's a slippery slope once you start doing that. Look at the history of the income tax [not an issue of a right but still]

 

[Jasmina]

Which most sites don't collect/have access to...

That's what you think. It you are not doing anything illegal they wont act on it. Cross the line and they'll show you what they are capable of.

Second, what would stop a criminal from using some other persons ID? or worse how would you regulate this in a foreign country?


Mobile is worse because you have a IMEI.

 

[NotADcotor]

However... legally, what online rights are we guaranteed

Although nowhere as bad as the soviet union, it's a pretty similar situation. We have legal rights, they just get ignored [at least in the American context]

 

[luvyeah]

Which most sites don't collect/have access to...

The ISP has access to this, all that needs to happen is for an offense to be serious enough to get the police involved.
Then all your personal information on file at the ISP will be handed to police and they may or may no be consequences.

 

[HungSowel]

This episode of TERB is sponsored by Nord VPN. Nord VPN, protecting chomos, terrorists, drug dealers, and Trump supporters since 2016

 

[curr3n_c1000]

Which most sites don't collect/have access to...

The Government subpoenas the webserver to gets the carrier request info
The Government then subpoenas the carrier to identify who made the request
And that's it.

 

[curr3n_c1000]

Truth be told... I have not given it a ton of thought. Thought of free speech vs anonymous free speech ran across my mind. Then the thought of how fast the anonymity part could be taken away, and how would they go about it?

Then I thought (yes, some alcohol may have been invovled)... if they wanted to crack down... an actual crisis (civil war?)... how fast would the mobile networks go down? The GPS in the phones to stop working. The ability we have to communicate and coordinate with strangers hundreds, if not thousands of miles away. How fast will those abilities be shut down?

Many of you said China. I agree. However... legally, what online rights are we guaranteed?

Stay off the weed.

 

[Jasmina]

I work with both, and I can assure you, most websites do not have that info. We mostly have IP addy only. And subpeonaing a VPN is damned near impossible as most are overseas and do not co-operate.

The Government subpoenas the webserver to gets the carrier request info
The Government then subpoenas the carrier to identify who made the request
And that's it.

 

[Jasmina]

Police rarely subpeona an ISP, it has to be really fucking serious for them to do that, and that doesn't consider VPN's, which are generally overseas and do not have to co-operate with LE.

The ISP has access to this, all that needs to happen is for an offense to be serious enough to get the police involved.
Then all your personal information on file at the ISP will be handed to police and they may or may no be consequences.

 

[curr3n_c1000]

I work with both, and I can assure you, most websites do not have that info. We mostly have IP addy only. And subpeonaing a VPN is damned near impossible as most are overseas and do not co-operate.

IP addy is all you need. From that you can find the carrier and game over.

VPNs give up info all the time, they get hacked, they get their encryption code crack. The idea that they keep you hidden is all marketing to sell their service.

 

[Phil C. McNasty]

Of coarse you all noticed, I am in no way suggesting we take away Free Speech. I believe that's a human right. I am only suggesting we do away with anonymity. I mean, if you can back it up, what are you afraid of?

Because people are much more likely give their honest opinion in anonymity then they would be in person.
Thats why I like anonymity better because it gives me a much better perspective of what people are really thinking

 

[poker]

So when anon

Because people are much more likely give their honest opinion in anonymity then they would be in person.
Thats why I like anonymity better because it gives me a much better perspective of what people are really thinking

I enjoy the anonymity too... however, to play Satin's attorney, is that not an indictment on our view of the system. We really really don't believe "free speech" exists... and based on the above comments, expect and fear retribution. While I specifically laid out the we keep the riggt to free speech, some went straight to Jews in the holocaust and firing squads.

It's been an interesting thought experiment just the same

 

[Zipperpants]

Well one thing for sure is there would be a lot less fighting on the internet except when it comes to politics. People aren’t afraid to voice their opinions on that.

 

[Zipperpants]

I work with both, and I can assure you, most websites do not have that info. We mostly have IP addy only. And subpeonaing a VPN is damned near impossible as most are overseas and do not co-operate.

lol IP addy is the only thing needed. Internet carriers only pretend to care about privacy. once the government/cops come knocking with that IP addy they will give up your info fast.

 

[Jasmina]

IP addy is not all you need, now this convo is running in circles. Mobile IPs now cover a ton of people, they aren't 'unique'. VPNs get the same "hacked" attempts as any other site, sure, whats that got to do with what we are talking about? As I said, I work both with IT and legal departments, I know for a fact most VPNs do not respond to subpeona requests, most are overseas so they don't HAVE to. It's not in their best interest to. As I also said, Canadian LE rarely subpeonas information technology at all.

IP addy is all you need. From that you can find the carrier and game over.

VPNs give up info all the time, they get hacked, they get their encryption code crack. The idea that they keep you hidden is all marketing to sell their service.

 

[curr3n_c1000]

IP addy is not all you need, now this convo is running in circles. Mobile IPs now cover a ton of people, they aren't 'unique'. VPNs get the same "hacked" attempts as any other site, sure, whats that got to do with what we are talking about? As I said, I work both with IT and legal departments, I know for a fact most VPNs do not respond to subpeona requests, most are overseas so they don't HAVE to. It's not in their best interest to. As I also said, Canadian LE rarely subpeonas information technology at all.

So how does data on mobile IPs get routed to the right device?

My original point is we already have Identifiers and they work very well. You will need to be a high-level cyber criminal to truly outmanoeuvre the law and even they get caught (or at least tracked).

And if VPN providers don't want to comply, they have other ways. If the reason is valid, the world government has no problem taking you out.

Law enforcement take down three bulletproof VPN providers

The three VPN services provided safe haven for cybercriminals to carry out ransomware attacks, web skimming operations, spearphishing, and account takeovers.

www.zdnet.com