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Canadians want a wealth tax and are willing to vote for it

danmand

Well-known member
Nov 28, 2003
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Will we see our deficit narrowing with a wealth tax implemented?
Every single political party in Canada will increase the deficit when in government. No exception.
 

saxon

Well-known member
Dec 2, 2009
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That is pretty much the way it works in both USA, Canada and countries in Europe.

Try to move out of a country and stop paying taxes to that country. It is very difficult. For USA citizens it is impossible, For Canadians it is almost impossible. Even small countries like Denmark make it difficult. It took me 5 years, including a suit at the high court after I immigrated to Canada to stop being taxable in Denmark.

And good luck trying to hide assets in other jurisdictions. Have you heard of Fintrac?
Americans have to renounce their citizenship to avoid paying taxes to Uncle Sam. Canadians simply have to get residency status somewhere else and apply to Revenue Canada to be a non resident for income tax purposes. Much easier for Canadians than Americans.
 

danmand

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Nov 28, 2003
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Americans have to renounce their citizenship to avoid paying taxes to Uncle Sam. Canadians simply have to get residency status somewhere else and apply to Revenue Canada to be a non resident for income tax purposes. Much easier for Canadians than Americans.
Correct , it is easier for Canadians, but you have to sever all financial links to Canada. Bank accounts, property etc. in order to cease being taxable. It is possible, but not easy, if you are older and have accumulated assets.

And it is not that easy anymore to get residence status somewhere else (where you would want to live).
 

saxon

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Dec 2, 2009
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Correct , it is easier for Canadians, but you have to sever all financial links to Canada. Bank accounts, property etc. in order to cease being taxable. It is possible, but not easy, if you are older and have accumulated assets.

And it is not that easy anymore to get residence status somewhere else (where you would want to live).
If you plan on living somewhere else you would not need to have any financial ties to Canada, other things you would need to do are pretty simple, you have to cancel your OHIP coverage and get rid of your drivers license sell your car and any property you may own in Canada. Finding a new home is quite easy actually, as long as you have no criminal record and can prove you have the financial resources to support yourself and will not need to work or rely on government benefits in your new home country.
 

JohnLarue

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Jan 19, 2005
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Every single political party in Canada will increase the deficit when in government. No exception.
Correct
Justin Trudeau has foolishly created a structural deficit
A structural deficit which can not be reversed within a 4 year mandate. It will take decades if the cutting were to start Monday.

The lenders will stop lending if the plan is to borrow into perpetuity
 

Darts

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Jan 15, 2017
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It’s actually quite easy in fact former liberal Prime Minister Paul Martin did it with Canada shipping lines they registered their ships in foreign countries to avoid labor laws and taxes
I think the Trudeau's have their assets in a trust that was set up by grandfather. Don't ask me how it works, but apparently, it works so Justin doesn't have to work.

Don't tell anybody but I'll probably end up in Singapore where my university roommate is now Chairman (Chairwoman/Chairperson) of the family business.
 

danmand

Well-known member
Nov 28, 2003
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If you plan on living somewhere else you would not need to have any financial ties to Canada, other things you would need to do are pretty simple, you have to cancel your OHIP coverage and get rid of your drivers license sell your car and any property you may own in Canada.
If you are young, it is easy. If you are older with accumulated assets, not so painless.

Finding a new home is quite easy actually, as long as you have no criminal record and can prove you have the financial resources to support yourself and will not need to work or rely on government benefits in your new home country.
I don't believe you are correct. Have you tried to get work permit/residence status in any first world country? I have experience with a few countries.
 

Ref

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Oct 29, 2002
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Add to this that lower income people cannot afford accountants and generally do not understand the tax system. Some years ago, I volunteered with CAMH to help the people on welfare get their benefits (HST and Rent subsidy). They have to file a tax return to get these.
Question - Would a high paid accountant be able to find anything for lower income people? I highly doubt it.

Thus, low income people would never require the services of a "high paid" accountant.
 
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Ref

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Sorry i lost my cool guys its just im tired of having to personally defend myself about taxes when the Conservative men are looking to play dirty. For what its worth i just turned 48 and i think my hormones arent balanced perhaps its mental pause haha. now back to discussion. cheers,
Rich people are not just conservative men, they are male and female from all political stripes.

Per your situation, people who are able to earn a living on a cash basis generally take advantage of that position and do not report all of their income to the government. Since you have stated that you report every penny, then you are in the minority of those folks (I would even say a 1%'er).

Earlier this year I had a company re-shingle my roof. The provided me with two options - An invoice complete with GST or pay by cash and no GST. I know for a fact that if I paid cash they would not report that income and I am fine with that. I saved by not paying GST. Did I rip off the system and possibly cause some hardship to someone way down the tax line? Yes.
 

Frankfooter

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Apr 10, 2015
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I would argue that it's just wealth redistribution.

If you want to really reduce inequality, you need to come up with a way to motivate or encourage the work shy individuals in our society to be successful and productive and earn a decent living on their own. Just giving them money you take from a successful person will not solve the problem. In fact it will make it worse because you provide the work shy with free money it only conditions them to be lay-abouts.

As I previously stated Canada is THEE most unproductive nation in the G7 and I suspect one the most unproductive developed nations in the world. We have a very large number of people who have no marketable skills but manage to eak out an existence through sporadic subsistence employment and or one government program or another. You only advocate a system which makes it worse.

Ive thought about it a bit over the years and to me it all comes back to our education system. It's a joke frankly. The Asians and some Europeans are eating us up because their education system is rigourous and tough frankly. Ours is taught by teachers who don't believe in teaching math because they don't know how to do math themselves. I looked at what my kids were being taught in school now and it was not giving them the tools they need to be successful. It was disgrace in fact. I won't get into specifics about what I've seen with my kids for obvious reasons, but it caused both my wife and I to go head to head with the TDSB and finally in frustration pulling our kids out of the public school system.

Ive come to the conclusion that the Canadian school system as it currently exists is dumbing down kids, is not demanding enough and not giving them the tools they need to be successful.

I was born in a lower middle class hard working family in the north end of Hamilton with 3 siblings. Both my parents worked and sacrificed and taught us the value of hard work at school. I was educated in the public school system. None of us ever were allowed to take bird courses at school. My mother saw to that. What I see now being taught in schools is unrecognizable to me.

Ontario needs to have an education system that teaches hard skills that will allow kids to become successful in a field that creates wealth for them and the society as a whole. Without that, we will continue to be a nation where the only solution is coming up with more and more taxes to feed the pigeons.
I would argue that letting the rich and powerful set the rules through lobbying influence, like in the US, is a disaster.
The US does just what you want yet fails on almost all the metrics, inequality, life span, happiness...

Sounds like you want the schools to teach trades, by the way,.
 
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Boss Nass

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Jun 7, 2002
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Hopefully with my face in a pussy
What the average person fails to realize is that a tax on a corporation or the wealthy is really a tax on you.
Why you dummies? Cause the business will just raise prices and pass on the tax to the customer, but hey, keep cheering for higher taxes lol
Well, ya see, there's another principle we've all heard: Charge what the market will bear. If you price you product or servce too high, then people can't afford it, and your business tanks. So the people at the top need to tighten their belts.
 

HEYHEY

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Nov 25, 2005
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Well, ya see, there's another principle we've all heard: Charge what the market will bear. If you price you product or servce too high, then people can't afford it, and your business tanks. So the people at the top need to tighten their belts.
Yea that's it, the people at the top will tighten their belts lol
Lemme know how that goes

Average person goes years without a raise, everything in stores goes up on a regular basis and at the same time portions get smaller and smaller

Rich people didnt get rich by tightening their belts, they get rich cause they understand money and the world
 

HEYHEY

Well-known member
Nov 25, 2005
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So, a tax on the wealthy means they will pass on the tax to you. You are a genius, nobody else sees that.
Guess who owns businesses? Wealthy individuals

As a business owner myself I can tell you, any increase of taxes or my costs are passed on to the customer
 

contact

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Aug 1, 2012
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Well, ya see, there's another principle we've all heard: Charge what the market will bear. If you price you product or servce too high, then people can't afford it, and your business tanks. So the people at the top need to tighten their belts.
Have you ever shopped outside of Canada? You do realize we already pay extremely high prices for most goods Canadians get gouged most Canadian made goods are cheaper in the us
 

contact

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Rich people got rich by tightening poor people's belts.
More bullshit Rich people got rich but either a inheriting it getting a good education working hard and earning what they have they don’t sit around and expect free handouts or think they’re entitled to everything free from the government
 

danmand

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Nov 28, 2003
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Guess who owns businesses? Wealthy individuals

As a business owner myself I can tell you, any increase of taxes or my costs are passed on to the customer
This thread is about how to tax wealthy individuals, not about how to tax small business owners.
 
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LickingG2

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May 6, 2020
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You are assuming that wealthy people pay that marginal rate. You assumption would be wrong. If you have managed to accumulate wealth you likely are smart enough to retain good accountants and lawyers and are highly unlikely to pay at that marginal rate. People who are on a salary are much more likely to pay those rates and that is the biggest impediment to accumulating capital. hence the disparity and wealth gap grows.
You are just assuming without any facts. Taxable from salaries, interest and/or dividends is near impossible to hide. KMPG set up an offshore dodge in the Channel Islands, I believe which is being shut down. This type of scheme are caused, in good measure because are tax rates are so high now. Increasing tax well only make it worse and you will lose even more high achieving individuals, and their investment capital. Do you really want that just so you can get more of a free ride at their expense? I getting damn tired of paying tax at at 53% and still having you mopes complain that it isn't enough.
 
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danmand

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Nov 28, 2003
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You are just assuming without any facts. Taxable from salaries, interest and/or dividends is near impossible to hide. KMPG set up an offshore dodge in the Channel Islands, I believe which is being shut down. This type of scheme are caused, in good measure because are tax rates are so high now. Increasing tax well only make it worse and you will lose even more high achieving individuals, and their investment capital. Do you really want that just so you can get more of a free ride at their expense? I getting damn tired of paying tax at at 53% and still having you mopes complain that it isn't enough.
You should be tired of paying 53% of your income in taxes.

The highest MARGINAL tax rate if you live in Ontario is 46%.

For the first $100,000 of income, you pay 22% in taxes.
 
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toguy5252

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Jun 22, 2009
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You are just assuming without any facts. Taxable from salaries, interest and/or dividends is near impossible to hide. KMPG set up an offshore dodge in the Channel Islands, I believe which is being shut down. This type of scheme are caused, in good measure because are tax rates are so high now. Increasing tax well only make it worse and you will lose even more high achieving individuals, and their investment capital. Do you really want that just so you can get more of a free ride at their expense? I getting damn tired of paying tax at at 53% and still having you mopes complain that it isn't enough.
You are making my point. People with a lot of income and/or assets have the financial ability and motivation to seek out these schemes. There are many perfectly legal deferral opportunities to which only the rich have access. The point is that the marginal rates are irrelevant if people are not paying them.

By the way I am in the highest bracket and I do not pay at that rate. I make use of some of these deferral and saving opportunities, all legal. I think that theses opportunities should be examined as most serve no purpose whatsoever other than to allow people like me to pay less tax. An increase in my tax burden would not affect my decision to stay in Canada one bit. Do I like paying a lot of tax? Not at all. But I understand that is the cost I pay of being successful financially which Canada has made possible. And I also understand the BS that goes into these arguments about how excessive our tax system is and how it is impeding business at a time when stock markets and corporate profits are at record highs. So lets get real and just say people with a lot of money don't like paying a lot of tax. Or any tax for that matter. That is the only argument which is true.
 
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