Florida bans its schools from teaching critical race theory

mandrill

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2001
77,282
91,849
113


The GOP protected the free speech of Dr Seuss and Gina Carano, but apparently any high school teacher who suggests US society is inherently racist get less free speech protection than the Grinch or a woman who ranted that the pandemic was a hoax.

Explain this to me, righties?

Also how many weeks it's going to survive without being struck down as unconstitutional?
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
92,761
22,863
113


The GOP protected the free speech of Dr Seuss and Gina Carano, but apparently any high school teacher who suggests US society is inherently racist get less free speech protection than the Grinch or a woman who ranted that the pandemic was a hoax.

Explain this to me, righties?

Also how many weeks it's going to survive without being struck down as unconstitutional?
Cancel culture really is a right wing thing.
 

y2kmark

Class of 69...
May 19, 2002
19,045
5,430
113
Lewiston, NY
One "theory" and one book, meh. Just teach real American history; all the riots, lynchings, massacres. and historical statements from the time. For example, Alexander Stevens gave a speech on being sworn in as Vice President of the Confederacy. Clearly shows that the war was about slavery, historical revisionism notwithstanding. A lot of what was taught needs fixing. Was listening to a caller on the talk show of one of the Rush wannabes. She was wondering why the 40 acres and a mule all the black folks got when set free wasn't enough? 🤡This bozo just agreed with her, uh huh...
 

WyattEarp

Well-known member
May 17, 2017
7,493
2,233
113
Outside a very few liberal cities, critical race theory won't be taught in American schools. The word "theory" is kind of the driver here. We don't teach "theory" to small children. There is plenty of time for theory in high school and college.

It's fun when people bandy around "free speech protection" so loosely. As has been mentioned here many, many times with right wing and left wing speech, one might have the right to free speech, but that doesn't shield you from the consequence. An employer, in this case a State, can instruct you what to teach. It's fairly simple. I don't know too many workplaces where unrestricted free speech is allowed. I can have pretty much any political opinion outside work, but I'm not really free to voice and campaign political ideas in the workplace.

Oh, and much to your surprise we're actually taught here in the States that the war was about slavery. There probably were some Southern school districts pushing the "States' Right" myth and other revisionism in schools through the 1970s. Occasionally, you come across some person in daily life or social media who grasped this lesson. You can usually point to the words of Confederate leaders at that time. They were fairly unambiguous for the need to fight for slavery. I personally believe Alexander Stevens the VP of the Confederacy was a traitor to the United States.

The Confederate South was a traditional, agrarian society rooted in slavery. Relative to the United States, It was a small region both in population and economic measurements. Due to Northern industrialization and immigration, the South's importance was getting smaller and smaller unless it could push slavery into Western states. It's been repeated and usually ignored that the slave owning population was very small.
 

mandrill

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2001
77,282
91,849
113
Outside a very few liberal cities, critical race theory won't be taught in American schools. The word "theory" is kind of the driver here. We don't teach "theory" to small children. There is plenty of time for theory in high school and college.

It's fun when people bandy around "free speech protection" so loosely. As has been mentioned here many, many times with right wing and left wing speech, one might have the right to free speech, but that doesn't shield you from the consequence. An employer, in this case a State, can instruct you what to teach. It's fairly simple. I don't know too many workplaces where unrestricted free speech is allowed. I can have pretty much any political opinion outside work, but I'm not really free to voice and campaign political ideas in the workplace.

Oh, and much to your surprise we're actually taught here in the States that the war was about slavery. There probably were some Southern school districts pushing the "States' Right" myth and other revisionism in schools through the 1970s. Occasionally, you come across some person in daily life or social media who grasped this lesson. You can usually point to the words of Confederate leaders at that time. They were fairly unambiguous for the need to fight for slavery. I personally believe Alexander Stevens the VP of the Confederacy was a traitor to the United States.

The Confederate South was a traditional, agrarian society rooted in slavery. Relative to the United States, It was a small region both in population and economic measurements. Due to Northern industrialization and immigration, the South's importance was getting smaller and smaller unless it could push slavery into Western states. It's been repeated and usually ignored that the slave owning population was very small.
I'd be interested if you have any figures off the top of your head re the % of slave owners among the white population. There were entire regions - i.e. Appalachia - which were so isolated and so dirt poor that slave owning was pretty much unknown. And I am also guessing that the dominant planter class owned the vast bulk of the resources, incl the slaves. But I also assumed that middle class whites might own a slave or two.

As to what Americans were taught, I had no fixed opinion beyond noting that the "states' rights" theory was pretty strong during the 90's where there was a Civil War revival in mass culture incl movies such as Gettysburg and the Ken Burns' tv series and several monthlies about the military campaigns.

The South had about 25% of the total white population of America at the time. North = 20 mill. South = 7 mill.

Not being an American, I don't have a precise idea of when a workplace is a "state actor"; but it strikes me that if the legislature is enacting what can be taught at state schools, that we have reached the point where the workplace is an arm of the state. Feel free to comment?
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
92,761
22,863
113
Outside a very few liberal cities, critical race theory won't be taught in American schools.
Critical race theory wasn't being taught anywhere before this all started, it was just another theory
Of course now that the right wing has made it the big topic, more people are talking about it while the righties just try to cancel something that wasn't a big deal.
 

WyattEarp

Well-known member
May 17, 2017
7,493
2,233
113
Not being an American, I don't have a precise idea of when a workplace is a "state actor"; but it strikes me that if the legislature is enacting what can be taught at state schools, that we have reached the point where the workplace is an arm of the state. Feel free to comment?
I'm not sure how public schools K-12 work in Canada. Here public schools are both an arm of the state (including elected school boards) along side the teachers' unions. Obviously the actual States (as in one of the U.S. states) are powerful, but so are teacher's unions in many states. I don't think teacher's unions will fight too hard for teaching critical race theory. There primary mission is the economic well-being and job security of their members. Teaching controversial programs does interfere with those goals. It doesn't do them any good to alienate a great deal of the population even if a significant group of teachers think it is vital.

Where it could get interesting is if an elected local school board votes to include "critical race theory" in curriculum in a State where it is prohibited. I don't know if the State can legally withhold support. I'm not sure all public schools receive funds from their State governments. There is always a mix of local and Federal funding.

Elected local school boards are kind of the highest in the pecking order in our system, but that also doesn't mean school boards don't get replaced by voters. I don't know the exact details, but I've heard of some school boards that were advocating CRT had been replaced. I suspect the Courts in the long run will place the CRT decision with the local school board.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: mandrill

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
61,840
6,819
113
Does the bill define what it is or is it just another catch phrase they're using to sucker angry voters?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Valcazar

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
32,225
59,719
113
Does the bill define what it is or is it just another catch phrase they're using to sucker angry voters?
Bingo.
"Critical race theory" is just "anything that implies white people did anything bad".
It has nothing to do with the actual legal analysis.
they admitted this publcally.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
92,761
22,863
113
Bingo.
"Critical race theory" is just "anything that implies white people did anything bad".
It has nothing to do with the actual legal analysis.
they admitted this publcally.
Meanwhile, they've already missed the boat. The right wing spends so much time pushing the white genocide or 'illegal immigrant' story to frighten their base but the real story is that there are just way more mixed marriages and kids. The idea of what is 'white' is changing and becoming way to blurred to last as a narrative.

 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
32,225
59,719
113
Meanwhile, they've already missed the boat. The right wing spends so much time pushing the white genocide or 'illegal immigrant' story to frighten their base but the real story is that there are just way more mixed marriages and kids. The idea of what is 'white' is changing and becoming way to blurred to last as a narrative.
"White" will last a long time. You just keep redefining it as needed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Leimonis

Insidious Von

My head is my home
Sep 12, 2007
40,176
7,525
113
What's the problem?

Don't they have open carry in Florida schools, everything's fine.
 

mandrill

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2001
77,282
91,849
113

mandrill

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2001
77,282
91,849
113
Good point. Italians, Spaniards, and Jews weren't considered 'white' 100 years ago.
1970's my very Brit dad certainly regarded them as lesser races.
 

K Douglas

Half Man Half Amazing
Jan 5, 2005
27,644
8,399
113
Room 112


The GOP protected the free speech of Dr Seuss and Gina Carano, but apparently any high school teacher who suggests US society is inherently racist get less free speech protection than the Grinch or a woman who ranted that the pandemic was a hoax.

Explain this to me, righties?

Also how many weeks it's going to survive without being struck down as unconstitutional?
Easy to explain. That teacher is paid by the state. They don't have free speech in the classroom. Especially when it sows division and hate. Fuck CRT.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mr.Know-It-All

mandrill

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2001
77,282
91,849
113
Easy to explain. That teacher is paid by the state. They don't have free speech in the classroom. Especially when it sows division and hate. Fuck CRT.
Kirky, that's the worst analysis that I have ever read. Let's go through it.

If you're speech is disruptive or otherwise against corporate rules, then everyone agrees you can be fired. For example, I can't tell my buxom co worker that I am going to jerk off on her tits and if her husband tried to stop me, I'm going to beat the shit out of him. That's bad. That gets you fired.

Not what's happening here. Here you have a government directive made on political / public policy grounds that a certain type of history / current events cannot be taught. The directive comes from the governor. Now if a teacher teaches his / her own shit outside the curriculum, he can be fired. He's not doing his job. But what if the directive interferes with the curriculum on political grounds? Can the governor dictate that each Democratic president in US history be portrayed as an imbecile in a specially written curriculum? And that all Republican presidents be portrayed as super heroes?

That seems like an interference in free speech, as the curriculum is being set up on partisan political grounds.

So that's the question and you totally missed it.
 
Toronto Escorts