WHO: A positive PCR test does not in itself constitute infection

IRIS

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On January 20, 2021, not only was Joseph Biden inaugurated as President of the United States, but the WHO also made an extraordinary announcement.The 11-month mantra-like test call and recommendation turned out to be unfounded and unscientific, and completely meaningless. 2 weeks ago the WHO posted this on its site.

2021/January 20th.


WHO guidance Diagnostic testing for SARS-CoV-2 states that careful interpretation of weak positive results is needed (1). The cycle threshold (Ct) needed to detect virus is inversely proportional to the patient’s viral load. Where test results do not correspond with the clinical presentation, a new specimen should be taken and retested using the same or different NAT technology.WHO reminds IVD[1] users that disease prevalence alters the predictive value of test results; as disease prevalence decreases, the risk of false positive increases (2). This means that the probability that a person who has a positive result (SARS-CoV-2 detected) is truly infected with SARS-CoV-2 decreases as prevalence decreases, irrespective of the claimed specificity.

Most PCR assays are indicated as an aid for diagnosis, therefore, health care providers must consider any result in combination with timing of sampling, specimen type, assay specifics, clinical observations, patient history, confirmed status of any contacts, and epidemiological information.

Interestingly, the WHO statement did not receive the expected publicity of the media. The headlines didn’t follow each other anywhere, there was no news on the TV every hour, not in the radio, not in the news.

However, WHO findings have not only diagnostic, but also legal and political implications at the global level. So far, all official government agency have considered the tests to be a positive test result, the same as an infection that posed an acute threat to their fellow human beings. Therefore, people were massively isolated from each other, regardless of any harm. The recent WHO communication is a clear resolution.

Accordingly, the following concepts must be distinguished:
- contaminated (test positive)
- infected, infectious (or likely to be clearly distinguishable depending on the viral load, based on the threshold of the PCR test).

An infected person is a person from whom a virus or other pathogen can be detected. However, an infected person does not become infected automatically. This is because the infected person is the one in whom the virus multiplies, and the infected person shows the characteristic symptoms. This only happens if the viral load is high enough (i.e., the PCR test still gives a positive result after a few doublings [below 20]).

If few viruses enter the body, the infection will fail. He who is not infected cannot infect the other person either. Because infectivity is a condition of infection. That is, one who walks the world without symptoms can be said with almost complete certainty that he does not pose a risk of infection to the other person. Isolation of a person based on a positive PCR test (with a high threshold = low viral load) and forced to wear a mask - lacks any scientific basis from which it follows directly that no legislation or regulation can be established on the results of PCR tests.

Thus, on January 20, 2021, the WHO legally repealed all epidemiological measures that were based on PCR tests and were not supported by other diagnostic methods. This cannot be stressed enough. Quarantine measures ordered solely on the basis of a positive PCR test shall be considered unjustified. Any closure or curfew that refers to the results of PCR assays is unfounded.

The legislature can no longer pretend not to know about the WHO decision.

It is also unreasonable and unconstitutional to declare all emergencies and epidemiological emergencies where they are referred to the results of PCR tests.

Legitimate measures can only be taken on scientifically sound grounds.


The New York Times publicized a same opinion by many virologist on August 29th. but who cares.
They said: Maybe up to 90% of those classified as fake-infected.


 

PeteOsborne

Kingston recon
Feb 12, 2020
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On January 20, 2021, not only was Joseph Biden inaugurated as President of the United States, but the WHO also made an extraordinary announcement.The 11-month mantra-like test call and recommendation turned out to be unfounded and unscientific, and completely meaningless. 2 weeks ago the WHO posted this on its site.

2021/January 20th.


WHO guidance Diagnostic testing for SARS-CoV-2 states that careful interpretation of weak positive results is needed (1). The cycle threshold (Ct) needed to detect virus is inversely proportional to the patient’s viral load. Where test results do not correspond with the clinical presentation, a new specimen should be taken and retested using the same or different NAT technology.WHO reminds IVD[1] users that disease prevalence alters the predictive value of test results; as disease prevalence decreases, the risk of false positive increases (2). This means that the probability that a person who has a positive result (SARS-CoV-2 detected) is truly infected with SARS-CoV-2 decreases as prevalence decreases, irrespective of the claimed specificity.

Most PCR assays are indicated as an aid for diagnosis, therefore, health care providers must consider any result in combination with timing of sampling, specimen type, assay specifics, clinical observations, patient history, confirmed status of any contacts, and epidemiological information.

Interestingly, the WHO statement did not receive the expected publicity of the media. The headlines didn’t follow each other anywhere, there was no news on the TV every hour, not in the radio, not in the news.

However, WHO findings have not only diagnostic, but also legal and political implications at the global level. So far, all official government agency have considered the tests to be a positive test result, the same as an infection that posed an acute threat to their fellow human beings. Therefore, people were massively isolated from each other, regardless of any harm. The recent WHO communication is a clear resolution.

Accordingly, the following concepts must be distinguished:
- contaminated (test positive)
- infected, infectious (or likely to be clearly distinguishable depending on the viral load, based on the threshold of the PCR test).

An infected person is a person from whom a virus or other pathogen can be detected. However, an infected person does not become infected automatically. This is because the infected person is the one in whom the virus multiplies, and the infected person shows the characteristic symptoms. This only happens if the viral load is high enough (i.e., the PCR test still gives a positive result after a few doublings [below 20]).

If few viruses enter the body, the infection will fail. He who is not infected cannot infect the other person either. Because infectivity is a condition of infection. That is, one who walks the world without symptoms can be said with almost complete certainty that he does not pose a risk of infection to the other person. Isolation of a person based on a positive PCR test (with a high threshold = low viral load) and forced to wear a mask - lacks any scientific basis from which it follows directly that no legislation or regulation can be established on the results of PCR tests.

Thus, on January 20, 2021, the WHO legally repealed all epidemiological measures that were based on PCR tests and were not supported by other diagnostic methods. This cannot be stressed enough. Quarantine measures ordered solely on the basis of a positive PCR test shall be considered unjustified. Any closure or curfew that refers to the results of PCR assays is unfounded.

The legislature can no longer pretend not to know about the WHO decision.

It is also unreasonable and unconstitutional to declare all emergencies and epidemiological emergencies where they are referred to the results of PCR tests.

Legitimate measures can only be taken on scientifically sound grounds.


The New York Times publicized a same opinion by many virologist on August 29th. but who cares.
They said: Maybe up to 90% of those classified as fake-infected.


This was brought up once before in another thread with false claims as well.
To correct your comments this is an information notice for laboratory professionals and users of IVDs not an announcement.
It was originally released January 13 and was corrected on the 19th because of a typo and re released on the 20th.
Your statement "The 11-month mantra-like test call and recommendation turned out to be unfounded and unscientific, and completely meaningless" has nothing to do with this information notice that tells laboratory professionals and users of IVDs of a clarification of a previous information notice dated December 14,2020.
This information notice just says that users of IVDS must read and follow the IFU carefully to determine if manual adjustment of the PCR positivity threshold is recommended by the manufacturer and that careful interpretation of weak positive results is needed (1). The cycle threshold (Ct) needed to detect virus is inversely proportional to the patient’s viral load. Where test results do not correspond with the clinical presentation, a new specimen should be taken and retested using the same or different NAT technology.
What this means is that they are to check how much virus has been located in the sample and evaluate according to the manufacturers specifications to reduce the chance of a false positive result.

This notice is just to let the people doing the tests know what they need to evaluate the tests results properly.
Again there is nothing that says the PCR test is as you say " unfounded and unscientific, and completely meaningless".
There was no news coverage of this because there is no news here.
Everything you stated after that is irrelevant.
Including the article by the Times which uses data and procedures from 6 months ago, but no where in this article does it state that the PCR test is not valid.
 
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IRIS

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doggyorcg

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So basically a higher viral load threshold on the “valid and scientific” PCR Test means it will be harder to conclude a positive covid diagnosis. Very convenient revising of the diagnostic parameters as more people are vaccinated. The casino has rigged the table. Covid cases will corespondingly and predictably decrease as more people get vaccinated. So this is how the House always wins!
 

squeezer

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So basically people who don't want to believe covid is real will clutch to any headline that some blogger or social media star puts out there without bothering to read what the actual story is about.
Incredible isn't it! It's like watching a comedy series that ends in a train wreck.
 

IRIS

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So basically people who don't want to believe covid is real will clutch to any headline that some blogger or social media star puts out there without bothering to read what the actual story is about.
Yeah, right. When the leftist NYT or WHO are in your side then they are official. I read the both article and other guys too. Short and understandable version: The PCR test hyper oversensitive, produce lots of false positive test. The real number of the "infected" are far more less, than the media suggested. Those numbers are false.
 

Platon

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So basically people who don't want to believe covid is real will clutch to any headline that some blogger or social media star puts out there without bothering to read what the actual story is about.
You really want to put that one out there? The info is available on WHO's website (any link uhh?). This is something a few health professionals have been talking about for some time, which explains a lot of things about the scale of this "pandemic". I don't think that anybody denied COVID in this thread so far, rather the efficacy of the test was questioned and not by the OP but by WHO themselves.
 

Malibuk

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It's true that a positive PCR test does not always mean infection, but it is much better to err on the side of caution.
False negatives could be a catastrophe.
 

Jenesis

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Rorschach

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Yeah, right. When the leftist NYT or WHO are in your side then they are official. I read the both article and other guys too. Short and understandable version: The PCR test hyper oversensitive, produce lots of false positive test. The real number of the "infected" are far more less, than the media suggested. Those numbers are false.
I know who I'm not booking – can't put my cock in to a right wing nut job.
 
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Jenesis

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I know who I'm not booking – can't but my cock in to a right wing nut job.

In all fairness to Iris, I don't think she is going to care. She, like me, post for ourselves in the lounge. Not for advertising.

On top of that, posting the way we do works out to be a form of screening. She is going to think you're a leftist and she won't want to be with you. So you just saved her the trouble.

I'm just pointing this out because lots of guys think this type of post/insult/threat is going to upset or bother us and it doesn't phase ladies like us who post here in the lounge. Not one bit.

I'm not saying this rudely either. I just know for me, I like my job and the guys I meet because we are like-minded. They find we are like-minded in my posts. I only want the like-minded ones. So if my post put you off of me because you don't like my stance on a topic, then that actually works out to be a good thing. You don't waste your money and I don't waste my time. It is a win-win. I'm sure Iris feels the same.

Sorry but I just wanted to point that out before a bunch jump on the bandwagon and think this would have any effect on her because it won't. And it won't have any effect on her business. Plenty of right-wingers would be dying to see her.


And I say this for her even though we usually disagree on a lot of political issues.
 
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doggyorcg

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Nov 29, 2020
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It's true that a positive PCR test does not always mean infection, but it is much better to err on the side of caution.
False negatives could be a catastrophe.
Definitely makes sense. 🤪 Always better to kill small businesses, ruin people futures, strain/end relationships, increase alcohol/drug consumptions, turn neighbors against each other rather than have false negatives.
 

TeeJay

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Jun 20, 2011
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It's true that a positive PCR test does not always mean infection, but it is much better to err on the side of caution.
False negatives could be a catastrophe.
Unlikely a false negative would have had anywhere near as disastrous result as the millions of false positives we do have
 

PeteOsborne

Kingston recon
Feb 12, 2020
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We will never know.
Yes, we do know, somewhat, until the next study is released in Ontario.
" As of May 23, 2020, PHO Laboratory has detected false positive SARS-CoV-2 results on approximately 20 occasions among over 228,000 specimens tested to date for COVID-19, with ~11,000 specimens testing positive. This represents a false positivity rate of less than 0.01% (specificity of >99.99%), which is well beyond performance targets for a laboratory test."
It also goes on to say
" False positive results can occur at various stages of laboratory testing, which can be grouped into the following categories:
1. Pre-analytical errors. These are errors that occur prior to the actual testing being done. These could include mislabelling of samples that result in incorrect results being reported. They may also result from specimen contamination in transport or during aliquoting in the laboratory.
2. Analytical errors. These occur during the actual laboratory testing. These could occur for various reasons such as reagent contamination. Reagents can arrive contaminated from the supplier. To mitigate this, each new batch undergoes a quality assurance check before being put into use. False positive results can also arise from contamination due to pipetting errors, which can be due to human error or defects in automated equipment. Such analytic errors are controlled by having negative and positive controls on each run of the assay, which are reviewed prior to releasing results.
3. Post-analytical errors. This involves result interpretation by the technologist and reporting of results. Incorrect interpretation could lead to a false positive result. Transcription errors could also result in false positive results being generated. Such errors are controlled by having a second technologist review results prior to them being reported out.

The Who Information Notice that the OP refers to is to try to correct the number 2 & 3 reasons for a false positive in an effort to get them to zero, noting more nothing less.

The NY Times is as I said irrelevant since it uses old data from the U.S. and doesn't mention that at the governments order, covid tests were approved for use by the FDA without going through proper testing to see how accurate they were. Some were creating many false negatives and many were creating false positives.
https://www.propublica.org/article/...the-fda-but-its-unclear-how-accurate-they-are
Then they did the same wit antibody tests.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/04/19/fda-antibody-tests-coronavirus-review/
 

squeezer

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2010
20,615
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Yes, we do know, somewhat, until the next study is released in Ontario.
" As of May 23, 2020, PHO Laboratory has detected false positive SARS-CoV-2 results on approximately 20 occasions among over 228,000 specimens tested to date for COVID-19, with ~11,000 specimens testing positive. This represents a false positivity rate of less than 0.01% (specificity of >99.99%), which is well beyond performance targets for a laboratory test."
It also goes on to say
" False positive results can occur at various stages of laboratory testing, which can be grouped into the following categories:
1. Pre-analytical errors. These are errors that occur prior to the actual testing being done. These could include mislabelling of samples that result in incorrect results being reported. They may also result from specimen contamination in transport or during aliquoting in the laboratory.
2. Analytical errors. These occur during the actual laboratory testing. These could occur for various reasons such as reagent contamination. Reagents can arrive contaminated from the supplier. To mitigate this, each new batch undergoes a quality assurance check before being put into use. False positive results can also arise from contamination due to pipetting errors, which can be due to human error or defects in automated equipment. Such analytic errors are controlled by having negative and positive controls on each run of the assay, which are reviewed prior to releasing results.
3. Post-analytical errors. This involves result interpretation by the technologist and reporting of results. Incorrect interpretation could lead to a false positive result. Transcription errors could also result in false positive results being generated. Such errors are controlled by having a second technologist review results prior to them being reported out.

The Who Information Notice that the OP refers to is to try to correct the number 2 & 3 reasons for a false positive in an effort to get them to zero, noting more nothing less.

The NY Times is as I said irrelevant since it uses old data from the U.S. and doesn't mention that at the governments order, covid tests were approved for use by the FDA without going through proper testing to see how accurate they were. Some were creating many false negatives and many were creating false positives.
https://www.propublica.org/article/...the-fda-but-its-unclear-how-accurate-they-are
Then they did the same wit antibody tests.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/04/19/fda-antibody-tests-coronavirus-review/
So wait, it's stating TJ's one million false positives and whatever malarky Doggieorcj is vomiting is all fakenews?? Really??
 
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