Vaughan Spa

Racism from Providers

VirginJohn

Active member
Dec 1, 2005
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I think for the most part, it's just preferences as opposed to racism. Sure, there's generalization, many probably refuse to see black men under this impression of black guys being aggressive/or based on whatever experiences they might have endured. Just like many probably refuse to see black men because they are simply not attracted to us. I don't think it's racism at all, and this is coming from a black guy. It can definitely be a little discouraging to read 'No Black men' in many ads when you find someone who is well reviewed and recommended. But oh well, you just move on. They are free to see whoever they want to see. I'd rather read 'No black men' rather than to schedule an appointment with someone, reach their incall, just to get rejected because she prefers not seeing someone of my skin colour and didn't bother putting it on her ad. So the little heads up on the ad can some time be much appreciated, despite how discouraging it might be.
But, another poster said that "No Black Men" really meant "No Non-white Men", on another thread somewhere dealing with the same topic. Under this vein there would be no real stereotypes at all. It was not brought up on this thread specifically. It may feel really sick to wonder if you look "white" enough, nor not as "black" in order to pass.

As of late, I've refrained from masturbating on escort pics, using my fleshlight, on pics where it says "No Black Men" as I figure, those pics aren't worth masturbating on. Now I have no contact with the escort, and while I"m not black, I'm mixed and have been confused with many different places, so I'm not sure if I'd be rejected by them on the door. I really don't have the time, interest, or even bother to find out. It's more of a matter of mental-integrity that that "No Black Men", to avoid masturbating at them. But then again, anyone can masturbate on any pic regardless of the preference of the provider, as a guy, all we care about is if the pic looks hot, not what the preference is.

However, it detracts from the realism of the experience. I mean, how can you masturbate on someone who could reject you at the door? This is a bit of a dilemma for me. I never want to make contact to find out so I'll never really know.

Perhaps adding this restriction on what pics I should or should not masturbate on is not a good idea.

Well, after c-36 is passed then those who have a difficult time at this hobby will have one more reason not to worry about it if it's more trouble than it's worth. There may be less pics, or less good quality pics to masturbate on, but hey, that is still legal from what I know.
 

Titalian

No Regrets
Nov 27, 2012
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You know what - I've never seen prostitute/SP or whatever
Judging by this statement alone, you shouldn't even be commenting on this thread, Mr. Holier than thou !!!!
Most of these women are young and very vulnerable or didn't you realise that, it has nothing to do with Racism, but the
simple fact that they trying to avoid complications. You Idiot!!!!

Btw don't forget Church tomorrow!!!!
 

VirginJohn

Active member
Dec 1, 2005
522
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Judging by this statement alone, you shouldn't even be commenting on this thread, Mr. Holier than thou !!!!
Most of these women are young and very vulnerable or didn't you realise that, it has nothing to do with Racism, but the
simple fact that they trying to avoid complications. You Idiot!!!!

Btw don't forget Church tomorrow!!!!
This is just ignorant. What he said is true, that most of the real sexual crimes out there, where there is murder, cover-up, or intelligent stuff thought up is with white people. Most black people get in trouble with the law because of something pinned on them rather than something serious while white folks do. When you look at someone, or a group of people from a critical eye then it's different than giving someone the benefit of the doubt. You see, because of "white privilege", most white people have blinders to this because they do not have those type of interactions with the law. This guy really raised some valid points. What complications are really being avoided?
 

cdnsimon

New member
Oct 11, 2013
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Judging by this statement alone, you shouldn't even be commenting on this thread, Mr. Holier than thou !!!!
Most of these women are young and very vulnerable or didn't you realise that, it has nothing to do with Racism, but the
simple fact that they trying to avoid complications. You Idiot!!!!

Btw don't forget Church tomorrow!!!!
I hope most people on here are smarter than to believe you. If there is a problem with my status on this forum and my activities I'm sure the website owner or mods are more than capable of taking that up with me directly.

It's interesting that you have no credible points to raise so you attempt to distract with 'smoke and mirrors'. Yes, someone (regardless of sexual activities) has absolutely no input on racism in modern culture. Wow, your astounding logic bested me once again!

I bet you're going to describe how the 2008 U.S. economic collapse, Enron corruption, the CRTC cancellation of over-air tv signals, and Ebola are the result of "complications" with people of colour. I'm ready with pen and paper pad... Please enlighten me.

I may be holier than thou, but you are stupider than most.

Complications with a person of colour? I suppose that man's skin colour predisposes him to violence or whatever 'complications' you refer? Oh - I forgot... it was already established that the only pimps/sexual assaulters are people of colour! Wow, you really are clever to draw that linkage! Stupid 'ole me could never have figured that out!
 

Titalian

No Regrets
Nov 27, 2012
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Everywhere
I hope most people on here are smarter than to believe you. If there is a problem with my status on this forum and my activities I'm sure the website owner or mods are more than capable of taking that up with me directly.

It's interesting that you have no credible points to raise so you attempt to distract with 'smoke and mirrors'. Yes, someone (regardless of sexual activities) has absolutely no input on racism in modern culture. Wow, your astounding logic bested me once again!

I bet you're going to describe how the 2008 U.S. economic collapse, Enron corruption, the CRTC cancellation of over-air tv signals, and Ebola are the result of "complications" with people of colour. I'm ready with pen and paper pad... Please enlighten me.

I may be holier than thou, but you are stupider than most.

Complications with a person of colour? I suppose that man's skin colour predisposes him to violence or whatever 'complications' you refer? Oh - I forgot... it was already established that the only pimps/sexual assaulters are people of colour! Wow, you really are clever to draw that linkage! Stupid 'ole me could never have figured that out!
Given the fact that you have never seen an escort or for that matter spoken to one, you would be amazed of what they have to say on this issue,
I truly believe that many of the advertised posts declaring no black people are generated from pimps overseeing the escort in question and let me tell you
these pimps are not necessarily black. What I took issue with, was you calling escorts who do declare this as Racist. Before you go judging escorts as racist, I suggest
that you talk to some of them to get a clearer picture of the environment. A number of months ago, there was an older well established black member on this
board who called out to the younger blacks to stop harassing the ladies as it was affecting his hobbying. Obviously he had some insite on this issue.
 

Kifarurx

Member
Aug 3, 2008
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Let's put it this way gents. What if all the SPs advertised using only general descriptions such as pretty, great service etc and never mentioned skin, hair, eye colour, measurements, age or ethnic background and she has no obligation to tell you? Would the the guys complaining still see an SP solely based on this info? If you would than kudos to you. The reality is that we all have preferences when it involves the act of intimacy. Same in civilian mating. This is not the regular type of business transaction like buying a coffee or grocery shopping. It's her choice to see you or not just as it's your choice to see a lady based on all the info she has provided. Move on, get over it and happy hobbying.
 

Ridgeman08

50 Shades of AJ
Nov 28, 2008
4,495
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While you make valid points with regards to racism... all of which I agree with, when it comes to the intimate act of sex between 2 (or more) consenting adults, this statement DOES NOT apply:

Why the flying fuck would someone's race/ethnicity matter?
Why? Because she doesn't give her consent!

No matter what her motivations are, racism does not apply. As said many times, it isn't about race- its about preferences. All you guys going on about rights etc need to give your head a shake. What about HER rights to have sexual relations with whom SHE chooses! Her rights since she is the provider, supersede the client's in this matter.

There was a thread about 6 months ago about a provider that didn't see "older" gentleman. Although I was attracted to her pics, I wasn't "quite" past her "best before" date, so decided not to push the issue and chose to see someone else. Why, because she preferred younger clients. Why would I wanna see someone that wasn't 100% comfortable with seeing me.

Like it or not, it is really VERY SIMPLE people: her body- her rules!
 

Hard Idle

Active member
Jan 15, 2005
4,959
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North York
Right to control one's own body and consent or decline sex would easily trump any other consideration in any hypothetical conflict of essential rights. Without consent it's just plain rape.

It's a total waste of time to argue this or that reason. It doesn't amtter what the reason is, it's a personal comfort level issue, it doesn;t have to make sense to anyone but the person in question. You can not want to have sex with someone because of their phone voice, or because of the way their grandmother parks her car or whatever. It's just easier to tell the truth instead of making up some bullshit reason.
 

lomotil

Well-known member
Mar 14, 2004
6,496
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Oblivion
It must be difficult being a prostitute in a multicultural society such as the GTA, especially if the prostitute has aversion and derision for some groups. By definition prostitutes often service johns that they find repulsive or undesirable for many reasons. This might explain the higher prevalence of substance abuse and mental health issues among sex workers than in the general population. Maybe if bill C36 cuts down on customer traffic some prostitutes might become less racist to offset the loss in revenue, perhaps even advertising that they follow the Ontario Human Rights Code in accepting johns to get that competitive edge.
 

Frosty

Active member
Sep 1, 2001
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So Cdnsimon, what are you doing on this board if you've never or don't want to see a SP? You just want to hang out here and chit chat with the boys.
 

cdnsimon

New member
Oct 11, 2013
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Given the fact that you have never seen an escort or for that matter spoken to one, you would be amazed of what they have to say on this issue,
Now you're putting words in my mouth? Can you point out where I said I've never spoken to one? I've never claimed to have seen (had sex) with a working girl, and I've never hidden that fact. However, it's just not true to say that I haven't spoken to any or socially interacted with them in other ways.

What I took issue with, was you calling escorts who do declare this as Racist. Before you go judging escorts as racist, I suggest
that you talk to some of them to get a clearer picture of the environment. A number of months ago, there was an older well established black member on this
board who called out to the younger blacks to stop harassing the ladies as it was affecting his hobbying. Obviously he had some insite on this issue.
Do you think that being black was a factor in those young fellows harassing the women? Do you think harassment is a cultural problem or a issue tied to a person's ethnicity/skin colour?

You need to go back to my original post and re-read the first paragraph - you know the part where I speak about what racism is? While you're at that go back and read my answer to your hyperbolic question. It's a waste of time speaking to you. I'd get further talking to a wall.

Ridgeman08, you make it sound like I'm advocating that a person should be intimate with anyone and everyone. That isn't the case. I am pointing to the double standard in society that race only matters to some people when it only in their benefit. As I gave said in examples of tissue and blood donations, do you think RBC's are divided up against the ethnicity of the donor or blood type? The idiocy in choosing sexual partners based on race was what I was speaking to, as evidenced in in previous posts, and the fact that nobody cares about race when they have the most to lose (accident, disease, injury, etc.). A woman's choice absolutely does matter and is first. However, when that choice is soley based on race related reasons - fuck yes - that is racist. I speak to that in my first post, in the first paragraph. Please don't suggest that I'm implying that a woman's choice doesn't matter. I haven't said that: choice and racism are not necessarily mutually exclusive. There appear to be many people here that think if you have one you can't have the other. I guess women can't be racist, huh? Or racist women are in every other walk of life except prostitution?

Saying that 'racism doesn't apply' to sexual activities is false. Sex is a social construct of our society and, of course, race matters. I think you've confused the distinction I made. Yesterday at 6:11 I draw a distinction between simple sex and sex where race is a factor.

@Frosty, what I am here for is of my own concern. You needn't worry yourself over my details.
 

cdnsimon

New member
Oct 11, 2013
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Great article for this discussion. Interesting how it's argued here (on this forum) that racism is in every part of society except for sex services.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/icing-racism-in-hockey-players-speak-out-1.2831319
Icing racism in hockey: Players speak out
'I need to speak out, and for them to understand how hurtful it is,' NHLer Jordin Tootoo says
By Karen Pauls, CBC News Posted: Nov 13, 2014 4:00 AM CT Last Updated: Nov 13, 2014 7:41 PM CT

For years, Tyler Woodhouse has heard the remarks, and every time he does, it hurts.

"We get a lot of comments like, 'You don't belong here, dirty Indians.' A lot of things like that. It leads to more and more," he said.

Woodhouse, 19, plays centre for the Peguis Junior B hockey team, an aboriginal team based on the Peguis First Nation in Manitoba, but he's also played on a lot of non-aboriginal teams through the years.

No matter what the team, when the stakes and emotions are high, he hears racial slurs.

"It gets to them. It takes them off their game, which is what they want," he said. "I guess they consider that a strategy, and it's not only from the players. Also we get it from a lot of spectators, parents, from the other teams."

His face tightens and he chokes up as he talks about a hard-fought semifinal game in Brandon, Man.

"They won the game. At the time, the arena we were in, we had to walk out the same hallway, and there was a staircase above," he recalled.

"As we were walking out there, there were a lot of parents, spectators. We got some comments like, 'Go back to where you belong, you dirty Indians' and 'You don't belong here, go back to India,' and a lot of things like that."

'I experienced it last year'

It doesn't just happen at community rinks.

Jordin Tootoo, who is the first Inuk to play in the NHL, started playing hockey in Rankin Inlet, Nunavut, and encountered racism early in his career.

"The first time I ever faced racism was when we went down south to play in a couple of native tournaments. The fans and the people away from the rink were calling us names," he recalled.

"I left home when I was 14 for good and I think that's when I really experienced racism. It wasn't easy being the only Inuk kid in the area and having a lot of other individuals being jealous of my success."

Tootoo played Bantam AA hockey in Alberta and Manitoba. He currently plays for the New Jersey Devils.

"I experienced it last year," he said about the season he was sent back to the American Hockey League.

"For me, having to play in the NHL for eight years and then having to go to the AHL, obviously every kid is going to want to challenge me, and they're going to do whatever it takes to fight Jordin Tootoo or get him off his game. And that's what it was."

Tootoo won't repeat what was said to him at the time, but he's finally speaking out on the issue. He's also included it in his recently published autobiography, All the Way: My Life on Ice, which was written with sports journalist Stephen Brunt.

"I'm not going to hold things in anymore. I can't. I need to speak out, and for them to understand how hurtful it is, especially at the professional level," he said.

"After the third incident, the guy came to apologize to me and I told him right in his face, 'I don't need to hear this. I don't need no apology. Just go on your merry way. Just beat it.' And he turned around, buried his head and walked away. He felt shame. Which for me was,… 'now you know how it feels.' "

NHL players like Evander Kane of the Winnipeg Jets, Wayne Simmonds of the Philadelphia Flyers, Joel Ward of the Washington Capitals and P.K. Subban of the Montreal Canadiens have all been the target of both overt and subtle racism.

Tootoo has spoken to the NHL about taking a zero-tolerance position on racist comments. He wants players to feel more comfortable about reporting them, and when they do, Tootoo says everyone has to take it seriously.

"It's got to be dealt with extremely high because if it slips once, it's going to happen again. You do it once, maybe you get a suspension," he said.

Tootoo hopes that approach filters down to the younger levels.

"It doesn't matter what skin colour you are. The game of hockey is a game that everyone should enjoy."

'Hockey is society'

Winnipeg author Don Marks has written two books about aboriginal athletes and the challenges they face.

​In They Call Me Chief, he tells stories about native players like Fred Sasakamoose, the first Canadian aboriginal player in the NHL. He overcame the abuse of Canada's residential school system.

A hockey player himself, Marks said he has seen and experienced discrimination on the ice.

"Why are they [the other players] holding their sticks a little higher? Why is the referee calling the game a little tighter? All things equal, you got a white team and a native team [and they're] calling it against a native team. So is it racism or stereotyping? I don't know, but it causes problems."

Marks doesn't think things will change on the ice if they're not changing in society.

"In Canada… hockey is society," he said.

Respect in sport

For its part, Hockey Canada says it is working hard to make hockey rinks more inclusive.

It's encouraging provinces to make it mandatory for parents to take its online Respect in Sport course before their children can enrol. Coaches already have to take it.

And although they're not common, referees can give a two-minute unsportsmanlike penalty or even suspensions for gross misconduct if they hear a racial slur or derogatory comment, said Paul Carson, Hockey Canada's vice-president.

"As the game becomes more and more diverse in terms of ethnic backgrounds coming to the sport of hockey, [it's] no different than coming into the school system that there needs to be an understanding of a broader range of acceptance. There's no question that's an important teaching point in society and in terms of sport," he said.

"It starts with parents and the role the parent plays in encouraging their child to play a fair and positive game. Then it goes to the coach, and the coach is responsible for that team environment."

Back on the Peguis First Nation, Tyler Woodhouse agrees.

"Nobody is born racist," he said. "It starts at home and it could be prevented from happening."
 

VirginJohn

Active member
Dec 1, 2005
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No

Saying that 'racism doesn't apply' to sexual activities is false. Sex is a social construct of our society and, of course, race matters. I think you've confused the distinction I made. Yesterday at 6:11 I draw a distinction between simple sex and sex where race is a factor.

@Frosty, what I am here for is of my own concern. You needn't worry yourself over my details.
I think it's an issue here of "white priviledge" rather than racism and whites posters on this board aren't getting it that based on their skin colour, they have the advantage of seeing escorts that other races do not have access to, like any other resources in this society that are limited based on wealth and social status. Most of the johns on here are white and they are not going to get what nonsense that blacks or visible minorities have to go through. Seeing "No Blacks" on an escort ad is BS pure and simple and another hurdle that visible minorities have to go through.
 

bigshot

Active member
Aug 16, 2003
1,362
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Yes, this is an industry where political correctness does not always apply. I choose to see escorts who have a certain body type and ethnic background(s), while I stay away from others who may not appear attractive to me. Why would I criticise an escort who makes her choices based on the same criteria. This to me is not the same thing as someone in a service industry denying service to a customer at a restaurant or retail store, and I don't believe that escorts who choose not to see anyone who they do not want to see is a racist.

I had been thinking of seeing an SP this past summer who was getting great reviews, until I saw that she would not see men over a certain age, which meant that I was left out. I did not sulk or insult her, but rather I accepted that this was something for her alone to decide...
 

yoni

Member
Sep 18, 2012
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0
6
Hmm.. I can understand if a white escort won't see black men for whatever reason and I could care less but black girls are stating the same restriction as well, in my opinion it is fucked up and don't look good on these girls ( I would right away assume that they have some kind of slave mentality or inferiority complex, may be ?)
 

Kifarurx

Member
Aug 3, 2008
421
0
16
SPs have age preferences, maybe even body preferences. Is that wrong also? If she doesn't want to see you move on and find someone else. What are you going to do? Force her to have sex with you? Quit crying about it and find another lady.
 

Titalian

No Regrets
Nov 27, 2012
8,500
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Everywhere
Yes, this is an industry where political correctness does not always apply. I choose to see escorts who have a certain body type and ethnic background(s), while I stay away from others who may not appear attractive to me. Why would I criticise an escort who makes her choices based on the same criteria. This to me is not the same thing as someone in a service industry denying service to a customer at a restaurant or retail store, and I don't believe that escorts who choose not to see anyone who they do not want to see is a racist.

I had been thinking of seeing an SP this past summer who was getting great reviews, until I saw that she would not see men over a certain age, which meant that I was left out. I did not sulk or insult her, but rather I accepted that this was something for her alone to decide...
Good reply, And this is what I mentioned to a certain poster, when we started this debate. This has nothing to do with racism. but simply a personal preference.
Is screening a potential client and refusing him a form of racism. I doubt it. The true and well reviewed escorts have the knowhow and ability to select their preferred clients.
I for one am seeing a well reviewed escort regularly, who simply selected me, based on my commentaries and posts on this board. But she is truly seasoned and knowledgable.
Unfortunately some of the escorts that advertise don't have this knowledge of being well informed, especially the women on Bp !!! So they generalise and pick those who they
would prefer seeing. On a side note, a number of months ago, I contacted Lisbeth the originator of this thread. Lisbeth is definitely, a provider that screens her new potential
clients. I had an issue with her screening process. And I believe she took issue with that, which is her right. We ended up never meeting. Is this a form of racism? NO!
It was a preference. And I respected her decision. I truly believe, that if we are going to involve ourselves in this natural but sacred act, both parties have to be on the same level. Meaning comfortable.
Both the men that indulge and the women. End of story.
 

Babypowder

Active member
Oct 28, 2007
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people here dont really know what personal preference really means. yet people keep using the term.
 

VirginJohn

Active member
Dec 1, 2005
522
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SPs have age preferences, maybe even body preferences. Is that wrong also? If she doesn't want to see you move on and find someone else. What are you going to do? Force her to have sex with you? Quit crying about it and find another lady.
If she has that many preferences, then you may as well be looking for a casual hook-up where there is an unpaid exchange based on if the lady wants to have sex with you because she likes you. I'm sure there are guys with great looks that is easy to get laid for free or women pay them.

If you start feeling the same types of "rejection" as you would if you were meeting women from a sex hook-up site, or even out there in the public with "civies" then why add insult to injury with the idea that you are so bad that you can't even get it if you paid someone. But, hey, if someone put that up on a hook-up site maybe they'll get offers for pity-fucks.

Maybe bill c-36 may correct the power imbalance in a different way since the excessive demands seems to have really messed everything up right now.
 
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