Is nuclear fusion finally about to happen?
- Thread starter nottyboi
- Start date
If JFK had the insight to create an alternative energy source by the end of the decade "not because it is easy but because it is hard" instead of uselessly flying to the moon where would we be now?
JFK was not a great, nor even good, leader but he did understand the power of oratory so he had Theodore Sorensen help him write his speeches
He was a bright guy so I am perplexed how he was talked into going to the stupid moon
and how he never figured out how to get out of Vietnam and how he almost started a nuclear war and how this made him a hero and how he would spend his time in affairs when the world needed wisdom
JFK was not a great, nor even good, leader but he did understand the power of oratory so he had Theodore Sorensen help him write his speeches
He was a bright guy so I am perplexed how he was talked into going to the stupid moon
and how he never figured out how to get out of Vietnam and how he almost started a nuclear war and how this made him a hero and how he would spend his time in affairs when the world needed wisdom
If JFK had the insight to create an alternative energy source by the end of the decade "not because it is easy but because it is hard" instead of uselessly flying to the moon where would we be now?
JFK was not a great, nor even good, leader but he did understand the power of oratory so he had Theodore Sorensen help him write his speeches
He was a bright guy so I am perplexed how he was talked into going to the stupid moon
and how he never figured out how to get out of Vietnam and how he almost started a nuclear war and how this made him a hero and how he would spend his time in affairs when the world needed wisdom
Are you tempting me Yoga?
He did many great things, and was a very inspirational leader and President.
The moon race was an integral part of the Cold War. Fusion energy was not a priority.
In any event, there were many indirect scientific benefits from the moon race. Don't be narrow minded.
He had a plan to get out of Viet Nam but had to hedge his position by appearing as a Cold Warrior.
You should study National Security Action Memorandum 263 (reversed by LBJ with 273) which called for the beginning of the withdrawal of advisors and planned total withdrawal by 1965.
http://www.jfklancer.com/NSAM263.html
Educate yourself before pontificating.
the race to the moon was a waste of scientific currency
yes they had to develop the computer to fly there but according to Carl Sagan (and other great minds) you do not have to fly to the moon to build a computer !
Sagan thought it was a dumb idea and so do I
alternative energy was not a priority because Kennedy was not leader enough to make it so , that it would be needed in the near future was obvious
The fact remains he wanted to get out of Viet Nam but did not and had almost 4 years to do it. Johnson was his chosen man to takeover so blame Kennedy for choosing Johnson as his vice (because of political expediency i suppose as kennedy needed the south)
delaying exit so you can look like a strong leader while thousands die is bullshit
perhaps if he was not so busy with his affairs he could of spent that time gathering experts to solidify an immediate exit strategy
i do not care if he cheated on his wife but doing so while soldiers needlessly die is equivalent to Nero fiddling while Rome burns
Kennedy "What is your opinion on Viet Nam "
Diefenbaker "I think you should get out"
Kennedy "Any damn fool can see that the question is how?"
if he had started a nuclear war he would be a villain, that his brother prevented it at the last minute by making a deal with Khrushchev does not make JFK a hero but a near villain
he was inspirational speaker because Theodore Sorensen was a great speech writer
Wiser people do not listen to the abstract generalities and lofty phrases of a great speech but recognize it for what it is - sound and fury signifying nothing
do u think this photo is shopped? or is it Kennedy at hard work trying to figure out how to exit the war?
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..... <<snipped>>
i do not care if he cheated on his wife but doing so while soldiers needlessly die is equivalent to Nero fiddling while Rome burns
Kennedy "What is your opinion on Viet Nam "
Diefenbaker "I think you should get out"
Kennedy "Any damn fool can see that the question is how?"
if he had started a nuclear war he would be a villain, that his brother prevented it at the last minute by making a deal with Khrushchev does not make JFK a hero but a near villain
he was inspirational speaker because Theodore Sorensen was a great speech writer
Wiser people do not listen to the abstract generalities and lofty phrases of a great speech but recognize it for what it is - sound and fury signifying nothing
More bashing/trolling from a Kennedy (or GPIDEAL) hater by solely blaming him for the moon race and the failure to discover fusion energy lol (which is idiotic, not just ludicrous). The only good thing in your post is the photo because it shows some tits and ass, if it's verified to be a real one (I will post another one with him and Marilyn in a cozy hug). You don't think that the other Presidents had their mistresses, lol?
You're foolish to blame JFK for not finding alternative energy sources. That was not a priority. Fossil fuels were cheap back then, and there was an abundance of it.
The race to the moon is what interested the people. (You don't have to be a politician to understand that).
Your quote of Diefenbaker obviously proves that the Viet Nam question was a difficult one. JFK couldn't pull out of Viet Nam because that would've been extremely unpopular; he had to get re-elected to do so. Also, the policy of containment in Indo-China was still being tested, but JFK saw that it was not fool proof.
This is why he PLANNED for the withdrawal in his NSAM 263. I quote: http://fas.org/irp/offdocs/nsam-jfk/nsam-263.htm
The President approved the military recommendations contained in Section I B (1 -3) of the report, but directed that no formal announcement be made of the implementation of plans to withdraw 1,000 U.S. military personnel by the end of 1963.
The McNamara-Taylor report also recommended the following, which was approved by the WH: http://www.ratical.org/ratville/JFK/FRUSno167.html
2. A program be established to train Vietnamese so that essential functions now performed by U.S. military personnel can be carried out by Vietnamese by the end of 1965. It should be possible to withdraw the bulk of U.S. personnel by that time.
This recommendation was echoed by the White House Policy Statement of October 2, 1963. https://www.mtholyoke.edu/acad/intrel/state63.htm
Secretary McNamara and General Taylor reported their judgment that the major part of the U.S. military task can be completed by the end of 1965, although there may be a continuing requirement for a limited number of U.S. training personnel. They reported that by the end of this year, the U.S. program for training Vietnamese should have progressed to the point where 1,000 U.S. military personnel assigned to South Viet-Nam can be withdrawn.
His assassination prevented the implementation of all of this, but you can thank your ignorant ass for the following:
1. He didn't invade Cuba regardless of pleadings by the CIA and Joint Chiefs. THAT would've risked nuclear war since the Russians would've seen it as an attack on an ally. In fact, it has been revealed that the CIA LIED to JFK about the success of the Bay of Pigs raid (they tried to trick him into engaging U.S. air power but that surely would've incited a response from the Soviets, mostly likely against West Germany as tit for tat).
http://www.globalresearch.ca/cia-fo...fficial-history-of-bay-of-pigs-invasion/25864
This volume also contains the extraordinary revelation that CIA task force in charge of the invasion did not believe it could succeed. On page 149, Pfeiffer quotes minutes of the Task Force meeting held on November 15, 1960, to prepare a briefing for the new President-elect, John F. Kennedy: “Our original concept is now seen to be unachievable in the face of the controls Castro has instituted,” the document states. “Our second concept (1,500-3000 man force to secure a beach with airstrip) is also now seen to be unachievable, except as a joint Agency/DOD action.”. . . This candid assessment was not shared with the President-elect then, nor later after the inauguration. As Pfeiffer points out, “what was being denied in confidence in mid-November 1960 became the fact of the Zapata Plan and the Bay of Pigs Operation in March 1961”—run only by the CIA, and with a force of 1,200 men.
2. He signed the Nuclear Test Ban Treaty with the Soviets to stop the detonation of thermonuclear bombs in the atmosphere.
3. He put in motion the Civil Rights Bill which was ratified after his untimely death, during the Johnson Administration.
4. He found a way to prevent the Soviets from deploying dangerously close tactical nuclear missiles inside Cuba without an all out invasion that would've prompted the Soviets to invade West Germany (including a secret deal to remove missiles from Turkey).
5. He hired the brightest and the best like Robert McNamara and Ted Sorensen
(Although he delegated speech writing, as a President should, he edited many of them, including conceptualizing his Inaugural Address - read the book Ask Not by Thurston Clarke but I'll educate you with a review quote). http://bookpage.com/reviews/3740-thurston-clarke-ask-not#.VEgZW_nF98E
Many who remember those elegant, but powerful phrases assume they were written by Kennedy's brilliant speechwriter Ted Sorensen an assumption that would have enraged Kennedy. Clarke examines the speech drafts and other evidence to argue that it was a true collaboration between the two men, with the most memorable lines written by Kennedy himself.
Lastly, the # of incidents and casualties were minuscule if not tolerable during the Kennedy Administration. It was only after his assassination that the body count escalated.
http://www.archives.gov/research/military/vietnam-war/casualty-statistics.html#category
Geez Yoga Face, for a guy who puts down JFK, you still like to blame him for things that only God could make happen at the time. Unless you have a scholarly response, please don't waste my time or get off topic on this. At least you've struck a nerve. Now back off, lol!
More bashing/trolling from a Kennedy (or GPIDEAL) hater by solely blaming him for the moon race and the failure to discover fusion energy lol (which is idiotic, not just ludicrous). The only good thing in your post is the photo because it shows some tits and ass, if it's verified to be a real one (I will post another one with him and Marilyn in a cozy hug). You don't think that the other Presidents had their mistresses, lol?
You're foolish to blame JFK for not finding alternative energy sources. That was not a priority. Fossil fuels were cheap back then, and there was an abundance of it.
The race to the moon is what interested the people. (You don't have to be a politician to understand that).
Your quote of Diefenbaker obviously proves that the Viet Nam question was a difficult one. JFK couldn't pull out of Viet Nam because that would've been extremely unpopular; he had to get re-elected to do so. Also, the policy of containment in Indo-China was still being tested, but JFK saw that it was not fool proof.
This is why he PLANNED for the withdrawal in his NSAM 263. I quote: http://fas.org/irp/offdocs/nsam-jfk/nsam-263.htm
The President approved the military recommendations contained in Section I B (1 -3) of the report, but directed that no formal announcement be made of the implementation of plans to withdraw 1,000 U.S. military personnel by the end of 1963.
The McNamara-Taylor report also recommended the following, which was approved by the WH: http://www.ratical.org/ratville/JFK/FRUSno167.html
2. A program be established to train Vietnamese so that essential functions now performed by U.S. military personnel can be carried out by Vietnamese by the end of 1965. It should be possible to withdraw the bulk of U.S. personnel by that time.
This recommendation was echoed by the White House Policy Statement of October 2, 1963. https://www.mtholyoke.edu/acad/intrel/state63.htm
Secretary McNamara and General Taylor reported their judgment that the major part of the U.S. military task can be completed by the end of 1965, although there may be a continuing requirement for a limited number of U.S. training personnel. They reported that by the end of this year, the U.S. program for training Vietnamese should have progressed to the point where 1,000 U.S. military personnel assigned to South Viet-Nam can be withdrawn.
His assassination prevented the implementation of all of this, but you can thank your ignorant ass for the following:
1. He didn't invade Cuba regardless of pleadings by the CIA and Joint Chiefs. THAT would've risked nuclear war since the Russians would've seen it as an attack on an ally. In fact, it has been revealed that the CIA LIED to JFK about the success of the Bay of Pigs raid (they tried to trick him into engaging U.S. air power but that surely would've incited a response from the Soviets, mostly likely against West Germany as tit for tat).
http://www.globalresearch.ca/cia-fo...fficial-history-of-bay-of-pigs-invasion/25864
This volume also contains the extraordinary revelation that CIA task force in charge of the invasion did not believe it could succeed. On page 149, Pfeiffer quotes minutes of the Task Force meeting held on November 15, 1960, to prepare a briefing for the new President-elect, John F. Kennedy: “Our original concept is now seen to be unachievable in the face of the controls Castro has instituted,” the document states. “Our second concept (1,500-3000 man force to secure a beach with airstrip) is also now seen to be unachievable, except as a joint Agency/DOD action.”. . . This candid assessment was not shared with the President-elect then, nor later after the inauguration. As Pfeiffer points out, “what was being denied in confidence in mid-November 1960 became the fact of the Zapata Plan and the Bay of Pigs Operation in March 1961”—run only by the CIA, and with a force of 1,200 men.
2. He signed the Nuclear Test Ban Treaty with the Soviets to stop the detonation of thermonuclear bombs in the atmosphere.
3. He put in motion the Civil Rights Bill which was ratified after his untimely death, during the Johnson Administration.
4. He found a way to prevent the Soviets from deploying dangerously close tactical nuclear missiles inside Cuba without an all out invasion that would've prompted the Soviets to invade West Germany (including a secret deal to remove missiles from Turkey).
5. He hired the brightest and the best like Robert McNamara and Ted Sorensen
http://bookpage.com/reviews/3740-thurston-clarke-ask-not#.VEgZW_nF98E
Many who remember those elegant, but powerful phrases assume they were written by Kennedy's brilliant speechwriter Ted Sorensen an assumption that would have enraged Kennedy. Clarke examines the speech drafts and other evidence to argue that it was a true collaboration between the two men, with the most memorable lines written by Kennedy himself.
Lastly, the # of incidents and casualties were minuscule if not tolerable during the Kennedy Administration. It was only after his assassination that the body count escalated.
http://www.archives.gov/research/military/vietnam-war/casualty-statistics.html#category
Geez Yoga Face, for a guy who puts down JFK, you still like to blame him for things that only God could make happen at the time. Unless you have a scholarly response, please don't waste my time or get off topic on this. At least you've struck a nerve. Now back off, lol!
OK
1 I agree that JFK collaborated with Ted Sorensen in speech writing. JFK was not a dumb man
2 It was extremely obvious fossil fuels were a pollutant, had already caused Japan to enter WW2 and would cause more wars especially as they ran out.
Foreseeing the obvious and planning for it is what great world leaders do. JFK decided to put the greatest minds on earth to work at flying to the moon, something the public never gave a fuck about until gave his speech. It was a dumb move that was strongly questioned by some of the great minds of the day who understood the future. Minds that Kennedy did not listen to.
3 I can see your point on Viet Nam and Cuba (JFK was smart enough not to trust the CIA)
4 The blockade came within inches ( "I could taste the gun powder" - Khrushchev) of nuclear war which would have made JFK a hated President
I am influenced by all your points except flying to the moon. It was an amazing misdirection of scientific currency. This misdirection of science is also shared by all world leaders. It may turn out to be humanities greatest and needless blunder.
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Alas I have to disagree with the great Sagan but without a motivating interest, the American people would not have been willing to pay for the massive investment the sciences received. Carl may have imagined that the space race money would have magically appeared in other bank accounts but looking at American spending on science for the last couple decades that's not likely.
The race to the moon was not a waste. Remember that the USSR was ahead (first satellite, first man in space, etc) and the concern was that superiority would mean military dominance, and the hegemony of the communist system. They stomped on that with the moon race.
Don't underestimate the concern the public had when they realized that if the russians could orbit sputnik over America, they could drop a nuke wherever they wanted with little notice.
Don't underestimate the concern the public had when they realized that if the russians could orbit sputnik over America, they could drop a nuke wherever they wanted with little notice.
Ah okay (and sorry if my language was harsh), but can you fault a politician that is listening to the heart of the nation?
Don't forget, he was a politician too.
Also, I doubt the opportunity cost was the discovery of nuclear fusion.
There were many multiplier effects from the space race, and many, many nerds were employed - probably much more than any other national endeavor.
In any event, it still was one of the greatest achievements of human history.
Absolutely!
God forbid, it might have gone into a greater arms race, or perhaps the placement of warheads into orbit.
Bravo. I forgot about that. Space has always been inexorably tied to military superiority or technology.
Not when compared to the 60's and 70's (and then you had governments of all stripes promoting science as opposed to some today trying to deny it).
yes
great leaders lead
JFK told the USA to care about flying to the moon which is something more circumspect minds disagreed with
BTW Walter Cronkite never interviewed any of these great minds. He went along with the political correct movement of the day which was to praise the useless moon landing.
the moon landing is considered his greatest broadcast
it is perhaps greater
who knows what amazing technology we would now have
technology that is forecast for the next generation (if we get there)
agreed
but
these multiplier effects did not require flying to the moon
flying to the moon is a great achievement that demonstrates what could have been accomplished if a greater leader had lead science in a greater direction
