Russia now threatens Estonia

[mandrill]

Russia signaled concern on Wednesday at Estonia's treatment of its large ethnic Russian minority, comparing language policy in the Baltic state with what it said was a call in Ukraine to prevent the use of Russian.

Russia has defended its annexation of Ukraine's Crimea peninsula by arguing it has the right to protect Russian-speakers outside its borders, so the reference to linguistic tensions in another former Soviet republic comes at a highly sensitive moment.

Russia fully supported the protection of the rights of linguistic minorities, a Moscow diplomat told the United Nations Human Rights Council in Geneva, according to a summary of the session issued by the U.N.'s information department.

"Language should not be used to segregate and isolate groups," the diplomat was reported as saying. Russia was "concerned by steps taken in this regard in Estonia as well as in Ukraine," the Moscow envoy was said to have added.

The text of the Russian remarks, echoing long-standing complaints over Estonia's insistence that the large Russian minority in the east of the country should be able to speak Estonian, was not immediately available.

But amid the growing Crimea crisis, Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania - which like Ukraine were all parts of the old Soviet Union - have expressed growing apprehension over Moscow's intentions.

U.S. Vice President Joe Biden is currently in the Lithuanian capital Vilnius as part of a trip to reassure the three countries, all European Union and NATO members, of Washington's support.

Ukraine told the rights council that U.N. experts had found no credible evidence of mistreatment of its Russian minority as alleged by Moscow -- one of whose pro-Kremlin newspapers said this week there was "bloodshed almost like in Syria" in the east of the country.

The new government in Kiev, a Ukrainian envoy declared, was reinvigorating its promotion and protection of the rights of minorities "to the highest international standards".

The envoy asked what measures could be taken to protect Ukrainian, Crimean Tatar and other minority groups in Crimea "whose rights are being violated under the Russian occupation."

Responding, the Russian delegate said there were no violations of minority rights in Crimea and minorities were not being persecuted. The new Russian-backed government there had guaranteed protection of the Tatars.

(Reporting by Robert Evans; Editing by Mark Trevelyan)

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/03/19/us-russia-estonia-idUSBREA2I1J620140319

 

[canada-man]

Current situation[edit]

Today most Russians live in Tallinn and the major northeastern cities of Narva, Kohtla-Järve, Jõhvi, and Sillamäe. The rural areas are populated almost entirely by ethnic Estonians, except for Lake Peipus coast, which has a long history of Old Believers' communities.
Citizenship[edit]
The restored republic recognised the pre-occupation citizens or descended from such (including the long-term Russian settlers from earlier influxes, such as Lake Peipus coast and the 10,000 residents of the Petseri County)[22] The Citizenship Act provides relatively liberal requirements for naturalisation of those people who had arrived in the country after 1940,[23] the majority of whom were ethnic Russians. Knowledge of Estonian language, Constitution and a pledge of loyalty to Estonia were set as the conditions.[24] The government offers free preparation courses for the examination on the Constitution and the Citizenship Act, and reimburses up to 380 euros for language studies.[25]
Under the law, residents without citizenship may not elect the Riigikogu (the national parliament) nor the European Parliament, but are eligible to vote in the municipal elections.[26]
Between 1992 and 2007 about 147,000 people acquired the citizenship, bringing the proportion of stateless residents from 32% down to about 8 percent.[26]
Language requirements[edit]
The perceived difficulty of the language tests became a point of international contention, as the government of Russian Federation and a number of human rights organizations objected on the grounds that they made it hard for many Russians who had not learned the language to gain the citizenship in a short term. As a result, the tests were somewhat altered, due to which the number of stateless persons steadily decreased. According to Estonian officials, in 1992, 32% of residents lacked any form of citizenship. In May 2009, the Population register reported that 7.6% of residents have undefined citizenship and 8.4% have foreign citizenship, mostly Russian.[27] As the Russian Federation was recognized as the successor state to the Soviet Union, all former USSR citizens qualified for natural-born citizenship of Russia, available upon mere request, as provided by the law "On the RSFSR Citizenship" in force up to end of 2000.[28]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russians_in_Estonia

 

[Aardvark154]

This I hope is merely U.N. talk.

Further there is a terrible disconnect between even very well educated Russians and Balts, Most Russians I've met just do not get that the Baltics have their own history quite separate from Russia's and don't have some deep abiding love for the Rodina.

 

[mandrill]

Canada-man, I hope you realize that pretty much ALL states have language requirements for citizenship, including Canada.

 

[mandrill]

This I hope is merely U.N. talk.

Further there is a terrible disconnect between even very well educated Russians and Balts. Most Russians I've met just do not get that the Baltics have their own history quite separate from Russia's and don't have some deep abiding love for the Rodina.

The disconnect is also present in Ukrainian-Russian relations. In all my Russian FB friends, I have yet to find a sole, single one - regardless of education level or personality type - who has even a shred of respect for Ukrainians or Ukraine. They inevitably see Ukrainians as crazies and / or hoodlums who are preventing the Russophone dwellers in Ukraine from reuniting w the Motherland.

I have even had a well-educated Russian college teacher friend advocate that Ukraine be stripped back to the tiny enclave which originally formed Bohdan Khmelnitsky's cossack fiefdom in the 1600's. Discussion of the Ukrainian PoV on any issue simply does not occur to a Russian. Add to that, eastern European nationalism appears to be aggressive, crudely unsophisticated, violent and obsessed by historical grievances and successes and you have a recipe for dire problems.

 

[basketcase]

This I hope is merely U.N. talk.

Further there is a terrible disconnect between even very well educated Russians and Balts, Most Russians I've met just do not get that the Baltics have their own history quite separate from Russia's and don't have some deep abiding love for the Rodina.

I'm surprised you're not saying that Russia is right because Estonia was a part of Russia until 1917 and between WWII and 1991.

 

[Aardvark154]

I'm surprised you're not saying that Russia is right because Estonia was a part of Russia until 1917 and between WWII and 1991.

In which case it would seem that you would be surprised about a lot of things.

From the time that the Russian Empire acquired the Duchy of Estonia, the Duchy of Courland and the Governorate of Livonia from Sweden at the end of the Great Northern War, right down almost to the Russian Revolution, these three areas were administered independently of Russia proper and largely by local leaders. This is entirely different from the situation in Crimea which was indeed part of Russia proper.


At the time of the Baltic States were discussing joining NATO 2002-2004, the issue of pushing NATO right up against Russia, and the Russian feeling that this was a betrayal of understandings at the time of German reunification were talked about and largely ignored. Hence that is water under the the bridge, they are NATO members and we have an article five obligation to their defence.

 

[K Douglas]

Its a pattern. First Georgia, then Ukraine now Estonia and then Lithuania. Soviets trying to reconquer lost lands because they are depopulating.

 

[danmand]

I'm surprised you're not saying that Russia is right because Estonia was a part of Russia until 1917 and between WWII and 1991.

Estonioa is rightfully danish, and in due time will come back to the danish empire together with Lithuania and Latvia. The danish flag was given to the danes by God during the battle of Lyndanisse (in Estonia) on 15 June 1219.

 

[red]

Estonia is a member of nato

Let's see if putin is crazy or opportunistic- if he tries this shit in Estonia then he is crazy

 

[Aardvark154]

Estonioa is rightfully danish, and in due time will come back to the danish empire together with Lithuania and Latvia. The danish flag was given to the danes by God during the battle of Lyndanisse (in Estonia) on 15 June 1219.

Denmark doesn't believe in contracts? In 1346 King Valdemar IV Atterdag of Denmark sold it to the Teutonic Knights for 19,000 Köln marks.

 

[Aardvark154]

Estonia is a member of nato

Let's see if putin is crazy or opportunistic- if he tries this shit in Estonia then he is crazy

V.V. Putin is very far from crazy.

We may not like him, but that is an utterly different matter.

 

[danmand]

Denmark doesn't believe in contracts? In 1346 King Valdemar IV Atterdag of Denmark sold it to the Teutonic Knights for 19,000 Köln marks.

You forgot to mention that in 1559 during the Livonian war the Bishop of Ösel-Wiek in Old Livonia sold his lands to King Frederick II of Denmark for 30,000 thalers. The Danish king gave the territory to his younger brother Magnus who landed on Saaremaa with an army in 1560. The whole of Saaremaa became a Danish possession in 1573, and remained so until it was illegally transferred to Sweden in 1645

 

[canada-man]

Estonioa is rightfully danish, and in due time will come back to the danish empire together with Lithuania and Latvia. The danish flag was given to the danes by God during the battle of Lyndanisse (in Estonia) on 15 June 1219.

Estonia was part of the Swedish Empire


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ishEmpire.png/720px-LocationSwedishEmpire.png

 

[danmand]

Estonia was part of the Swedish Empire

The Swedish insurgency never became more than a Kingdom.

 

[Aardvark154]

The whole of Saaremaa became a Danish possession in 1573, and remained so until it was illegally transferred to Sweden in 1645

They in the immortal words of John Kerry were acting like they were in the sixteenth century rather than the enlightened seventeenth century.

* They must have needed the revenues they could get from it to help that very worthwhile project Nya Sverige (New Sweden).

 

[Aardvark154]

Next door in Poland.

Forbes

Ukraine Crisis: Poland's Air Defenses Become A Pressing Concern For Washington

Dr. Loren Thompson

Russian leader Vladimir Putin’s campaign to annex the Crimean Peninsula has raised military tensions in Eastern Europe as former Soviet republics and their western neighbors wonder what Moscow’s next move might be. Although the Crimea was part of Russia for centuries before Soviet Premier Nikita Khrushchev folded it into the Ukrainian republic in 1954, military planners in Eastern Europe’s capitals can’t ignore the possibility that Putin might seek to recover other lost territories. One place where people are especially apprehensive is Poland, a country of 38 million that joined NATO in 1999 and the European Union in 2004 but shares borders with three former Soviet republics and the Russian enclave at Kaliningrad on the Baltic Sea.

With few natural barriers to keep invaders out, the Poles are counting on western allies to back up their own indigenous defense efforts. Western nations in turn need Warsaw’s support for whatever sanctions they impose on Russia to deter further expansionist moves. But history has taught the Poles that they can’t count on other nations to save them, so long before the Ukraine crisis unfolded, Warsaw decided to buy a network of defenses against overhead threats originating in Russia. Called the Polish Shield, the $43 billion project would be able to counter fighters, bombers, drones, cruise missiles and tactical ballistic missiles. Longer-range ballistic missiles could be handled by land- and sea-based defenses the U.S. is deploying to the region.

The linchpin of the Polish Shield is a family of mobile radars and surface-to-air missiles that Warsaw will buy from foreign suppliers, with the aim of giving much of the production work to local contractors. Poland’s military has narrowed down the number of prospective offerors to four teams – two led by U.S. companies, one by French companies, and one by Israelis. And that’s where the politics begin. The traditional U.S. champion in such competitions has been Raytheon's Patriot air defense system, which was developed during the Cold War. The U.S. had planned to develop a successor to Patriot called the Medium Extended Air Defense System, or MEADS, but the Army decided to kill that program several years back for lack of funding.

There isn’t much doubt that the next-generation MEADS is more capable than Patriot — or at least would be if it entered production. It offers 360-degree radar coverage in an easily transportable configuration that could be mounted on the Army’s most common medium truck. All of its sensors, missiles and command centers can be carried on C-130 or A400 airlifters, and once on the ground the system’s wireless links enable it to disperse to safe locations without losing any of its defensive punch. The much heavier Patriot batteries only cover 90-120 degrees of the horizon and require a lot more airlift. Moving them around once they are deployed on the ground is a logistical challenge.

The Army decided to stick with Patriot partly because at the time it was fighting insurgents who lacked aircraft and missiles — making air defense a low priority. But it isn’t a low priority anymore because the focus of U.S. military strategy is shifting to the Western Pacific where U.S. forces confront a rising China, and now Russia has forced its way back into U.S. military calculations. Both countries field ballistic missiles and airborne weapons that would present a challenge to Patriot in its current form, and the outlook is for such weapons to become more capable in the future.

So in an unusual move, the Obama Administration late last week gave prime contractor Lockheed Martin permission to offer the Medium Extended Air Defense System to Warsaw for use in the Polish Shield. The Poles have known about MEADS for some time, because two other European NATO nations — Germany and Italy – provided 42% of the money needed to develop it. A Polish delegation showed up for November tests in which a MEADS prototype demonstrated its ability to intercept a drone and a ballistic missile approaching from opposite directions. The Poles were predictably impressed, and have included MEADS on their short list of systems that might be suitable to defend against a Russian attack.

Raytheon is not pleased that its Patriot, also on Warsaw’s short list, will have to compete against a system backed by arch-rival Lockheed Martin and two European nations that is no longer a Pentagon program of record. That raises the question of why the Obama Administration approved offering the system to Poland. Three factors seem to be at work. First, U.S. policymakers were shocked last year when Turkey picked a Chinese air defense system over Patriot and a French offering, rating the U.S. system third. Although Ankara seems to be wavering on that decision due to pressure from other NATO allies, Turkish law would require it to buy the second-ranked French system rather than Patriot if it abandoned the Chinese option.

Second, Washington wants to be as responsive as possible to Warsaw given past mis-steps on European missile defense. Shortly after entering office, President Obama decided to delay planned deployment of missile defenses in Poland by seven years — partly because of loud complaints from Moscow. Not only did the administration fail to warn Warsaw a change was coming, but it disclosed the shift on the anniversary of Poland’s 1939 invasion by Russia. With all of Eastern Europe now apprehensive about what Moscow’s military moves in Crimea portend, Washington is straining to reassure regional partners like Poland of its commitment to their security.

Third, MEADS fits readily into a European framework for deterring Russian aggression because Germany and Italy may go ahead with producing it even if America does not. Poland could conceivably replace the U.S. as the third partner, giving it plenty of latitude for distributing work to local industry. Lockheed and Raytheon will both be in Warsaw over the next two weeks discussing potential industrial partnering on the Polish Shield, but work shares on Patriot are well-established while the uncertain status of MEADS in the U.S. opens up all sorts of potential opportunities for the Poles.

The core dilemma Washington faces in the current crisis is how to reassure and protect Eastern European partners without employing U.S. forces — a step that could lead to destabilizing escalation on both sides. The U.S. public does not favor giving military assistance to Ukraine, but selling cutting-edge defensive technology to a NATO ally such as Poland would just be a continuation of longstanding practice. Encouraging Poland to construct its planned defensive shield from the latest U.S. technology might send Moscow the right message as it contemplates its apparent victory in Crimea."


(Disclosure: Raytheon and Lockheed Martin, contribute to the Lexington Institute: Lockheed Martin is a consulting client.)

 

[Azprint]

Estonia was part of the Swedish Empire


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ishEmpire.png/720px-LocationSwedishEmpire.png

Go deeper, and Estonians along with the rest of Prebaltic countries are mostly German, with a history of strong support of Fascist Germany when it invaded USSRs back in 1941. And yeah, Russians are considered to be second class citizens over there too.

 

[mandrill]

Go deeper, and Estonians along with the rest of Prebaltic countries are mostly German, with a history of strong support of Fascist Germany when it invaded USSRs back in 1941. And yeah, Russians are considered to be second class citizens over there too.

They are not German. They are a separate ethnic group. Estonians in fact are related to Finns. Almost everyone in Eastern Europe supported Nazi Germany in WW2 as a preferable alternative to Stalinist Russia - Slovakia, Croatia, Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria, Finland, the Baltic States and Ukraine all aligned w Nazi Germany.

 

[danmand]

They are not German. They are a separate ethnic group. Estonians in fact are related to Finns. Almost everyone in Eastern Europe supported Nazi Germany in WW2 as a preferable alternative to Stalinist Russia - Slovakia, Croatia, Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria, Finland, the Baltic States and Ukraine all aligned w Nazi Germany.

Revising history again.