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Ban on religious slaughter of animals begins in Denmark

Mervyn

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Dec 23, 2005
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Traditionally both involve a single deep cut on the jugular, carotid, and windpipe. Research using EEG implants recorders has been done to see how much pain animals experience from this and the answer is quite surprising, none to speak of in the first few seconds and then the animal enters a state of unconsciousness, the heart can still beat while blood drains, but no pain registers on the EEG. No different results are recorded using standard Western stun guns in the abattoir.

The distaste to the butchering of animal is basically a BAMBI reaction to the butchering of all meats, little more, unless you are of the, vegetarian, vegan, PETA persuasion.
Said cut however would have to be done by someone with properly maintained knife , and and of sufficient experience to do it, and since humans are not perfect, even the best at it will screw it up from time to time.

The other question that has to be asked, how about when it's automated ? can a robot do as good a job as a human in this ? butchering halaal or kosher on a large scale would be quite difficult I would imagine.

Neitherr of those religions want to cause the animal undue harm , and I bet you dollar to donuts if these religions had stun guns when they formed, they would be part of the procedure.
 

danmand

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Nov 28, 2003
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Neitherr of those religions want to cause the animal undue harm , and I bet you dollar to donuts if these religions had stun guns when they formed, they would be part of the procedure.
Both mainstream jewish and islamic organizations in Denmark accept stunning animals before killing in abatoirs.
 

blackrock13

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Said cut however would have to be done by someone with properly maintained knife , and and of sufficient experience to do it, and since humans are not perfect, even the best at it will screw it up from time to time.

The other question that has to be asked, how about when it's automated ? can a robot do as good a job as a human in this ? butchering halaal or kosher on a large scale would be quite difficult I would imagine.

Neitherr of those religions want to cause the animal undue harm , and I bet you dollar to donuts if these religions had stun guns when they formed, they would be part of the procedure.
If there is one thing butcher does is take care of his knives.

As for the automated question, I can't say since i've not known a kosher butcher who operates like that. Replacing knives with a stun gun is pretty much a non starter to a traditional practice. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, just not in my circles. Perhaps those who actually are Jewish or muslims can ask that the next time they go to their kosher/halal butcher.
 

Mervyn

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Well, I notice both posters and the original article keep saying, tehre are studies that prove there is no pain, and yet, never produce those studies.

http://www.theweek.co.uk/politics/19151/proof-pain-leads-calls-ban-ritual-slaughter

From that article

Johnson thinks the way forward is best exemplified by Muslims in New Zealand, who use a reversible form of electrical stunning that animals can recover from if they are not immediately slaughtered. This proves the animal is alive when killed and is therefore halal. ·
 

blackrock13

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Jun 6, 2009
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How on earth do you watch a 7 minute video in 2 minutes?
2 minute was all I needed to get the message.

It wasn't hard, not initially wanting to spend seven minutes, I picked a couple of spots and heard hi-lites which made me cringe, such as when he talks about stunning causing pain and cutting the spinal cords was required, when I understand its not the case in either case. Tell me I'm wrong.
 

red

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Nov 13, 2001
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Ban on religious slaughter of animals begins in Denmark



Halal and kosher slaughter banned, as minister says 'Animal rights come before religion'.


Update: The Danish Ministry for Food, Agriculture, and Fisheries has released a statement addressing the new regulation on kosher and halal slaughter.

“No slaughter without pre-stunning has been registered in Denmark in the last ten years. It is still permitted to import meat slaughtered without pre-stunning. And a very large amount of Danish meat has been – and will continue to be – halal slaughtered, with the animal stunned right before slaughter”, says Danish Agriculture and Food Minister Dan Jorgensen.

Khalil Jaffar, an imam at the Islamic Cultural Centre in Copenhagen, told Al Jazeera on Tuesday that Danish Islamic leaders issued a religious decree several years ago saying that animals stunned before slaughter were considered halal in Denmark. Danish Halal, a non-profit halal monitoring group, maintains that stunning the animal before slaughter is in contradiction to the rules of halal slaughter. Their petition against the new regulation has received 12,000 signatures. According to an announcement by Danish Halal on Tuesday, the group has a meeting with Jorgensen on Friday, and will deliver the petition at that time.

A ban on kosher and halal slaughter in Denmark began Monday. Announcing the ban last week, Danish Agriculture and Food Minister Dan Jorgensen said, "Animal rights come before religion".

Traditionally, in order to be considered kosher under Jewish law or halal under Islamic law, animals must be conscious when killed. The new rule, which follows similar regulations in other European countries, requires animals be stunned before slaughter.

Danish Halal launched a petition condemning the ban. The group calls it "a clear interference in religious freedom limiting the rights of Muslims and Jews to practice their religion in Denmark".


Israeli Deputy Minister of Religious Services Rabbi Eli Ben Dahan, apparently responding to the ban, said, “European anti-Semitism is showing its true colours across Europe, and is even intensifying in the government institutions”.



However, Finn Schwartz, the president of Denmark's Jewish community, rebuffed claims that the ban was anti-Semitic, calling the relationship between the Danish government and Jewish community "perfect". Schwartz also questioned the minister's claim that the ban would ban kosher slaughter in Denmark. The last kosher animal slaughter in Denmark reportedly happened more than ten years ago.

Despite the criticism, many on Twitter praised the ban.
Oh I thought this was going to be about the Danes stopping the killing of whales and dolphins?
 

jsanchez

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Apr 8, 2004
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T.O.
please educate me on halal/kosher then.

what makes it different from regular slaughter?

all I wish is that the animal suffer as less as possible, I don't care about rituals.

now if some religious ritual ceremony causes unneeded suffering, then that's a big NO.
Rituals aside, halal/kosher intended to do 2 things simultaneously:
1- kill the animal as fast and as painlessly as possible
2- drain as much of the animal's blood as possible, since blood is considered not kosher/halal as far as i know

Keep in mind that you can't accomplish #2 if the heart stops quickly, so that rules out many techniques...There was only one way available back then to the nomadic cultures where kosher/halal slaughter originated, that could satisfy both conditions above, and that was to use the sharpest blade to cut the carotid etc. as detailed by blackrock13, the animal is rendered unconscious quickly but its heart keeps on pumping for a while.
 

danmand

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Nov 28, 2003
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It will be interesting to see if other countries follow the example of Denmark. One might think that Denmark has more to lose than most countries, because it has a large export of meat products. (of course, the export of products originating from pigs are not an issue).
 

blackrock13

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It will be interesting to see if other countries follow the example of Denmark. One might think that Denmark has more to lose than most countries, because it has a large export of meat products. (of course, the export of products originating from pigs are not an issue).
Be sure to report back when that happens.
 

danmand

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