From closing the offices that serve vets to clawing back Their pensions, why the Tory war on our vets?
http://m.huffpost.com/ca/entry/4654145/
http://m.huffpost.com/ca/entry/4654145/
Why are Tories attacking our vets?
- Thread starter Lovehobby
- Start date
Actually it appears they are just transfering the services to another dept.
And that meeting? The Vets were transported and paid for by the union affected by this.
Smells a bit fishy to me.
And that meeting? The Vets were transported and paid for by the union affected by this.
Smells a bit fishy to me.
Legion opposes both office closure and clawback. Union controls the Legion? Doubt it. Vets dont want their offices transferred. They want Fantino out. Not just geezers any more. Afghanistan vets giving Legion new life. NDP has become the vets advocate Tories the vet bashers.WTF?
I didn't mention the Legion. I merely stated that the Transportation and others costs to go to the meeting in Ottawa were payed for by the Union that is affected by the closures. And that the services are being transfered, not cancelled.
Just wanted to clarify things a bit. Make sure there is full disclosure.
Just wanted to clarify things a bit. Make sure there is full disclosure.
So Veteran services are being transferred to other departments, then what?
Can Service Canada provide the support that Vets need. They neither have the training nor the knowledge to look after Vets, it's just going to create red tape where none is needed. And Julian Fantino is a bully and always has been. He and Craig Brommell were running the city in the last days of Mel Lastman, I feared that we were on the road to a police state. I'll never criticize David Miller, upon taking office he got rid of both these goons. I'll actively be canvassing for whomever runs against Fantino in the next election - if he has the gumption to run again.
Can Service Canada provide the support that Vets need. They neither have the training nor the knowledge to look after Vets, it's just going to create red tape where none is needed. And Julian Fantino is a bully and always has been. He and Craig Brommell were running the city in the last days of Mel Lastman, I feared that we were on the road to a police state. I'll never criticize David Miller, upon taking office he got rid of both these goons. I'll actively be canvassing for whomever runs against Fantino in the next election - if he has the gumption to run again.
Can you say definitavely Service Canada can't? Isn't this for the most part what they do already? Or are you accusing them of not being competent?
The union flew them up, gave them their talking points. Were seen treating them to dinner. The Minister was delayed in a meeting(veteran affairs in fact). He apologized when he did catch up to them and the 8 vets refused to accept it and called him a liar. Would you consider this to be a good start to a meeting?
It was a set-up by the union. And using wheelchair-bound veterans to boot. Crass.
But on to the point about funding. Does this mean(speaking to both Von and LH) that you would be for increased funding to the military. Are you a supporter on several points?
1. Increased funding to Veteran Affairs
2. Increased wages
3. Increased funding for proper modern equipment and weapon systems so they can do the job with as much safety to the people in uniform as can be had?
Let's see if you both are willing to put the money where the mouth is. Or were they just another Photo-op against the Feds?
The union flew them up, gave them their talking points. Were seen treating them to dinner. The Minister was delayed in a meeting(veteran affairs in fact). He apologized when he did catch up to them and the 8 vets refused to accept it and called him a liar. Would you consider this to be a good start to a meeting?
It was a set-up by the union. And using wheelchair-bound veterans to boot. Crass.
But on to the point about funding. Does this mean(speaking to both Von and LH) that you would be for increased funding to the military. Are you a supporter on several points?
1. Increased funding to Veteran Affairs
2. Increased wages
3. Increased funding for proper modern equipment and weapon systems so they can do the job with as much safety to the people in uniform as can be had?
Let's see if you both are willing to put the money where the mouth is. Or were they just another Photo-op against the Feds?
The honour of a nation is bound on how it looks after those that have served to protect it's values. No I don't have a problem with my tax money going to insure that they are looked after. If you hate unions that's your problem, I don't see it as a union issue.
And why wouldn't you treat a veteran to dinner FFS!
And why wouldn't you treat a veteran to dinner FFS!
Hey if you treat a Vet to dinner to say thank you great! If you do it for political reasons shame on you.
But here is the point. Veterans affairs has basically been shrinking steadily because the majority of the vets and now deceased (WW2 and Korea) or in Nursing homes already receiving all the care they need. Our manpower is a fraction of what it was then. So the department size no longer coralates to the number who need it.
When the Dept was initially created nothing like it existed. We have now actually expanded many of the services origionally offered only to Vets to the civilian population. Services Canada pretty much already does what Veterans Affairs does now. So why pay for two depts when one is very under-utilized.
There is an emotional component I understand. The slightest perception that we are screwing over the Vets will rile up a lot of people. But they will not be screwed over.
The only ones losing out is the union. That is why they did this. And it was in my opinion shameful the way they USED them as a prop to try to save their own skins.
I agree with Botler1000., As long as the wonderful and experienced Julian Fantino is safe and keeps getting a paycheque, veterans should shut the fuck up and accept that they were stupid to join the Canadian Armed Forces and deserve nothing more than standard pension plan and online access to Services Canada website.
Sure, there's a lot of suicide and PTSD among veterans but they need to learn to look after themselves. Besides, more suicides = "shrinking steadily" of veterans, which means fewer veterans and less need for local offices. Like Butler1000 says, veterans should really help their country out by dying off faster, therefore saving us money. And unions are bad, so unions helping out veterans to meet with the Veteran Affairs minister is al-Qaida-level evil. Who do they think they are?!
Veterans are learning what residents of Caledonia have known about Fantino for a long time
He doesn't get his political positions to help taxpayers, or soldiers, or anyone else but himself and whoever appointed him.
Look, the Harper government cannot be expected to spend over $100 million on a week of photo ops in the Middle East, and help veterans by keeping a few small local VA offices open. Choices need to be made!
Sure, there's a lot of suicide and PTSD among veterans but they need to learn to look after themselves. Besides, more suicides = "shrinking steadily" of veterans, which means fewer veterans and less need for local offices. Like Butler1000 says, veterans should really help their country out by dying off faster, therefore saving us money. And unions are bad, so unions helping out veterans to meet with the Veteran Affairs minister is al-Qaida-level evil. Who do they think they are?!
Veterans are learning what residents of Caledonia have known about Fantino for a long time
He doesn't get his political positions to help taxpayers, or soldiers, or anyone else but himself and whoever appointed him.
Look, the Harper government cannot be expected to spend over $100 million on a week of photo ops in the Middle East, and help veterans by keeping a few small local VA offices open. Choices need to be made!
Sure Matt.....ya that's what I said. Verbatum.
Seriously now I usually see you guys whining about how much we spent on the military. But the minute a Union is affected well let's go round up the last of the WW2 vets for a photo op.
Try a bit of common sense and less hyperbole ok. No points for this one.
Seriously now I usually see you guys whining about how much we spent on the military. But the minute a Union is affected well let's go round up the last of the WW2 vets for a photo op.
Try a bit of common sense and less hyperbole ok. No points for this one.
I would cut the military budget any day especially the bloated American budget but both countries treat vets like shit.
For the size of army that remains I would seriously raise their pay.
Now nobody in USA wants to hire vets because they worry they all have ptsd snd are going to a burden as an employee not an asset. Really sad.
For the size of army that remains I would seriously raise their pay.
Now nobody in USA wants to hire vets because they worry they all have ptsd snd are going to a burden as an employee not an asset. Really sad.
Just a small point, this is Canada and we're talking about our vets.
Knowing how well you makes shit up, please show us where you get this idea that vets aren't getting hire because employers are afraid. In many cases, employers will hire them in a snap.
There are dozens of programs set up specifically of rehiring vets and they work just find. Not every vet suffers ptsd, it's not even close. let alone that not every vet that has it are serial killers or mad bombers or are doomed to suffer dibilitatingly from it for the rest of their life.
Some of these vets that attended the meeting 'at VA's invitation' and living on limited pensions, came from both coasts. They help them travel and accommodate a place to say, big deal. Maybe some of the PSAC members are vets and hate seeing the way their fellows vets are being treated. The vets clearly said this was not a stunt. I'd believe before I'd believe Harpers gang.
Fantino set the meeting time and place up. His assistants told the vets, at the meeting, that Fantino couldn't make it, because another commitment ran late. They asked the vets if they could reschedule, but they vets told them they couldn't because of a schedules 'press conference'. The vets adjourned to an anti room to discuss what just happened. Fantino entered the same building by a side door, i guess he was hoping to slip by them, but ended up in the same room, ooooops. His chance meeting is well covered by the media and recorded for you to see. A classic 'how not to' talk to people that the electorate, save for some ignorant few, respect, support, and honour.
Fantino's apology in the House was so heart felt, he had to read it. The vets didn't buy it one bit.
The staff at those other department won't be experience VA employees, they will in most cases totally new, with no familiarities with the vets files, any bets hired at a lower wage. I don't ono if you've ever been to one of these Service Canada locations, but line up are common places and you often have to line up more than once, not something a 60- 80 year old vets can do well. The VA has establish an phone app to help, what a joke. One young vet was interview a couple of times and he indicated there was quite computer and media savvy and he said the web site for the VA, that the vets are expected to use is one of the most complicated he's ever been on.
This is another classic failure on the part of the Conservative government.
Even with the shrinking numbers, the vets are still having trouble getting what they need, especially the new ones from Afghanistan and the like. As one young vets put it, the battle plan for the VA seems to be is Deny, Delay, and Die, all in the name of balancing the budget by 2015. This was also the sentiment of the recently retired/fired VA ombudsman.
My grandfather was a destroyer captain in British navy WW1. My father was a first mate on corvet escorts in WW2 in the North Atlantic.
They were very clear with me. War is evil. High military budgets cause wars. Honour vets. The war was not their fault. They did their duty and made extreme sacrifices, many the ultimate sacrifice.
It is a holy crusade for me.
