Steeles Royal

Is PMP certification worth it?

Nazia Noor

New member
Jun 5, 2010
150
1
0
Toronto
www.eros-toronto.com
To all of you HR people, is the PMP certification worth it? When hiring for a project manager, will it make the candidate stand out? Or has it become one of those certifications that don't matter anymore.

I am already a six sigma green belt and have considered the PMP certification. The prep courses are a significant cost, and I am not sure if I should go ahead and do it.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
 

punter

New member
Oct 13, 2002
2,378
0
0
Toronto
I think it's worthless. It would be much better if you had two years project management experience on your resume and can get someone to give you a fake reference. Unethical, but lots of people do it.
 

demien2k5

Banned
Aug 3, 2006
3,658
0
0
On the Edge
PMP as a certification of credentials is worthless. What hiring managers want to see is the size, scale, complexity and value of projects you have successfully managed to completion, on time, on budget. Three solid references from significantly impressive employers or clients will completely render whether or not you have a PMP worthless to a hiring manager. The most important question is not what test did you pass, but can you deliver on my dime?
 

Nazia Noor

New member
Jun 5, 2010
150
1
0
Toronto
www.eros-toronto.com
Thanks for the feedback.

I do have great references for the projects I have lead and managed so thousands saved.
 

COMMANDER KIRK

Future Captain
Aug 8, 2003
64
0
0
The hitch here is being able to get to the hiring manager. Many firms simple toss PM resumes that don't include certification. Contracting to the Ontario Government? PMP is pretty much obligatory for any PM role.
 

Celticman

Into Ties and Tail
Aug 13, 2009
8,916
87
48
Durham & Toronto
The advice above is very good. Keep in mind that six sigma green belt and PMP certification are not exactly major qualifications like, say, a CMA as an example. Also, keep in mind that a decision as to the relevance of the qualification is scarcely going to be made by HR in the final analysis. It will be made by the head of the department that is adding to staff. Managers/Directors/VPs at this level understand the value of real experience and, in addition, truly look for the intangibles like the ability to work outside of your comfort zone; teamwork; determination and integrity. To the latter, steer clear of the advice of a fake reference mentioned above. If you do not have the goods it will become quickly apparent and you will not likely survive your probation period, a true black mark on a resume.
 

trod

Active member
Aug 3, 2009
1,091
1
38
If you are applying to any government or public sector job, PMP certification would most likely be required.

For private sectors, it doesn't matter much if you have actual project management experience relative to the comapany's needs.
 

fuji

Banned
Jan 31, 2005
80,011
7
0
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
is.gd
The PMP is a "checkbox" certification. Some places require you to have it. If you have it, they check off that box in the hiring process. An HR idiot who doesn't know anything about project management might throw your resume in the garbage if you don't have that box ticked off. A hiring manager won't care and as others said, will be interested in the size and scale of your experience managing similar projects in the real world.

So basically, some employers require it, if you want to work for one of those employers, having the certification may prevent your resume from being chucked in the garbage.

At my workplace we require project managers to have the PMP certification, but we are quite willing to hire people who don't have it, and then the firm pays for them to take the exam to get it so that we can say they have it. We do that in many areas, so that we can say everyone is certified to do the job they have, which meets some certification for the company as a whole that allows us to bid on certain government contracts. Blahblah.
 

yolosohobby

Banned
Dec 25, 2012
1,919
0
0
Most of these "checkbox" certifications are required by "work"places where the employees all "know a thousand ways to make love, but don't know any women". Nothing like real experience!
 

Lal

New member
Mar 11, 2007
567
0
0
At my workplace we require project managers to have the PMP certification, but we are quite willing to hire people who don't have it, and then the firm pays for them to take the exam to get it so that we can say they have it. We do that in many areas, so that we can say everyone is certified to do the job they have, which meets some certification for the company as a whole that allows us to bid on certain government contracts. Blahblah.
Same at my workplace. I work with people at my firm who do not have a PMP but manage large complex programs with multiple workstreams and technology and process redesign. Also, many large firms have their own customized project management framework which may not be compatible with what you learn in PMP.

My firm pays for PMP certification, as part of Learning & Development.
 

SoftHands813

Casual Observer
Jan 2, 2008
743
272
63
Project Managers are like colonoscopies. Everyone says they're great and you should really have one, but in the end, their just a big pain in the ass and you have to put up with a lot of $hit.
 

niveamen

On the fence
Dec 13, 2009
190
0
16
I concur. PMP is a necessary evil if you want to a PM consultant or for some industries. It shows that you spent the time to get it and passed the exam and have "some" knowledge. Experience still is more important, but that piece of paper gets you in the door.

Just like every other piece of paper you own. Same with ITIL or any other certification, Federal Provincial security clearance it. It can mean the difference of an interview or tossing your resume in the out box with the other 100 applications.
 

needinit

New member
Jan 19, 2004
1,193
1
0
Got out of the 'real' PM field as I had 20 years PM experience and came across a person from another firm on a contract with me who 'earned' the PMP certification by remembering definitions - this was a few years ago and your could get through the exam without really having managed a project - the expectation was originally also based on demonstrated hours, but IMO that has been watered down.

Often with the trendy certifications, they become watered down over time as the business becomes one of generating certificates - MBAs, ISO certification, Six Sigma, Quality Management, ITIL Certification and PMP to name a few! Unfortunately in some (employment) cases having the certification is a requirement for entrance through the door, in other experience and approach count for more - I prefer the latter.
 

Nazia Noor

New member
Jun 5, 2010
150
1
0
Toronto
www.eros-toronto.com
You all make a good point. Weighing everything that you all have said, and given the industry that I am looking to get it for, it seems like one of those necessary expenses that I really want to forego but can't.
 

explorerzip

Well-known member
Jul 27, 2006
8,127
1,295
113
If you're crafty, get your employer to pay for those courses. This is a lot harder to do when it once was; I've known people that have gotten their employers to pay for an Ivey MBA.

All the letters after your name won't mean anything unless you can communicate your value to the company every day, not just the interviews. Meaning interpersonal communication, presentations, negotiation and working with others. Can't tell you how many people have a laundry list of certifications, but cannot communicate their ideas or work with others. No offence to you, of course. The common thread is that people with a lot of certifications have only book knowledge, but don't possess the critical thinking or people skills to apply the concepts in the real world. Worse yet, some follow processes by the book and don't leave any room for discussion and are downright hard to work with. You won't get far in the corporate world, if no one wants to work with you.

Learn some sales, marketing, and definitely people skills (interpersonal skills, public speaking, networking, etc.) that you can take to any company or even better start your own. Certifications are fine, but only useful if your company or the one you're jumping to decides to use those processes. Not to mention you have to re-certify every few years. Six sigma and similar certifications are not used everywhere, which can limit where you work. These days you need to worry about which company you're going to work at next, not about the one you're with today.

It takes sales, marketing and people skills to stick around at a company or move around to others. Those skills will never expire, but you still have to work on them constantly.
 

Hangman

The Ideal Terbite
Aug 6, 2003
5,596
1
0
www.fark.com
Thanks for the feedback.

I do have great references for the projects I have lead and managed so thousands saved.
The PMP is a tick in the box. Remember that the hiring decision is rarely made by the HR people, they just process it.

As noted above, you are more likely to impress employers with practical, real-world experience; especially if you can quantify and articulate it. It sounds like you have that, so that's good.

Unfortunately, though the PMP isn't much use on its own, it is a qualification that will differentiate you from your competitors (that check in the box). Someone with similar experience AND the designation may land the job over you.

A good, ethical compromise might be to get yourself some of the study material, and then you can say you're working towards PMP designation. Trust me, if you get the job, nobody will come up to you in a year and ask how the PMP qualification is coming...:D
 

letsn0twastetime

New member
Nov 16, 2011
480
0
0
I like it because its a cert you do not need to recertify in 3 years like other IT certs I've held. I don't want to be pushing 50 and still studying!

My other comment, the city has too many overqualified people doing less qualified jobs so you don't want the bone heads in HR discounting you for a job because they can't possible understand how valuable your work experience is because your missing this check box.
 

Goodoer

Well-known member
Feb 20, 2004
2,980
1,777
113
GTA & Thereabouts...
Like most have said, the PMP certification is a 'checkbox' qualification. The private sector will evaluate you based on what you've 'done'.
 
Toronto Escorts