Toronto Star - Oakville gas plant cancellation costs ballooning

[Moviefan-2]

Few people believed the McGuinty government's claim that the cancellation of the Oakville gas plant would only cost $40 million. The big question is what is the real cost?

http://www.thestar.com/business/art...nt-cancellation-costs-ballooning-says-analyst

 

[oldjones]

Brings to mind the old saying: They can never find enough money to do it right the first time, but they always come up with it somehow, when it's gotta be fixed.

 

[Possum Trot]

Buying that seat was very, very expensive for the rest of the province.

 

[oldjones]

Buying that seat was very, very expensive for the rest of the province.

And Kingston and Sarnia will get the same sorta crap plants Toronto got stuck with down on the waterfront, because no one lives there to protest. Yet.

Just think what an extra half-billion each coulda done to make those plants acceptable in the places where they were needed, and the engineers said they should go.

 

[Rockslinger]

Politics and the public sector is a bad mix. This would never have happened if the private sector was in charge.

 

[FAST]

Tax supported incompetence

Politics and the public sector is a bad mix. This would never have happened if the private sector was in charge.

That’s the problem, with a government "running" things, actually NOBODY is in charge !!!

You can't expect civil servants to perform,... as they never have to, witness the Ornge joke, school boards, etc. etc. etc. !!!

FAST

 

[oldjones]

Politics and the public sector is a bad mix. This would never have happened if the private sector was in charge.

How many billion did governments have to pump into GM and Chrysler again? Wasn't it managers in that private sector who were supposed to notice when they were approaching the red line and steer clear of it? Or is multi hundreds of millions within their normal margin of error for unimportant stuff like balancing their books? I'd say their incompetence easily otstripped McGuinty's, but he's actually gotta face the folks paying the bills. Us. None of those private sector heros of yours has yet, nor will they.

You guys who keep spouting that nonsensical stuff owe us an explanation of how it works. Like how does a brilliant private sector manager turned politico—like his brilliant private sector turned politico dad—somehow escape the 'infection' of politics. And what attracts such fine men to throw away their achivements and reputation in the political landfills of Washington Queens Park and elsewhere. Fact is government=business=what people do=how we get what we need and want. It's all the same, invented and done by people for people. Only the mechanisms we invented differ when we choose to operate publicly or privately. BTW. Hasn't that privatized slaughterhouse inspection been a rip-snorting success?

Funny thing: we have actual bankruptcy laws, and golden parachutes to help out the failures and incompetents who can't manage the easy business of making money in the private world. Public politicos face a cutthroat make-or-break every election, and most of the folks who are judging their performance put more effort and thought into picking their shoes. But somehow, the pols manage, and there are always some fools wanting to leave the profit world and do public good.

Question: Is there any company in the world that's delivered the goods to its people as long as the City of Rome? If the private sector is so infallable and the public so iredeemable I'm sure you can name many fortunes founded in the days of the Republic that are prospering today.

 

[cye]

Stupidity across sectors seems to be remarkably constant.

 

[Googled]

How many billion did governments have to pump into GM and Chrysler again? Wasn't the private sector in charge of noticing when they were approaching the red line and steering clear of it? Or is a multi hundreds of million within their normal marhin of error for stuff like balancing their books?

The government should have left GM and Chrysler to go bankrupt like Air Canada maybe then they could have restructured their labour.

 

[oldjones]

Stupidity across sectors seems to be remarkably constant.

And has little to do with where you can climb to, or the enterprises you can bungle. Witness Toronto, the aformentioned car companies, and countless generals, bereft of intelligence or ability who nonetheless rose through the rigorous and manly testing machinery of the military (another example that no institution is either good or bad or naturally superior to any other)

 

[oldjones]

The government should have left GM and Chrysler to go bankrupt like Air Canada maybe then they could have restructured their labour.

There you go: It's the government's fault they survived! Always blame the public sector!

 

[Butler1000]

While I can't think of one going back to Rome does the British Royal family count? Long term family run business there.
Also the Hudson Bay company is I believe over 400 years old.

Not to say both haven't been sold out and restructured over the years......

 

[Possum Trot]

There you go: It's the government's fault they survived! Always blame the public sector!

Get back on topic OJ, we were talking about the Ontario Liberal governments wasting of money on the Oakville gas plant, stop wandering off.

Even your blessed NDP is assigning blame on this one.

 

[cye]

This government has consistently made policy decisions heavily weighted to please financial donors and to avoid immediate political consequences. Without real campaign finance reform I wouldn't expect much change in the future. Until campaigns are driven by ideas not contributions the policy process will be the plaything of politicians.

 

[Rockslinger]

How many billion did governments have to pump into GM and Chrysler again?

Damn unions drove American carmakers into bankruptcy. No Japanese carmakers went bankrupt. No unions, no bankruptcy.

 

[cye]

Damn unions drove American carmakers into bankruptcy. No Japanese carmakers went bankrupt. No unions, no bankruptcy.

I would argue it was lack of innovation and out of control medical costs for an aged workforce with no national health care that were the real culprits.

 

[oldjones]

Get back on topic OJ, we were talking about the Ontario Liberal governments wasting of money on the Oakville gas plant, stop wandering off.

Even your blessed NDP is assigning blame on this one.

It wasn't me who introduced the fairytales about the private sector doeing everything better. Nor the NDP, for that matter. IF they are blessed it certainly wasn't my doing, or opinion.

If you're going to be personal, do try to keep up.

 

[red]

Few people believed the McGuinty government's claim that the cancellation of the Oakville gas plant would only cost $40 million. The big question is what is the real cost?

http://www.thestar.com/business/art...nt-cancellation-costs-ballooning-says-analyst

should the cost of this be added to the taxes of everyone in oakville?

 

[Moviefan-2]

It just gets worse.

After swearing up and down that the government had complied with a speaker's ruling to release "all" the documents on the matter by Sept. 24, the Toronto Star is reporting on a "bombshell disclosure" today -- the release of another 20,000 documents.

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/...se-another-13-935-pages-on-oakville-generator

Given that a legislative committee is already being established to determine whether Energy Minister Chris Bentley is in contempt of Parliament, this latest news guarantees this thing will get even messier.

 

[Polaris]

You guys who keep spouting that nonsensical stuff owe us an explanation of how it works.

Let me interrupt for a second, not sure entirely what you guys are talking about.

This is the difference between the private sector and public sector.

If a "private" company goes under, the losers are the shareholders and bondholders.

If a "public" company goes under, Joe Blow who owns it, he loses.

If a government goes under, like Greece, Joe Blow loses big time.

This is a real truth in life IMHO. When the government runs out of money, they will go after private property.

I'm not rich. I cannot afford to give the government any more. Especially during these tough economic times when opportunities are fewer and fewer.

That's why I like Mayor Ford so much. The City of Toronto is out of money. Guess what?

They come after us for more taxes.

Repeat, if a private company goes under, only their shareholders are hurt.

When a government goes under, the little will see 1% sales tax, or vehicle registration tax, to fund whatever that usually left wing government wants to fund.

What really is staggering here, is how regressive a 1% sales tax will be, or that vehicle registration tax was. And no one talks about it. Except Mayor Ford, he stands up for the little guy.

:Eek: