I apologize for dismissing this argument out of hand. I was hasty. Upon further reflection it is quite significant on tolerance.They watch American movies. ...
But you're right that the average Chinese wouldn't have had much dealing with someone who is black, so their experience of black people primarily comes from watching American television and American movies....
Interesting to mention Tibet. I happen to live in little Tibet and they have this belief call Buddhism which seems to have a strong focus on respecting others. They even go so far as separating their objection to the policies of the Chinese government from their interactions with Chinese people. I'm sure they got these ideas on tolerance from observing modern Western culture so it's not applicable to the discussion.... All my friends from Tibet and Xinjiang tell me how grateful they are to live in a country that has such deep and fundamental respect for the culture of others.
Dude I was referring to the american documents that you cited not every single one.Is it your opinion that this is a good description of Locke, Mill, Smith, or Marx? Though I'm quite certain that you're right, that the authors of Déclaration des droits de l'homme et du citoyen had no intention of paying taxes to the King of England!
The form of government we have is an expression of what the population wants, especially in a democracy. We have systems that enshrine human rights because we have a population that fundamentally believes in that. It's not like these governments we have were dropped on us from mars. We made them.I don't dispute that Western governments do a better job of protecting individual rights.
What you seem to miss is that does not mean Western individuals are more tolerant than others.
Probably a mixture of both. Chinese people are pretty racist, in the sense that they think applying racial sterotypes is a perfectly normal and valid way to analyze a situation, and they do it explicitly, and on a regular basis, without even being vaguely aware that others might think that is an inappropriate way to think about things.a) Chinese are so racist that they don't view blacks the way they were meant to be portrayed or,
b) The US media portrays blacks in a negative way.
Which quite clearly says that western culture is full of racial prejudices too....
Certainly their stereotypes of blacks would have come from Western media, and not just recent Western media, but over the past 100 years.
Certainly, the civil rights movement didn't come into full swing here until the 1960's. The ideas that underpinned it were present in the Declaration of Independence, even in the declaration from the French Revolution, but it took a long while for us to work through what those words mean and put them into practice, throwing off the savagery of the past, and we are still throwing it off. There's no disputing that, it's reality.Which quite clearly says that western culture is full of racial prejudices too.
How about 25 centuries behind?...
We're just further along in that process than others are.
Again you are confusing laws for a reflection of the culture.So, which non-European countries do you think offer the same sorts of guarantees of rights and freedoms as Canada, the US, and Britain? Or even troubled France?
Japan, perhaps, but they're sort of running an American installed system there now.
Having a law doesn't mean people believe in it or follow it. Thus naming other countries with similar laws is a moot point as the discussion is not about the laws of the country but the beliefs of the people.So you couldn't name any.
And so have other religious movements. However making it part of a nations founding legal document is a whole different matter. That way it is followed by everyone. Not just bhuddists.How about 25 centuries behind?
Buddhism has been advocating tolerance of others as one of its big precepts since its beginning.
Absolutely, the western culture has not done black people any favours due to their portrayl in media.I apologize for dismissing this argument out of hand. I was hasty. Upon further reflection it is quite significant on tolerance.
If US media gives Chinese people a negative view of blacks then quite clearly it means either:
a) Chinese are so racist that they don't view blacks the way they were meant to be portrayed or,
b) The US media portrays blacks in a negative way.
Of course b) would say something quite clearly about tolerance in the west.
Wow you can speak on the psychology of chinese "racism?!!!?"Probably a mixture of both. Chinese people are pretty racist, in the sense that they think applying racial sterotypes is a perfectly normal and valid way to analyze a situation, and they do it explicitly, and on a regular basis, without even being vaguely aware that others might think that is an inappropriate way to think about things.
Certainly their stereotypes of blacks would have come from Western media, and not just recent Western media, but over the past 100 years or so.
Gone With The Wind was wildly popular in China, even when it was fairly closed, for example. How are blacks portrayed in that?
Can you please stop with this annectdotal/hearsay type evidence? Your experience cannot be extensive enough to make generalization about chinese people.I've heard it from both. I hardly ever hear a 2nd or 3rd generation Chinese say that. Perhaps never.
Can you please stop with this annectdotal/hearsay type evidence? Your experience cannot be extensive enough to make generalization about chinese people.I've heard it from both. I hardly ever hear a 2nd or 3rd generation Chinese say that. Perhaps never.
All three have been subject to legal sanction, so that debate is clearly reflected in our history of governance.It's legal to drink, smoke, have abortions yet not all people agree with these three activities.
I agree with basketcase that your foundation is built on the ASSUMPTION that whites are more tolerant. You know you can't prove it yet you continue.
Oh look, now I'm white. My colour keeps changing from thread to thread!As basketcase also pointed out it's difficult for a white person like yourself to understand racism as it's not been a big part of your upbringing.
Well just tell us your race then?All three have been subject to legal sanction, so that debate is clearly reflected in our history of governance.
It's not an assumption, it's direct personal observation. I know that you aren't just going to believe me, we are going to have to find data. Actually, as it turns out, there is such data out there. After googling for it for awhile, I have found the keyword that seems to be productive in reaching some of it: "interminority racism". That pulls up results.
I haven't had time to go through it and look to see what is there, but in the little searching I did this evening, I have found, for example, that blacks in the US are more likely than any other group to believe that immigrants take jobs away from existing citizens. There's a variety of other indicators.
I am pretty confident that this is a no-brainer, that minorities, in general, will turn out to be more racist, and less tolerant than the white population, called the "host population" generally in the literature. I guess that in the next little while, if I have some time, I'll start compiling the data and we'll see. I don't think you should count your chickens just yet--although there is not a lot of research on the topic, it does turn out that there is some, and I suspect that the results will disappoint you.
Until I can track down some studies, here's a little light reading:
http://www.economist.com/node/9587776?story_id=9587776
Oh look, now I'm white. My colour keeps changing from thread to thread!
