Fuji introduces interesting topics for discussion from time-to-time but the threads lose their focus and a free-for-all develops as other members indulge their need to bash him. I propose that whenever Fuji introduces a topic that is of interest to members, whoever has the need to bash him come to this thread to do so. A link can be put in the original thread to this thread. Perhaps, anticipating the bashing, Fuji will be kind enough to include the link with his original post. That way the original topic under discussion can continue without losing focus. Fuji seems to be willing to respond to the bashers so I am sure that he will respond to them here. That way they can be satiated in their bashing needs and we can have semi-intelligent discussions in the other threads.
The Bash Fuji Thread
- Thread starter havingfun
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Coming from you that's ironic. In any case it's true: We are all inherently hypocritical when it comes to sex. Sw1tch admitted as much in post #94 (others "lie and cheat but they don't conclude from this that the only way to rationalize such behavior is to completely excuse it"), so the disagreement appears to be that I embrace it, while others struggle against themselves.
I respond to his comments. I just don't respond to his childish attacks. So I responded to the only point he really made, which was that others engage in hypocrisy without making it a philosophy, but I did not respond to all his childish, schoolyard accusations that I am a "psychopath" and whatever other immature stuff was in his post.
So, you're hurling one childish insult at me after another, all of them unsubstantiated and baseless, and I'm supposed to be the cyber bully? You'll note I haven't responded in kind. I've restricted myself to pointing out your current, present behavior.
Wipe your chin, and then take a good long look in the mirror.
Here's the thing with Fuji. Whatever you might think of his world view and his moral code (Personally I think it's fucked) he is comfortable with both, and he doesn't see anything wrong with either. This is why bashing him, while fun for some folks, won't make an iota of difference to him. He doesn't feel to need to apologize for anything, because he truly believes his code is right, and because thus far, (apparently) all the ducks in his life are still in a row. It is commendable on a certain level, to be completely comfortable with one's moral code and choices. Whether this worldview was instilled in him through some events in his childhood, or by experiences in relationships, or by him observing human nature and taking home a different value-set than other people, his worldview is pretty much set. He does raise an excellent point about the hypocrisies of some people. While there some moral values that have never changed for me, other values have changed for me, and have evolved (or devolved) out of the choices I've made. I've grown comfortable with the choices I've made, though I know that if other people knew, they would regard some choices as amoral.
Hobbying is the obvious one. At 16, sure I thought prostitution was wrong, that was the domain of crackheads, pimps and unwilling participants. The 16-year old me would never have seen a SP (nor did he have the money). Now, however, I know that hobbying isn't as seedy or destructive as I once thought (though it can be) My morals have shifted. I have full knowledge that if I ever confess my hobbying to my friends and family, that they'll take the same stance that I did at 16, and judge me, probably negatively. I don't agree with that view, but I can understand it. I believe most of the people on this board have similar stories, and any way you cut it, deliberately withholding a portion of your life that you know would negatively impact the way people close to you would view you, is a dishonest act. Yet, most of us have made peace with that fact. Many people are married, here and have made justifications to themselves, and adjustments to make their peace with seeing SPs and cheating on their wives. Some have the rare gift of a woman who understands this part of our lives, and some even have their wife participate with them, but many more don't, and know that if their hobbying was discovered, their wife would at the least be extremely hurt, and at worst, would be filing divorce papers faster than you could say alimony. Yet the people here justify it, alter their code to account for this. Not of us, (a minority I would say) are bad people, or 'psychopaths' or bad husbands, yet we participate in a practice that is considered by society at large to be morally questionable. Obviously fuji has made choices in his life, and adjustments in his worldview to be comfortable with who he is, and I think it's wrong to judge him too harshly (I've done it too in the past). And we all do it, on a daily basis. So I think it's wrong to criticize him for this.
What I don't agree with is his assumption that his view is the only responsible one to have, and if you don't share it, then you're less of a person than he is. That's just flat-out wrong. He starts threads that are ostensibly asking a question, or a poll, and maybe he is actually curious, but it's more just a platform for him to maintain that his worldview is superior. That I can live without. I also believe that cheating on your wife is wrong, on every level, but I fully admit that I've never been married and don't understand how people feel like they have to cheat to preserve the marriage. I think that's a giant cop-out and shirking responsibility, but my view is not necessarily correct for most people. Fuji and I disagree on this issue on a fundamental level, but we're not ever going to agree. Fuji's comfortable with his choices, and I'm comfortable with mine.
Hobbying is the obvious one. At 16, sure I thought prostitution was wrong, that was the domain of crackheads, pimps and unwilling participants. The 16-year old me would never have seen a SP (nor did he have the money). Now, however, I know that hobbying isn't as seedy or destructive as I once thought (though it can be) My morals have shifted. I have full knowledge that if I ever confess my hobbying to my friends and family, that they'll take the same stance that I did at 16, and judge me, probably negatively. I don't agree with that view, but I can understand it. I believe most of the people on this board have similar stories, and any way you cut it, deliberately withholding a portion of your life that you know would negatively impact the way people close to you would view you, is a dishonest act. Yet, most of us have made peace with that fact. Many people are married, here and have made justifications to themselves, and adjustments to make their peace with seeing SPs and cheating on their wives. Some have the rare gift of a woman who understands this part of our lives, and some even have their wife participate with them, but many more don't, and know that if their hobbying was discovered, their wife would at the least be extremely hurt, and at worst, would be filing divorce papers faster than you could say alimony. Yet the people here justify it, alter their code to account for this. Not of us, (a minority I would say) are bad people, or 'psychopaths' or bad husbands, yet we participate in a practice that is considered by society at large to be morally questionable. Obviously fuji has made choices in his life, and adjustments in his worldview to be comfortable with who he is, and I think it's wrong to judge him too harshly (I've done it too in the past). And we all do it, on a daily basis. So I think it's wrong to criticize him for this.
What I don't agree with is his assumption that his view is the only responsible one to have, and if you don't share it, then you're less of a person than he is. That's just flat-out wrong. He starts threads that are ostensibly asking a question, or a poll, and maybe he is actually curious, but it's more just a platform for him to maintain that his worldview is superior. That I can live without. I also believe that cheating on your wife is wrong, on every level, but I fully admit that I've never been married and don't understand how people feel like they have to cheat to preserve the marriage. I think that's a giant cop-out and shirking responsibility, but my view is not necessarily correct for most people. Fuji and I disagree on this issue on a fundamental level, but we're not ever going to agree. Fuji's comfortable with his choices, and I'm comfortable with mine.
The problem Havingfun is that it is frequently the things Fuji posts in those threads which lead to "free-for-alls" not just some perverse desire to vent.
Here are some signs to thwart thread hijackers
To use Warning : Thread hijack in progress, copy line below and insert into your post - remove brackets around [/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT]
([IMG])http://i56.tinypic.com/w0nqjq.jpg
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http://i55.tinypic.com/2r2t3qc.jpg)
To use Warning : Flame war provocation in progress, copy line above and insert into your post - remove brackets around
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http://i52.tinypic.com/a1k8wj.jpg)
To use Attention : Thread topic resumed, copy line above and insert into your post - remove brackets around
LOL! Good one...
This will give the usual suspects a place to meet and trade notes in their never ending quest to best Fuji!....:thumb:
Excellent idea.
This will give the usual suspects a place to meet and trade notes in their never ending quest to best Fuji!....:thumb:
I no longer waste any time arguing / debating with Fuji
Nothing he writes is of interst to me as a result of his lack of morals
Life has a way of dealing with imoral individuals in the long run
Might be because you see the world through a narrow ideological lens, and when you're confronted with facts that disagree with your ideological view--which is frequent--you lapse into mumbling idiocy and lose the ability to think critically.
You're a great example of why viewing the world ideologically is a failure.
I was going to reply to his comment, but I see you did it better! Bravo. I'm a fuji fan!
First off, there is no legal basis to claim that cheating is unacceptable.
As for ethical, what sort of "risk" are you talking about here?
If you are talking about risk of disease unless in cheating you are doing something insane, like bareback anal, the risk is negligible. You have a higher chance of bringing home a disease to the wife by visiting a daycare and having a child sneeze on you. Probably a worse disease. Sure, if you bring home an explicitly sexual disease she's going to clue into your cheating--but the stuff you're likely to bring home is curable, unless you are engaging in things like bareback anal.
If you are talking about psychological/emotional risk--I don't accept that's a risk with any ethical implications, not when it comes to sexual behavior. People engage in sexual relationships knowing that the might get hurt. That's life. Get over it. We're all hypocritical when it comes to sex, and we all know this. We play the game, because we're alive. It's human nature.
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