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Uber and Lyft drivers' median hourly wage is just $3.37, report finds

Charlemagne

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Uber and Lyft drivers' median hourly wage is just $3.37, report finds

Majority of drivers make less than minimum wage and many end up losing money, according to study published by MIT

Sam Levin in San Francisco @SamTLevin
Fri 2 Mar 2018 02.09 GMT Last modified on Fri 2 Mar 2018 17.08 GMT

Uber and Lyft drivers in the US make a median profit of $3.37 per hour before taxes, according to a new report that suggests a majority of ride-share workers make below minimum wage and that many actually lose money.

Researchers did an analysis of vehicle cost data and a survey of more than 1,100 drivers for the ride-hailing companies for the paper published by the Massachusetts Institute of Technology’s Center for Energy and Environmental Policy Research. The report – which factored in insurance, maintenance, repairs, fuel and other costs – found that 30% of drivers are losing money on the job and that 74% earn less than the minimum wage in their states.

The findings have raised fresh concerns about labor standards in the booming sharing economy as companies such as Uber and Lyft continue to face scrutiny over their treatment of drivers, who are classified as independent contractors and have few rights or protections.

“This business model is not currently sustainable,” said Stephen Zoepf, executive director of the Center for Automotive Research at Stanford University and co-author of the paper. “The companies are losing money. The businesses are being subsidized by [venture capital] money … And the drivers are essentially subsidizing it by working for very low wages.”

Drivers earn a median of 59 cents per mile while incurring a median cost of 30 cents per mile, the report said, adding that for nearly a third of drivers, the costs are ultimately higher than the revenue. The paper reported the average driver profit to be $661 per month.

While most drivers employ vehicles for personal use and ride-hailing services, the bulk of the miles they drive are for work, which can lead to significant short-term and long-term costs, the paper said.

Given inevitable costs of maintenance, repair and depreciation, “effectively what you’re doing as a driver is borrowing against the value of your car,” Zoepf said, adding: “It’s quite possible that drivers don’t realize quite how much they are spending.”

Other studies and surveys have found higher hourly earnings for Uber drivers, in part because there are numerous ways to report income and to calculate costs and time and miles spent on the job.

Harry Campbell, founder of the Rideshare Guy, a website that has conducted surveys of drivers, said the finding of a $3.37 median hourly profit seemed a bit low, but noted that new drivers were often surprised by the wages.

“The most common feedback we hear from drivers is they end up earning a lot less than they expected,” said Campbell, who partnered with Zoepf on the surveys used in the paper. “There is a lot of turnover in the industry, and that’s the number one reason I hear from drivers why they are quitting – they are not making enough.”

Campbell pointed out that Uber itself had struggled to properly consider vehicle costs. Last year, the company shut down its US auto-leasing business after discovering it was losing 18 times more money per vehicle than it had previously understood. Some drivers claimed that the leasing program trapped them in debt.

An Uber spokesperson broadly criticized the research in a statement: “While the paper is certainly attention grabbing, its methodology and findings are deeply flawed. We’ve reached out to the paper’s authors to share our concerns and suggest ways we might work together to refine their approach.”

A Lyft spokesperson said in an email, “We have not yet reviewed this study in detail, but an initial review shows some questionable assumptions.”

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/mar/01/uber-lyft-driver-wages-median-report?CMP=twt_gu
 

kkelso

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That does seem a bit low, but not shocking. Like any other performance-driven industry the average is only part of the story.

I know a bunch of Uber drivers (Lyft not so much), the ones who figure it out are doing fine or they wouldn't be doing it any longer. I asked one college student driver just hitting the one year mark how the job had been for him, he replied "it's great if you're smart and terrible if you're dumb".

He went on to detail all the things he learned about how to make good money as a driver. Things like driving at the times when people want to go places, driving in the right neighborhoods, traffic monitoring apps and flight monitoring apps. Many of the drivers I know do side business with regular riders.

A far more interesting study would have been the Median Hourly Wage of Uber & Lyft Drivers Who Continue to Drive After Their First Year. That would cull out the dabblers, the lazy, those not smart enough to figure it out. If the overall average is $3.37 then the veteran average is maybe $15? More if you count side jobs.

The market works when we let it, but it creates winners and losers.

KK
 

wigglee

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to exist, they have to undercut regular cabs, and regular cabs make crap money too. Of course the only people making coin are the American platform owners.
 

kkelso

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to exist, they have to undercut regular cabs, and regular cabs make crap money too. Of course the only people making coin are the American platform owners.
I see your point, but that's life. Some people came into the market and figured out a way to do something for $XX, and offered that as a service, which lasted for a long, long time. After a while some other people came into the market and figured out how to offer a better service for less than $XX.

The people who adapted and are willing to risk and work are doing well, the people who cling to the old way will do less well.

KK
 

sempel

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I spoke with an Uber driver once and he indicated he makes about $20/hour. I don't know what his cost structure is and whether that was $20/hour and then he covers his expenses (gas, service/maintenance, etc.) or whether he makes $20/hour after you factor in the car costs. I assume it's the latter because I don't think anyone would be stupid enough to do a job that pays $4/hour. After a couple of months, your going to do the calculation to see if it's worthwhile and you'll realize it's not. Yes, you can write off the car expenses but either way, not very lucrative.

The biggest problem is your car is experiencing wear/tear/mileage at a higher rate than normal. So while a person may drive 30K per year, you might be running 50-60K per year on your car. So it's going to require more maintenance/service (or the same but shorter times between servicing) and the car will have to be replaced sooner. So instead of you buying a new/used car in 8-10 years, it might be every 5 years. That could be a little more costly.

As usual, I'd like to understand the math. And since the median wage is $3.37, that means half the Uber drivers are making that or below.
 

Zoot Allures

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There is no mention of risk,such as accidents or self injury or killing someone or Uber going under and leaving divers unpaid. Man are those Uber drivers bad businessmen, same goes for parcel delivery in your own vehicle and pizza guys but they do mot mention tips but the study does come from MIT
 

kkelso

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There is no mention of risk,such as accidents or self injury or killing someone. Man are those Uber drivers bad businessmen, same goes for parcel delivery in your own vehicle and pizza guys but they do mot mention tips but the study does come from MIT
I've wondered about this as well, but could not find any reliable studies. One one hand you would drive a lot more, on the other you would develop a higher level of driving skill (as with cab drivers).

KK
 

Occasionally

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to exist, they have to undercut regular cabs, and regular cabs make crap money too. Of course the only people making coin are the American platform owners.
Yup. Classic case of supply and demand.

I think most taxis are shabby, but I still think they got screwed. Taxi drivers have to get the plate and go through a more stringent process, yet somehow Uber comes around and just about anyone can suddenly do it.

However, taxi drivers didn't exactly help. Uber is cheaper for patrons to use, but it wouldn't be so bad for taxi drivers if they kept cars clean. If you ride one of those limo taxos it's typically nice, but for the average taxi driving around it's usually a ratty car that stinks. So if the driver doesn't give a shit, I understand why many people prefer Uber.... cheaper, use an app, and the average car is cleaner.
 

Capital Amatuer

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With conditions, CRA allows something like $0.54/km deduction on business use of a personal car. I did the math once and it costs about $0.54/km to operate a vehicle. If an Uber driver is stuck in traffic, they can't be making money. Look at the per kilometer earning potential rather than the hourly earnings. I conclude Uber is a short term solution to generate quick cash from an asset you already own, but the long term wear and tear on your car will sink you, especially when it comes time to replace it.
 

blueray

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I think most taxis are shabby...

....but it wouldn't be so bad for taxi drivers if they kept cars clean.

....but for the average taxi driving around it's usually a ratty car that stinks.
+1

Toronto cabs and drivers are the worst. I would be glad to never again step in a stinky shitty cab with an ignorant smelly driver.
 

sempel

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With conditions, CRA allows something like $0.54/km deduction on business use of a personal car. I did the math once and it costs about $0.54/km to operate a vehicle. If an Uber driver is stuck in traffic, they can't be making money. Look at the per kilometer earning potential rather than the hourly earnings. I conclude Uber is a short term solution to generate quick cash from an asset you already own, but the long term wear and tear on your car will sink you, especially when it comes time to replace it.
The question though is how much does it end up saving (or putting into the driver's pocket). By writing off the $0.54/km, you save on a certain amount of tax. But you still had to pay the expense.

This article should keep it simple. How much revenue does the Uber driver generate? How much do they keep (a cut goes to Uber)? What are their expenses for the year? Add in depreciation on the vehicle as a theoretical cost and what's left over?

Some Uber drivers work long shifts and during off peak, some only work the peak hours, and location is important WRT demand.

Suppose we take the figure quoted ($0.59 in, $0.30 out), drive 10 miles, make $2.90. Drive 20 miles, $5.80, Drive 40 miles (long trip), $11.60.
 

kkelso

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Yup. Classic case of supply and demand.

I think most taxis are shabby, but I still think they got screwed. Taxi drivers have to get the plate and go through a more stringent process, yet somehow Uber comes around and just about anyone can suddenly do it.

However, taxi drivers didn't exactly help. Uber is cheaper for patrons to use, but it wouldn't be so bad for taxi drivers if they kept cars clean. If you ride one of those limo taxos it's typically nice, but for the average taxi driving around it's usually a ratty car that stinks. So if the driver doesn't give a shit, I understand why many people prefer Uber.... cheaper, use an app, and the average car is cleaner.
I've been spending a good deal of time in NYC this year (new client), and I would say I opt for taxis 4 to 1 over Ubers there. NYC has strict cleanliness guidelines for taxis, so the cars are never filthy and in NYC driving skill and knowledge are a major point of differentiation. One trip almost missing my flight because my Uber driver didn't know the best way to the airport made me a taxi customer.

Now in the burbs, or in almost any other city outside of the deep core, Uber rocks.

KK
 

rhuarc29

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I drove on New Years Eve some time ago in a competition with my brother. If I recall correctly I made around $400 for a dozen hours of driving, which equates to $33/hr. However, almost half of that was extra surge pricing, which means I normally would have made $17 - $19/hour if surge was not in effect...and that's on the busiest day of the year! And not accounting for expenses!!! So yes, I believe the average wage (after expenses) is much less than people think. Some people don't account for gas/maintenance, and I think most people don't account for depreciation. Which is, of course, what Uber and Lyft count on to make it look more lucrative than it is.

The tricks to being successful: (1) be in the right location, (2) target surge...which isn't as easy as you'd think and (3) target peak times. Anything else is just wasting your time, and your vehicle's life. And unless you're in a great market, I wouldn't think for a second of making it a full time gig, nor of leasing a vehicle for this purpose!
 

Smallcock

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I drove on New Years Eve some time ago in a competition with my brother. If I recall correctly I made around $400 for a dozen hours of driving, which equates to $33/hr. However, almost half of that was extra surge pricing, which means I normally would have made $17 - $19/hour if surge was not in effect...and that's on the busiest day of the year! And not accounting for expenses!!! So yes, I believe the average wage (after expenses) is much less than people think. Some people don't account for gas/maintenance, and I think most people don't account for depreciation. Which is, of course, what Uber and Lyft count on to make it look more lucrative than it is.

The tricks to being successful: (1) be in the right location, (2) target surge...which isn't as easy as you'd think and (3) target peak times. Anything else is just wasting your time, and your vehicle's life. And unless you're in a great market, I wouldn't think for a second of making it a full time gig, nor of leasing a vehicle for this purpose!
I concur. This was my experience exactly. I did it in competition/fun with a friend several years ago in NYE.
 

sempel

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I drove on New Years Eve some time ago in a competition with my brother. If I recall correctly I made around $400 for a dozen hours of driving, which equates to $33/hr. However, almost half of that was extra surge pricing, which means I normally would have made $17 - $19/hour if surge was not in effect...and that's on the busiest day of the year! And not accounting for expenses!!! So yes, I believe the average wage (after expenses) is much less than people think. Some people don't account for gas/maintenance, and I think most people don't account for depreciation. Which is, of course, what Uber and Lyft count on to make it look more lucrative than it is.

The tricks to being successful: (1) be in the right location, (2) target surge...which isn't as easy as you'd think and (3) target peak times. Anything else is just wasting your time, and your vehicle's life. And unless you're in a great market, I wouldn't think for a second of making it a full time gig, nor of leasing a vehicle for this purpose!
A few questions if you don't mind about your experience

1) Was it 12 hours of mostly driving or just a few trips and mostly waiting during the twelve hours?
2) If you've done this full time, what are the revenue/expenses for a specific period?
3) I always figured surge pricing was due to demand. But isn't most demand at peak traffic times so although you are being paid more, your trips take longer so it's not as lucrative as one thinks?
 

Samranchoi

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I have heard from a few women that Uber drivers have made them feel uncomfortable by asking personal questions and even asking them out. I have not heard about this in regards to taxi drivers. I think some guys get into Uber just so they can meet people, and in particular, women. Money is not their main motivator.
 

rhuarc29

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Apr 15, 2009
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A few questions if you don't mind about your experience

1) Was it 12 hours of mostly driving or just a few trips and mostly waiting during the twelve hours?
2) If you've done this full time, what are the revenue/expenses for a specific period?
3) I always figured surge pricing was due to demand. But isn't most demand at peak traffic times so although you are being paid more, your trips take longer so it's not as lucrative as one thinks?
1) I drove between 4pm and 4am. I'd split it like this:
a) From about 4 - 6 I'd say about 40 - 50% was driving "on the clock" for people coming home from work, with the rest of the time either being driving to a pick-up or simply waiting.
b) From 6 - 9 was the slowest, with maybe 20-30 % on the clock.
c) From 9 - 10 it started picking up, 50 - 60% on the clock.
d) From 10 - 11:30 was almost constant driving, which still means you're only on the clock ~75% of the time as the rest is driving to the pick-up. Surge pricing also kicked in at this time, up to 2.5x.
e) From 11:30 - 12:30 was moderate, 50 - 60%. Surge pricing disappeared. I imagine this is because everyone was already where they wanted to be for midnight.
f) From 12:30 - 3:00 was a bonanza. Constant driving, and very close pick-ups so maybe 85% on the clock. Surge pricing spiked to 4.5x. One 12 minute fare netted me over $100.
g) From 3 - 4 it quickly died down. I took only one fare during this time, but it was a long one out to the boonies. Which was unfortunate as I had to drive all the way back afterwards. The riders were also little shits, and after 12 hours I was in no mood for it.

2) Only did it the once, but in that one night I believe I put close to 500km on my car.

3) Surge pricing IS due to demand. But no, surge is very lucrative for drivers. In fact, it's really the only way to make decent money. You aren't just paid by kilometer driven. You are also paid by the minute.
When demand is high, not only does surge pricing kick in, but your pick-ups tend to be closer to your location. Which means less time driving off the clock.


A couple other notes:
• It absolutely sucks when you arrive and your riders take forever to come outside. At one point I was waiting for 15 minutes while they said their goodbyes. That's 15 minutes of unpaid time. Nothing is worse than that, especially if you're doing it for a living. Which is why when I take an Uber, I jump in as soon as they arrive. Anything else is an asshole move.
• You'll have all types, from people you can have a good time with too shits you can't stand.
• If you ever want to kick someone out of your car, good luck with that. I think legally you can, but it's a murky area if you drop a drunk person in the middle of nowhere. But legal or not, they may refuse to get out. Then I guess you call the cops? Besides which, most Uber drivers don't have commercial insurance on their vehicles, so do you really want to get the police involved?
• Your riders can cancel at any time during the ride, at which point you're stuck with the above choice.
• Drunk people tend to puke. That'll end your night quick. I was lucky on that front though.
 
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