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Sounds like an admission of guilt

gramage

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preparing to defend yourself is an admission of guilt?

why go through trials then? just charge them and if they get a lawyer, guilty!
 

landscaper

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Fuji the truth is a pliable substance, I only have to point out a number of these posts as evidence
 

gryfin

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gramage said:
preparing to defend yourself is an admission of guilt?

why go through trials then? just charge them and if they get a lawyer, guilty!
I don't know about you, but I don't make a practice of getting myself a lawyer to defend myself against a particular charge before I've been charged without some idea that I've done something that I need protection for.

The Israeli government and military know what they've done.

BTW...I'm not in favor of what you are articulating. I'm all in favor of charges, trials, and fair convictions.
 

gramage

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gryfin said:
I don't know about you, but I don't make a practice of getting myself a lawyer to defend myself against a particular charge before I've been charged without some idea that I've done something that I need protection for.

The Israeli government and military know what they've done.

BTW...I'm not in favor of what you are articulating. I'm all in favor of charges, trials, and fair convictions.
would it be atypical for lawsuits or attempts at criminal charges after this kind of military action? I doubt it.

Why do major corporations employ lawyers full time? because they're all criminals? NO! Because lawsuits and complaints are a normal part of 21st century business and it makes more sense to employ them in advance.

The only suprise is that this wasn't a pre-existing team. If I'm ever put in the situation of running an invasion, I put this together then attack.
 

fuji

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gryfin said:
I don't know about you, but I don't make a practice of getting myself a lawyer to defend myself against a particular charge before I've been charged without some idea that I've done something that I need protection for.
Talk about desperate--you've actually RUN OUT of things to criticize Israel for then?
 

Inferno

Vulvovaginarian
Mar 24, 2002
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Geez, get a grip already, gryfin.

Israel has a conscience. It knows that innocent people were killed and have suffered because of the military action it was forced to undertake, and Israel knew this to be the case from the outset. That's why it took so long to decide to finally attack Hamas - because it knew of the resultant devastation that would be inflicted upon Gaza and Gazans.

During a medical procedure to excise cancerous cells from a body, it is always necessary to remove healthy cells, as well, whether you remove the cancer surgically, or using chemotherapy (which kills many healthy cells). Unfortunately, this is our species' state of technology at the moment. We know of no other ways to get rid of cancer.

Similarly, Israel was put in the position of having to destroy a number of civilian lives and structures in order to eradicate Hamas from Gaza.

I believe - and you obviously disagree - that Israel sincerely tried to limit the number of civilian casualties incurred in the conflict. If they hadn't, the body count could have been much, much higher.

If there were a safer and less invasive way to root out Hamas, you can be sure Israel would have adopted that method. But there isn't, and so Israel had to resort to urban warfare, which always claims collateral damage. C'est la guerre, as the French are fond of saying.

If legal claims arise against Israel as a result of this traumatic but necessary operation, they must be investigated as necessary and defended if possible.

Nothing wrong with making preparations for this.
 
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gryfin

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gramage said:
would it be atypical for lawsuits or attempts at criminal charges after this kind of military action? I doubt it.

Why do major corporations employ lawyers full time? because they're all criminals? NO! Because lawsuits and complaints are a normal part of 21st century business and it makes more sense to employ them in advance.

The only suprise is that this wasn't a pre-existing team. If I'm ever put in the situation of running an invasion, I put this together then attack.
Those are not relevant comparison - corporate operations and war crimes. You are being a little too banal.

Try finding a country that just killed a 1300 people, wounded 5000 and has been accused of using illegal weapons, shooting people surrendering, and attacking UN compounds. Compare that.

I don't think Canada has a team in place to fight similar charges. If they do, perhaps you can point it out to us.
 

gramage

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gryfin said:
I don't think Canada has a team in place to fight similar charges. If they do, perhaps you can point it out to us.
I doubt Canada has a team like this in place because our only military operations are in conjunction with the UN. However if Canada were to go to war and did not have this kind of team in place BEFORE launching an assault on another nation, I would accuse the Canadian government of not doing enough to prepare for the aftermath of the conflict. Complaints are inevitable and must be answered.
 

Quality Time

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Mar 6, 2004
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Legal...smeagal....The reality is that "war crimes" mean nothing to the countries who are on side with the west. They will always find a way out of the charges. You are out to win a war...not lose it...so you do anything that you can. I would suspect that Israel did do some wrong things but it means nothing at the end of the day. The winner gets to write history. It is easy for me to trivilize life and it is not right but that is the way the world works for the people who are in control.

Hamas got a haircut and they tried to use the people as their shield. The answer is simple...make peace and recogize each other's right to exist....no agitation...no war...no people getting hurt. It is interesting listening to Gryfin in that you never hear him place ANY portion of blame at the Hamas door. It will years before Hamas even has a dog house for an office. In reality it is better off that the hardliners were taken out....they are obstacles to peace
 
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Gyaos

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Aug 17, 2001
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Heaven, definately Heaven
gryfin said:
Try finding a country that just killed a 1300 people, wounded 5000 and has been accused of using illegal weapons, shooting people surrendering, and attacking UN compounds. Compare that.
Let me see, how about a terrorist organization? Hamas, for instance. That was easy.

Gyaos.
 

gryfin

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Here's more guilty behavior:

"On Wednesday, Army Radio reported that the IDF had decided not to release the names and pictures of battalion and brigade commanders who participated in Operation Cast Lead in anticipation that international war crimes lawsuits would be filed against IDF officers, who could face prosecution when traveling overseas."

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1232643727091&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull

Sounds more like Argentina or any number of South American countries during the days of military junta's than anything like Canada.
 

gryfin

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Looks like the writing is on the wall for many Israeli warmongers.


"If (Foreign Minister Tzipi) Livni wishes, I can recommend several good lawyers in Belgium," said attorney Avigdor Feldman Thursday. "The fighting in Gaza was too reminiscent of Bosnia. People there were tried for shooting at civilians, schools and UN facilities after that, so the concerns are justified."

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3660451,00.html
 

Quality Time

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Mar 6, 2004
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gryfin said:
If that's the measure, it looks like the Palestinians may have won.

How do you figure that???:eek: Ohhhh...I get it.....maybe a Palestinian school book might write something different that what the rest of the world's kids read

Gryfin....wakeup...help your people's cause by telling them to move on in life instead of living in the past. Time has stood still for the Palestinians for 70 years while the rest of the world has moved into the 21st century
 

gryfin

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I thought Israel was obligated to prosecute war crimes not help cover them up:

"There is particular concern at the Defense Ministry that interviews in the press by officers describing the destruction of homes or harm to civilians in areas where they commanded forces could become "self-incriminating" evidence, used by human rights groups and political groups seeking to bring suits against IDF officers."

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1057964.html

Israel is not exactly taking the high road are they?
 

Quality Time

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Mar 6, 2004
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gryfin said:
I thought Israel was obligated to prosecute war crimes not help cover them up:

"There is particular concern at the Defense Ministry that interviews in the press by officers describing the destruction of homes or harm to civilians in areas where they commanded forces could become "self-incriminating" evidence, used by human rights groups and political groups seeking to bring suits against IDF officers."

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1057964.html

Israel is not exactly taking the high road are they?

Who cares whether they are taking the high road or not. I'll bet that nothing comes out this...nada....nothing. Those two have been at it for 70 years.....who has had war crimes convictions painted to them?
 

The Prince

The Prince
Jan 13, 2009
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Here and There
Simple

Simple solution. Stop hiding out amongst your own women and children and they will stop getting kablasted. If you want to shoot rockets at innocent people then take the ramifications like men and AVOID, yes AVOID your own women and children. Now of course we won't suggest stop shooting the rockets as that would be far to civilized but stop hiding out with the KIDS!!!!!
It doesn't seem that complicated.
Rule 17-No woman and children!
 
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