Retail Gas Prices

[Yuri]

I am sure there have been posts pertaining to this topic, but I am extremely mad at these money grabing, greedy, ruthless, heartless, sleaze-bag oil/gas companies, they must sit all day in their boardrooms and discuss who else to blame for higher prices....lets see, they have used

1. Arabs-Middle East
2. Weather
3. Supple & Demand
4. China
5. India
6. Auitomotive market (ie. not enough fuel efficent cars)
7. A fire at a plant (thats bullshit)
8. The Free Market System

To end this madness lets have our Political Partners (ie. thats a joke) revise/change the Federal Competions Act to allow for greater competition, but that won't happen as Politicians need their Pension Plans boasted from Private money from the oil giants.....

 

[carguy34]

It's funny how alot of the gas stations that are out of gas are also out of premium ! I'm pretty sure they have premium but they won't sell because they would have to sell it at the regular gas price. Last night went to get gas and I asked the attendent when prices were going back to "normal", since the strike and the refinery are working again, and he told me to that gas was going up 2 cents today, sure enough this morning gas is 104.6 !! Funny how the guy at the Esso station knew that the prices at Petro were going up !! lol

Something has to be done !! I say we start verbally taking out our fustrations on the gas bar attendents.

 

[tboy]

Yeah, I agree 100% with this. It was even on the news how the gas production/distribution has returned to "normal" yet the prices haven't gone done one iota.

Same as it is funny how the day before every long weekend the gas prices jump as much as 20% yet it has NOTHING to do with the fact that it is a long weekend approaching and the gas companies don't collude together to set the price (because that would be illegal).

I think it was cityTV who ran a story about how this "fire" and subsequent distribution problems really only accounted for less than 1% of the gas distribution in Ontario....

 

[hambone]

I agree with the above posters; however there is still one Esso station in my area that does not have any gasoline.

 

[carguy34]

I agree with the above posters; however there is still one Esso station in my area that does not have any gasoline.

I bet you they had premium but just didn't want to sell it at regular gas price
.

 

[FOOTSNIFFER]

That idiot Donna Cansfield, the industry minister last year, was warned a year ago, by the Independant Gas Retailers Assoc., about the slim margins between supply and demand of gasoline and how the situation was worsening.

Her response: She consulted with the majors and they told her they were "comfortable" with the inventory margins of safety.....she's either incompetent or a naive bonehead but that's your government at work. In the U.S., where the people are less gullible and where government is forced to be somewhat more competent or else they're canned, the majors are obliged to forward supply and demand data to the state governments and any shortfalls in supply are made up for by importing from neighbouring states. In other words, no funny business and that's why prices there adjust to changes in the crude markets quicker.

Another way that a country which thinks itself to be 'better', isn't.

 

[carguy34]

In the U.S., where the people are less gullible and where government is forced to be somewhat more competent or else they're canned,

are we talking about the same US ? competent ?????? lol Haven't the gas prices gone up in the US this past week also ?? I guess they had refinery fires and a railroad strike too !!

 

[bananaman]

Gas is still cheap compared to any European country I have been in. Really, we pay more for a litre of water than a litre of gas.

 

[oldjones]

That idiot Donna Cansfield, the industry minister last year, was warned a year ago, by the Independant Gas Retailers Assoc., about the slim margins between supply and demand of gasoline and how the situation was worsening.

Her response: She consulted with the majors and they told her they were "comfortable" with the inventory margins of safety.....she's either incompetent or a naive bonehead but that's your government at work. In the U.S., where the people are less gullible and where government is forced to be somewhat more competent or else they're canned, the majors are obliged to forward supply and demand data to the state governments and any shortfalls in supply are made up for by importing from neighbouring states. In other words, no funny business and that's why prices there adjust to changes in the crude markets quicker.

Another way that a country which thinks itself to be 'better', isn't.

You're not suggesting that government regulation—like you describe in the US—is the answer, are you?

 

[BuffNaked]

Gas is still cheap compared to any European country I have been in. Really, we pay more for a litre of water than a litre of gas.

Maybe I should fill up my car with water? What does that have to do with anything.

 

[friendz4evr]

It's higher here in the U.S. also, and I'm not aware of any fire in a refinery.

 

[bananaman]

Maybe I should fill up my car with water? What does that have to do with anything.

You can if you want. My point is that we are all complaining about the price of a product, that by world standards, is still very inexpensive.

The price fixing argument I agree with. Clearly the gas companies are engaged in illegal behaviour that would be very difficult to prove in court. (It must be difficult, or I would think they would have been challenged by consumer groups like CAA)

Reduce your gas usage. Buy a Vespa or a Smart car. Walk, take the TTC. The best way to reduce the price of a commodity is to reduce demand.

 

[FOOTSNIFFER]

You're not suggesting that government regulation—like you describe in the US—is the answer, are you?

What I described isn't government regulation; actually by mandating fuel standards that differ significantly from that of our neighbours in Michigan and New York state, supply shortages give leverage over consumers to the majors, and advantage that they couldn't ever produce in a properly functioning market with free competition. There are storage tanks full of refined product just over the borders that the Indepentdant petroleum retailers would love to get a hold of, but the government forbids them from supplying the market.....you explain why, because I can't.

And yes, Cansfield was apprised of just these facts, and she did nothing about them. As a government minister why wouldn't you do something about such a tenuous fuel situation...like maybe relaxing some of the standards for the impotation of gasoline from the US in the event of an abrupt shortage of fuel due to unforeseen circumstances? Fuel in the U.S. is hardly substandard. What are ministers there for, if not to plan around and spare us from the effects of such unlikely events?

 

[oldjones]

…edit… In the U.S., where the people are less gullible and where government is forced to be somewhat more competent or else they're canned, the majors are obliged to forward supply and demand data to the state governments and any shortfalls in supply are made up for by importing from neighbouring states. In other words, no funny business …edit…

Sorry, if it ain't the various state govs, doing the "obliging" regarding shortfalls, what are they doing w/ that data? It sure sounds like government regulation the way you describe it.

Immediately above this post, you move onto importation as the answer to Ontario's supply problem—and a non-answer to the question of government regulation in the US—but the real problem here is a transportation one. Even if an Ontario Minister had the power to change federal import standards, if they can't move the gasoline we already have in the country, how were they gonna bring enough of it across the Peace Bridge and the Ambassador bridge to make a difference in Ontario?

 

[tboy]

To answre a couple of questions:

Upper new york buys much of it's gasoline from Ontario. Smoking Joe's advertises this fact on their commercials. So importing it FROM the US isn't really feasible as we'd just be reimporting what we exported. I can bet you every cent I had that the gas suppliers didn't miss ONE shipment over the boarder due to this "shortage". It really bugs me that as a country, we can export fuel and have the importing country sell it cheaper than we can buy it for.

As for gasoline being "very inexpensive". As compared to what other high demand product? Sure, compare it to coke, pepsi, cough syrup etc it is cheap in comparison but then again, we don't use 10 litres per day of either.

The best way to reduce the price of THIS commodity is not to reduce usage because that isn't the main reason the cost is so high. I would say ban speculating on this commodity. I can't recall which newspaper it was in but it stated in black and white the main reason gas is expensive now is due to the speculation that went on just after Katrina.

As for gas being higher in the US. Sure, New York just reported a 20 cent per GALLON increase. Well, to explain it to our american friends, we experienced a 20 cent per LITRE increase which is about 90.8 cents per gallon.

One thing that really pisses me off about the gas situation is that we Canadians have enough fuel reserves, and enough sources to supply our needs for many generations to come. I believe the oil sands in Alberta supposedly have enough oil/fuel to supply our current needs, plus the forcasted increases yearly, for the next 300 years or something to that effect. Yet as Canadians we don't or aren't able to reap the benefits of having this natural resource.

This also goes for electricity in Quebec. They have so much hydro electric supplied electricity that they supply much of New York state and I think they export about 80% of what they generate. But do Quebecers reap the benefits of this windfall? NO. They actually pay higher taxes to pay for the developement of the hydro electric producing generators as well as pay more for their electricity than the rest of canada (at least Ontario).

Anyone else remember last year (I think it was) where every Albertan received a $500.00 cheque back from the Alberta Government because of the surplus of oil income? What does THAT tell you? If they gave back $500.00 can you imagine just how much of a surplus it was? Cuz we all know that once governments get their hands on money, they NEVER voluntarily give it back.....

 

[roxyfan]

We are a bunch of spoiled north americans...and somewhat stupid as well. People complain about $1 a litre gasoline...and yet think nothing of paying a lot more for bottled water. How much does it cost to bottle water...then look at all the work the oil guys do to get the oil out of the ground, process it, transport it and get it into your car. Stop complaining and change your habits,...bunch of whiners!

 

[Guy7]

The present Govt. has failed to control retail prices of Gas, since the time they took the charge. The innocent and common man in Canada is suffering tremendeously due to high prices of Gas, its the duty of the Govt. to provide essential items to public at a control prices, if one refinery has gone out of production, so what, the Govt. should make arrangements to supply Gas at reasonable prices, simply disappointed with the affairs, & the same has cuased great burden on the pockets of a common man. Hope everyone gets some relief soon, prices of gas has gone down even in under developed third world countries, whereas in Canada its population is still suffering due to high gas prices, what a shame!

 

[Moraff]

The present Govt. has failed to control retail prices of Gas, since the time they took the charge. The innocent and common man in Canada is suffering tremendeously due to high prices of Gas, its the duty of the Govt. to provide essential items to public at a control prices, if one refinery has gone out of production, so what, the Govt. should make arrangements to supply Gas at reasonable prices, simply disappointed with the affairs, & the same has cuased great burden on the pockets of a common man. Hope everyone gets some relief soon, prices of gas has gone down even in under developed third world countries, whereas in Canada its population is still suffering due to high gas prices, what a shame!

I'll pass on arguing whether gasoline is an "essential item" or not.

But when in recent history has government controlled the retail price of gasoline? Why put the blame solely on the current slate?

Okay, you believe that the government should step in and somehow increase the gas flow without (of course) increasing the price to the consumer at the pumps.

Well, that means tax subsidies to the people supplying that extra gas. Where do you think those subsidy dollars will come from? That's right, our taxes, which means either; a) our taxes will go up b) something else that the government funds will no longer be funded.

Don't get me wrong, I hate the high gasoline prices too, but gasoline companies are in business to make a profit, not to provide cheap gasoline.

If the government has to get involved at all, I would rather it be something like the board that governs the natural gas market. Prices would then be a little more stable rather than fluctuating throughout the week and always up on long weekends.

 

[tboy]

Well Moraff, there is such a thing as profits and then there's profiteering (which is illegal in Canada). This current state of affairs reminds me of the blackout we had a few years back and I think it was Mayor Mel who said that anyone caught profiteering from the situation would be charged to the fullest extent of the law.

I wonder if you (Moraff) would feel the same way if you needed insulin and there was a dramatic increase in diabetics so the price quadrupled.....

As for government involvement in fuel production: Our government sticks their nose in every aspect of our lives now so why should this industry be any different? I will answer that for you: they don't WANT cheap gas because they reap a windfall whenever gas prices go up so there is NO way they would regulate or limit the retail prices.

 

[bananaman]

The government has no more business regulating gasoline prices than regulating the price of bread.

It's supply and demand and capitalism at work. If you don't like it, feel free to move to Cuba or reduce your consumption. My preference is to reduce consumption.