Rape accusations shake Duke University!!!

[zanner69]

Duke men's lacrosse team.

A North Carolina Central University student who worked as a private party dancer claims she was raped and showered with racial epithets by three men at a party organized by three captains of the team and attended by many members of the nationally-ranked Duke squad, police say.

The players have told school officials the assault did not occur.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/lacrosse/2006-03-29-duke-fallout_x.htm

a black eye for such a great and prestigious school.

but I heard that last week, DNA samples were taken from 46 members of the lacrosse team. Investigators are trying to identify at least three men suspected of raping and beating the woman, who was hired to dance at a party.

I'll just wait and see what the evidence is since I've heard many similar allegations before that have turned out to be false.

 

[GlavaMan]

A lacrosse team has 46 players on it?

 

[zanner69]

Duke Lacrosse Captain's Statement

The following statement was issued today by the Captains of the Duke University Men’s Lacrosse Team

“The captains of the team met this morning with President Brodhead, and expressed sincere regret over the lapse in judgment in having the party on March 13 which has caused so much anguish for the Duke community and shame to our families and ourselves.

“We also stated unequivocally that any allegation that a sexual assault or rape occurred is totally and transparently false.

“The team has cooperated with the police in their investigation. We have provided authorities with DNA samples. The understanding is that the results of the DNA testing will be available sometime next week. The DNA results will demonstrate that these allegations are absolutely false.

“Because of the intense emotions surrounding these allegations, we feel it is in the best interest of the University, the community and our families that the team should not play competitively until the DNA results verify our unequivocal denial of these allegations.”

good to see the boys are sticking together for now!! and nice statement drafted by the lawyers!!!

 

[RTRD]

The DA...

...has said he has evidence beyond what DNA would prove, and that he doesn't need the DNA proof.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/news/story?id=2390981

This is an interesting read regarding the cultural issue at play here...

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/columns/story?id=2392159&lpos=spotlight&lid=tab2pos1

I'm some what mixed in my mind on this....on the one hand, false accusation of rape - especially where athletes are concerned - are nothing new. On the other, athletes going too far is nothing new either.

I can imagine a situation where the party and boys got out of hand, were very rude, said on did things that we very inappropriate (a bunch of drunk white southern frat boys using racial slurs when talking to and referring to a Black stripper? No way......no....can't be) and the girl decided "fuck this...I'm out of here and I am going to fix these fuckers"

But...I can also imagine a bunch of drunk and RICH white southern frat boys deciding that a stripper...especially a Black one...was their property to use as the saw fit. The air of privilege and entitlement is very thick with wealthy whites in the U.S. South, and elitism doesn't take much to trickle in racism.

There are some questions...on both sides. Why one girl and not the other, and what was the other doing during all this? Did she run for her life? If so...did she tell police?

Why did the girl leave without her money unless she did feel she was in danger, and how did she lose those fingernails if it wasn't in a fight?

And...if this story is totally bogus, why did these guys run and get lawyers and do so much obvious colluding? Why not just come forward and tell the truth, individually? No one has been charged with anything yet...

The jury is still out on this (pun intended), but if I had to bet money, I'd say the behavior to date sounds ALOT like that of guilty rich white kids....

 

[the rusty tromb]

If these guys are proven guilty the school might want to think about changing the athletic teams nickname from the Blue Devils to the White Devils.

 

[Phiber Optik]

i dunno i think SOMETHING must have happend if this woman is making a claim of rape against this many men. I mean someone is more likely to lie if there are few witnesses and it's his word vs hers etc. But 40 some odd people it's not likely someone is going to cry wolf.

am i way off base here?

 

[spiff]

Cause thats what you do...

And...if this story is totally bogus, why did these guys run and get lawyers and do so much obvious colluding? Why not just come forward and tell the truth, individually? No one has been charged with anything yet...

As soon as the story broke or the accusation was made, get a lawyer even if it is baseless. Cause thats what you do in this day and age......

 

[frankcastle]

Obviously the guys have something to hide if they're sticking together. Personally I wouldn't lie for a rapist. I don't care if he's a teammate to me rapists are the lowest of the low. Well okay maybe the lawyer that defends them is lower.

 

[RTRD]

That...

These players are not from the south. Some are from Canada and a bunch are from New York.

...is somewhat incidental.

They live in the south, go to a southern university, and belong to a essentially a franternity.

Young men take to the environment around them like sponges...

 

[RTRD]

I agree...

As soon as the story broke or the accusation was made, get a lawyer even if it is baseless. Cause thats what you do in this day and age......

...if it is something of a "he said, she said". But in a group of 40?

Obviously some of the guys (37? The story is that 3 did the rape) know the truth. If you KNOW you didn't do it...what is the harm in telling the police what they want to know when there are 36 other witness to THE TRUTH?

Unless the truth ain't pretty, and you and your frat buddies (umm...lacrosse team) have been counselled to clam up.

And...BTW...why do so many of them have the SAME lawyer? Maybe one of the rich guilty kids hired the best legal gun in town, and then that guy / gal told the rest of them that they would go down too unless the story was all the same and they were all represented by the same lawyer.

Again - only 3 are "accused" - 37 are not. If you didn't do the deed, then what do you have to fear from the truth?

The more I think about it, the more something smells fishy....poor girl.

 

[RTRD]

Everyone needs and deserves a lawyer...

Obviously the guys have something to hide if they're sticking together. Personally I wouldn't lie for a rapist. I don't care if he's a teammate to me rapists are the lowest of the low. Well okay maybe the lawyer that defends them is lower.

..and a vigorous defense - else we have a police state.

But beyond that high minded principle, I agree with you 100%. it isn't he said, she said. It is she said and 40 guys appear to have nothing to say. Bullshit.

 

[zanner69]

well we are waiting for the results from the DNA samples.


but the school is also under the gun:

University officials had been aware of the allegations of rape and assault against members of the school’s top-ranked lacrosse team since March 14, but for nearly two weeks, no one from either athletics or administration made any public response about the incident.

and it seems we have a witness

A next-door neighbor told the paper that he personally witnessed white men verbally abusing the women with racist slurs as they tried to leave. As they were approaching their car, one of the men from the house came over to them and apologized for the racist abuse.


http://www.workers.org/2006/us/duke-0413/

 

[xdog]

I love when people generalize

They live in the South so they must be rednecks.
Only guilty people hire lawyers.
A woman would never make a false rape claim.
White people always treat black people like shit.
Come on people. How can we take sides? We don't know what really happened. Someone askes how her fake nails could have come off? Fake nails can be removed easily and pain-free. If the evidence is so obvious, why would they need DNA tests for all 46 people rather than the 3 alleged rapists?
Why was 1 player's DNA not tested? Why didn't the neighbour who heard people yelling at the girl hear them raping her? why did they only rape 1 girl? It seems that a lot of the same people who are standing up for this girl are the same ones who stood up for Kobe in his alleged rape incident. By the way, before anyone jumps down my throat or calls me racist(an over-used word IMO), I tended to believe Mr.Bryant more than the alleged rape victim in that incident.


X

 

[xdog]

By the way

I wonder if sales of Duke lacrosse clothing will increase along with their street cred?
I remember back in university when a friend of mine was charged along with 3 other members of a hockey team were charged with rape. It was later found to be untrue, but their reputations had already been affected. Luckily in this case all parties were of 1 particular race, so there were no charges of racism or any other hate crime. Do you ever question why race is mentioned when people of different backgrounds are involved? Are we so hung up on race that it affects every decision we make? Like Morgan Freeman said"racism will end when we stop talking about it".

X

 

[zanner69]

They live in the South so they must be rednecks.
Only guilty people hire lawyers.
A woman would never make a false rape claim.
White people always treat black people like shit.
Come on people. How can we take sides? We don't know what really happened. Someone askes how her fake nails could have come off? Fake nails can be removed easily and pain-free. If the evidence is so obvious, why would they need DNA tests for all 46 people rather than the 3 alleged rapists?
Why was 1 player's DNA not tested? Why didn't the neighbour who heard people yelling at the girl hear them raping her? why did they only rape 1 girl? It seems that a lot of the same people who are standing up for this girl are the same ones who stood up for Kobe in his alleged rape incident. By the way, before anyone jumps down my throat or calls me racist(an over-used word IMO), I tended to believe Mr.Bryant more than the alleged rape victim in that incident.


X

xdog, obviously there are two sides to the story -the players have decided through the advice of their counsel not to talk and that's their right.

as for your comment about the neighbour and hearing "them" "rape" her - her statment was that she was taken into a bathroom in the house plus I'm assuming there was loud music being played so I'm not sure if anyone from the outside could hear.

 

[Back Burner]

The Duke Lacrosse Coach resigned today and their season was cancelled.

 

[RTRD]

Well....

They live in the South so they must be rednecks.
Only guilty people hire lawyers.
A woman would never make a false rape claim.
White people always treat black people like shit.
Come on people. How can we take sides? We don't know what really happened. Someone askes how her fake nails could have come off? Fake nails can be removed easily and pain-free. If the evidence is so obvious, why would they need DNA tests for all 46 people rather than the 3 alleged rapists?
Why was 1 player's DNA not tested? Why didn't the neighbour who heard people yelling at the girl hear them raping her? why did they only rape 1 girl? It seems that a lot of the same people who are standing up for this girl are the same ones who stood up for Kobe in his alleged rape incident. By the way, before anyone jumps down my throat or calls me racist(an over-used word IMO), I tended to believe Mr.Bryant more than the alleged rape victim in that incident.
X

Let's see...

"They live in the South so they must be rednecks."

I don't think anyone said that. What *I* said was that elitism and racism are pervasive (relatively...and no, I did not say "relatively" the first time). Now, the reason *I* know this is because I am Black, I am an American, and I have in fact spent lots of time in the US South, where some of my family resides. Now, since a third party has come forward to say that they heard all of the racial taunts and slurs, I think this one is closed.

Only guilty people hire lawyers.

I don't think anyone said that either. What I DID question is why one would need a lawyer if there are literially DOZENS of witnesses to what happened, all of whom are prejudiced in your favor. Beyond that, why would you hire the SAME lawyer as everyone else, unless collusion was planned - which strikes ME as unnecessary in a case with so many witness...unless there was something you wanted to hide.

Someone askes how her fake nails could have come off? Fake nails can be removed easily and pain-free.

This is correct - IF you have the special chemicals to dissolve the glue that attached them. Otherwise it hurts like hell. Now, I'm going to assume that this young woman did not plan on removing only 4 nails, and then walking around the rest of the night with the rest of them on...so I am prepared to "take sides" and assume she didn't intend for them to come off, pain free or otherwise.

Why was 1 player's DNA not tested?

That one player was Black. The alleged victim said her attackers were white. No need.

Why didn't the neighbour who heard people yelling at the girl hear them raping her?

What does a rape sound like? I'm guessing it sounds like yelling. Besides, the girl has stated the rape took place in a bathroom - presumably behind a closed door.

why did they only rape 1 girl?

That actually is a good question - but I'm guessing that the 3 who were scum enough to have raped the first had their fill at that point, and the others weren't as equally sad sacks of shit. That said, I actually do consider this a legitmate question...why one versus the other, and what was the other doing when this took place.

It seems that a lot of the same people who are standing up for this girl are the same ones who stood up for Kobe in his alleged rape incident.

Guilty as charged. Your point? (I think I know, but please...feel free...)

 

[RTRD]

Based on the details to date...

Glad your not on the jury! You have them guilty before they have even been charged.

...and what I know of the culture - yes, I believe them to be guilty. Just like the several people on this board "convicted" those Black kids of raping that white girl in that school a few months back, or who were perpared to send every immigrant of color in Canada off on a boat when that girl was shot on Yonge street.

Actually - not "just like". Because I did raise the possibilty of a false accusation, and truth be told, I still am wondering about that based on the additional details (racial slurs overheard by a 3rd party, etc.). In my first post I laid out exactly how I could see a false accusation being made, and I now have more reason to think that could be the case as well.

The thing is though, they are BEHAVING as though they are guilty. Again, I maintain that if you are in a "he said / she said" where you are either guilty or innocent, yeah, you better get a lawyer. But why would FORTY guys need a lawyer when only THREE are accused of rape? What do the other 37 need a lawyer for? If you know you didn't do it, just tell the truth. Pesumably 36 other people know you didn't do it as well....unless you either DID do it, or protecting someone who did.

All IMHO....which is what this is all about right? There actuall is no jury selection taking place here....right?

 

[xdog]

Wow..awareness of a culture

means that they are guilty. That sounds just a little bit prejudicial to me. The other 37 need a lawyer because they were present when a alleged crime took place. They could be seen as being aiding and abetting a crime. I am surprised that they are using only 1 lawyer. But then again, some white people aren't rich and smart and can't afford their own. I say this sarcastically in case anyone is not sure.
I also thought that Kobe was innocent in his situation. I thought the alleged victim was only after money. The reasons that I thought that Kobe was innocent had nothing to do with his skin color.
I am also aghast about the comments that members made about shipping people out of this country after the recent shootings. I feel that all citizens of this country should be treated equally and with respect irregardless of their background. My only reason for commenting on this story was to make people think about their reactions to situations going on around us.
We need to be more positive and not judge people because they look different. I think all racial groups need to take a step back and think before responding to events that happen. Would they act different if the victim or perp were of a differnet color? If so, then look within yourself and ask why you feel that way. If these guys are guilty, then punish them according to the law. If not, let them get on with their lives. Hopefully, the victim(if she was violated in any manner) can also recover physically and emotionally.


X

 

[xdog]

Btw

check out the article by Jason Whitlock at espn.com Very informative. I would have to say I agree with what he says.