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Prostate surgury does not save lives......star article..

blackrock13

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Jun 6, 2009
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Never really been the claim, but it is one course of action against the disease.

As the old Irish proverb goes, just because you're paranoid, it doesn't mean you can't die from Prostate cancer.
 

nottyboi

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May 14, 2008
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Never really been the claim, but it is one course of action against the disease.

As the old Irish proverb goes, just because you're paranoid, it doesn't mean you can't die from Prostate cancer.

really? So doctors have been telling patients, it won't do any good, but I can rip it out for you?
 

train

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Jul 29, 2002
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Another slow news day at the Star. This was news 2 months ago everywhere else.
 

oldjones

CanBarelyRe Member
Aug 18, 2001
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What it means is that our understanding of how to deal with this illness is changing.
But what we really need to change is the unthinking panic reaction that demands, "OMG! CANCER!! FIX ME!! NOW!!!!"
 

danmand

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Nov 28, 2003
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But what we really need to change is the unthinking panic reaction that demands, "OMG! CANCER!! FIX ME!! NOW!!!!"
I disagree completely. All cancers must be taken seriously, and the OHIP way of taking 6 month before treatment is not the answer. That said, we have to realize that there are many different forms of cancer and many different treatments.

It happens that 50% of all males over 50 have some malignant (cancer) cells in their prostate. The treatment for the overwhelming majority is "monitor and wait", and very few needs agressive treatment, and even fewer dies from it.

Most other cancers need early detection and prompt treatment for survival.
 

oldjones

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Aug 18, 2001
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Sorry dan, I must protest. I never suggested not taking cancers seriously, nor did the article. My point, and my words were that "…the unthinking panic reaction that demands, "OMG! CANCER!! FIX ME!! NOW!!!!"' needs to be avoided. So does, "OMG!! NOT THE KNIFE!!" for that matter. Quick fixes and panic reactions, whether demanded or offered, no matter how seriously, seldom cure anything in any field.

The study in the article showed that surgery and watch and wait had the same death rates over the ten years after the early cancers were detected in both groups. The Star's report certainly leaves open the possibility that every single surgical patient might have died in the next year had they refused their operation. The ones who agreed to watch and wait (the article comment on the reluctance of many) might have self-selected because their cancers didn't sound so bad. The newspaper's not clear.

But the lesson we should take from it is nothing at all like, 'we needn't be serious about cancer'. It's that we do need to be thoughtful about deciding what to do. We need to teach ourselves not to jump to conclusions or to panic, but to carefully weigh the pros and cons of our lives and of the treatment we trust the experts to provide. As always we need to ensure that trust was earned legitimately. We are the ones at risk, not the docs.
 

ducttape

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Apr 21, 2005
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The Star's report certainly leaves open the possibility that every single surgical patient might have died in the next year had they refused their operation. The ones who agreed to watch and wait (the article comment on the reluctance of many) might have self-selected because their cancers didn't sound so bad. The newspaper's not clear.
IIRC it was a randomized trial, so that shouldn't have been an issue. However, I don't know how many who were randomized to "watch and wait" subsequently bailed on the trial and found sombody to cut out their prostates.
 

danmand

Well-known member
Nov 28, 2003
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Sorry dan, I must protest. I never suggested not taking cancers seriously, nor did the article. My point, and my words were that "…the unthinking panic reaction that demands, "OMG! CANCER!! FIX ME!! NOW!!!!"' needs to be avoided. So does, "OMG!! NOT THE KNIFE!!" for that matter. Quick fixes and panic reactions, whether demanded or offered, no matter how seriously, seldom cure anything in any field.

The study in the article showed that surgery and watch and wait had the same death rates over the ten years after the early cancers were detected in both groups. The Star's report certainly leaves open the possibility that every single surgical patient might have died in the next year had they refused their operation. The ones who agreed to watch and wait (the article comment on the reluctance of many) might have self-selected because their cancers didn't sound so bad. The newspaper's not clear.

But the lesson we should take from it is nothing at all like, 'we needn't be serious about cancer'. It's that we do need to be thoughtful about deciding what to do. We need to teach ourselves not to jump to conclusions or to panic, but to carefully weigh the pros and cons of our lives and of the treatment we trust the experts to provide. As always we need to ensure that trust was earned legitimately. We are the ones at risk, not the docs.
You misunderstood my post, maybe I was not clear enough. The main point I was making was that there are many types of cancer. One type, prostate cancer, does not normally require drastic action. Most other cancers do.

I have personal experience with throat cancer. The doctors here would have taken 3-6 month before treatment. I said "OMG! CANCER!! FIX ME!! NOW!!!!" and flew to the Mayo clinic the day after I was diagnosed, and the cancer was surgically removed the following day. That is almost 6 years ago.
 

ducttape

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Apr 21, 2005
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same think about colonoscopy I think... You have a greater chance of dying from internal bleeding or from infection when doctors try to pluck out polyps etc.
You are mistaken.
 

GG2

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Apr 8, 2011
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I have personal experience with throat cancer. The doctors here would have taken 3-6 month before treatment. I said "OMG! CANCER!! FIX ME!! NOW!!!!" and flew to the Mayo clinic the day after I was diagnosed, and the cancer was surgically removed the following day. That is almost 6 years ago.
Brutal. You would have died waiting for treatment in Canada.

This is why it's important that America's healthcare system doesn't change into one that mirrors Canada's.

Sure, our healthcare stats may look fine, but it's because many people like you opt for life saving treatment south of the border rather than here.
 

danmand

Well-known member
Nov 28, 2003
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Brutal. You would have died waiting for treatment in Canada.

This is why it's important that America's healthcare system doesn't change into one that mirrors Canada's.

Sure, our healthcare stats may look fine, but it's because many people like you opt for life saving treatment south of the border rather than here.
I am strongly in favour of universal health care. The critical mistake Canada (as the only country in the free world) has made, is to disallow private health care.
 
Ashley Madison
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