Police beating justified??

[spaman]

No. Police can only use enough force as is necessary- if it becomes a beating then it's excessive and wrong.

ok RED you tell me how to bring this situation under control.

 

[wilbur]

The problem is that people in extreme psychotic episodes or under the influence of certain drugs can exhibit enormous strength and pain tolerance, requiring more than 2 people. There are many reports of people like this being shot and not even flinching, breaking the restraints on hospital beds, running on broken legs, etc. If they ask for assistance from the public and members of the public get injured while assisting, the cops are in for a lawsuit.

Police are not supposed to be robots. They have to assess the situation and apply the appropriate response, as every situation is different. This guy is on the floor resisting arrest. He's not running around with a cleaver. With the help of a couple able bodied men otherwise gawking at the scene, he can easily be subdued. You seem to be advocating an extreme response.... just in case he decides all of a sudden to start acting like a ninja. We expect police officers to use their judgements and exercise a measured response, commensurate with their 6 figure salaries.

 

[AK-47]

With the help of a couple able bodied men otherwise gawking at the scene, he can easily be subdued

But what if during that struggle the suspect gets a hold of a cops gun??

 

[red]

Never? really? Never ever?



When a naked man is chasing a woman through an alley with a butcher knife and a hard-on, I figure he isn't out collecting for the Red Cross.


I guess pigs should engage with him and find out why he feels violated from society.

Perhaps you don't comprehend the meaning of the word beating? You obviously did not read my second post in this thread. Go back and read it and then we will talk

 

[red]

ok RED you tell me how to bring this situation under control.

Read my post.

 

[spaman]

No. Police can only use enough force as is necessary- if it becomes a beating then it's excessive and wrong.

this one?. for the love of god with all the force they used they still could not get a handle on the situation. Explain to me how you would handle it?

 

[red]

this one?. for the love of god with all the force they used they still could not get a handle on the situation. Explain to me how you would handle it?

I haven't made any comment on the link from the op. If police are beating someone then they are wrong. If they are using the proper amount of force then they are not beating someone.

 

[asuran]

I haven't made any comment on the link from the op. If police are beating someone then they are wrong. If they are using the proper amount of force then they are not beating someone.

Premature ejac... I mean prematurely passing judgement on thread topic without understanding the facts in opening post.

Now damage control.

We all do that at times... you are forgiven.

 

[wilbur]

But what if during that struggle the suspect gets a hold of a cops gun??

They have to grab his arms first. That's where an able-bodied bystander can sit on his legs.


But it is disturbing to me that cops now normally have a round in the chamber, and that the pistols they use don't have safeties. So they are ready to fire with the pull of the trigger. As far as I know, when they used to have revolvers, the first chamber was always empty. Maybe that's why they now act like wusses and try to persuade the suspect to comply by hitting him on the arms and legs with their truncheons, and otherwise tasering them, sometimes without much effect. If I was the supreme ruler, I would have cops carry their handguns with an empty chamber, and have them practice quick rack of the slide while drawing, and relax the trigger pull from 15 pounds to 5.

 

[AK-47]

This guy is also proof that tasers dont work on everyone. Some people are so hopped up on adrenaline you can taser them all day long and nothing will happen

 

[kugel1]

This guy is also proof that tasers dont work on everyone. Some people are so hopped up on adrenaline you can taser them all day long and nothing will happen

You can hear from the loud crackle of the taser that it does not have proper contact made with the 2 probes. When both probes make proper contact, the sound is almost muffled, because the electricity is directed through the person. It is arcing, so at least one of the probes isn't making proper contact, and thus no energy is imparted to the person. If it was properly applied, the sound would be quieter and you would see the muscular "lock up" effect. It isn't a matter of him resisting the effects. It wasn't applied properly to be effective.

 

[kugel1]

Police are not supposed to be robots. They have to assess the situation and apply the appropriate response, as every situation is different. This guy is on the floor resisting arrest. He's not running around with a cleaver. With the help of a couple able bodied men otherwise gawking at the scene, he can easily be subdued. You seem to be advocating an extreme response.... just in case he decides all of a sudden to start acting like a ninja. We expect police officers to use their judgements and exercise a measured response, commensurate with their 6 figure salaries.

I'm sorry, what extreme response did I advocate? I merely presented a series of facts in relation to people on drugs or experiencing psychotic episodes, and the civil liabilities that may ensue by employing the public's assistance.

 

[spaman]

I haven't made any comment on the link from the op. If police are beating someone then they are wrong. If they are using the proper amount of force then they are not beating someone.

you can't beat someone who does not comply, your just trying to get them to comply
if he had put his hands up and got on his face, then beating him at that point would be considered abuse

I'm sure you would have used your kind words to bring that mad man under control. Please sit sir

 

[AK-47]

You can hear from the loud crackle of the taser that it does not have proper contact made with the 2 probes. When both probes make proper contact, the sound is almost muffled, because the electricity is directed through the person. It is arcing, so at least one of the probes isn't making proper contact, and thus no energy is imparted to the person. If it was properly applied, the sound would be quieter and you would see the muscular "lock up" effect. It isn't a matter of him resisting the effects. It wasn't applied properly to be effective

While that may be true in this case, even if both probes do make proper contact with the suspect, its still not always guaranteed to work:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...37746c-cc94-11e2-8573-3baeea6a2647_story.html

A Taser is not a surefire weapon

The June 2 editorial “An unexplained death at Costco,” on the death of a woman who allegedly attempted to stab Loudoun County sheriff’s deputies, reflects a widespread misunderstanding of the Taser’s capabilities.

While The Post claims that the Taser “almost always incapacitates the subject,” my experience as a police sergeant and Taser instructor is far different. As effective as the Taser usually is, it does sometimes fail.

The Taser discharges two probes at different angles. If one or both probes miss the target, the Taser will not work. Given that both the officer and the threatening person may be moving when the Taser is deployed, misses occur frequently. Even if both probes hit the target, one or both can become dislodged by movement, rendering the Taser ineffective. If the probes hit fatty tissue or loose clothing, the effectiveness is reduced.

Lastly, some people, especially the mentally ill and those under the influence of drugs, are unaffected by the Taser

 

[kugel1]

No single use of force option is guaranteed to work 100% of the time. The trick is to accurately deploy the most suitable option properly with the highest likelihood of being effective, considering all the known factors present, with the goal of stopping the perpetrator while protecting all present. That decision has to be made in seconds, and reasessed after deployment. In this case, we saw an ineffectively deployed taser, and ineffective baton strikes. Would a properly deployed taser have worked?

 

[AK-47]

In this case, we saw an ineffectively deployed taser, and ineffective baton strikes. Would a properly deployed taser have worked?

I dunno. But the guy at auto dealership did look like he was either on drugs or mentally ill.

I've also seen other cases where tasers were ineffictive on dudes who were wasted on drugs.
You tell me, was the taser deployed properly in this youtube case?? Looks to me like the cop was on top of him and couldnt have missed both probes

 

[kugel1]

I dunno. But the guy at auto dealership did look like he was either on drugs or mentally ill.

I've also seen other cases where tasers were ineffictive on dudes who were wasted on drugs.
You tell me, was the taser deployed properly in this youtube case?? Looks to me like the cop was on top of him and couldnt have missed both probes

The problem with this deployment is obvious. When the taser was fired, it was almost at point blank range. The probes would not have time to spread out. When the taser is fired, the probes separate at about an 8 degree angle from each other. For the energy to be effectively transferred and cause "lock up", the probes need to be about 5 inches apart. Because he was so close, they would only be about 2 inches apart, and would have no more effect than a large static shock. In this case he has 2 options. He can reload with a new cartridge and fire at a proper distance, or using it as is, drive the nose of the taser into a spot on the guys body at least 5 inches away from the probes. There is a contact on the nose of the unit that can act as another contact, but it has to be physically held against the person with the probes in them.

 

[spaman]

should have shot that dumb ass

 

[AdamH]

Police beatings are never justified.

The police aren't there to "teach you a lesson". They're there to detain you if necessary and to use the appropriate amount of force to do so.

I have no idea what swatting at this psycho with a baton/nightstick was suppose to achieve..