PMP Certification questions

[Tito Santana]

I am interested in applying for a Project Manager Professional Certification. I just had some quick questions for people who have more experience and knowledge about this.

I understand the requirements are at least 1 week of an official PM training program, 4 years work experience and to pass a test. I'm not worried about passing the test but I do not have 4 years PM experience and have never taken a course. How rigid is the work experience requirement, can I just simply say I have the experience (or lie)? What's the cheapest course out there? How much did the test cost? How hard did you find the Canadian test? I bought several PMP books plus I have 2 years PM experience, I would just like to have the certification as proof of my knowledge.

Thank you in advance,
Tito "I can use the PMP certification as my next gimmick in WWE" Santana

 

[Not So Much]

It Ain't Easy.....

Tito:

The qualifications fall into two categories based on whether you do or do not have at least a BA Degree:

Category 1 (with a BA):
- 4500 Hours of PM experience within the 5 main groups (Initiation, Planning, Executing, Controlling and Closing) with atleast 36 consecutive months in the six years leading up to your exam

- 35 hours of approved PM Training

Category 2 (without a BA):

- 7500 Hours of PM experience within the 5 main groups (Initiation, Planning, Executing, Controlling and Closing) with atleast 60 consecutive months in the eight years leading up to your exam

- 35 hours of approved PM Training


I am not sure what your experience is, but without having taken formal PM Training, I would suggest you do not underestimate the depth of the examine. It is 4 hours of Multiple Choice questions and you have to hit a certain success mark based on the average of the participants. Believe me, the questions all sound like the have 4 correct answers so have a nice time if you really do not know your stuff.

As far as BS'ing the work experience, you have to provide something called a Experience Verification Form in before the examine. The form details your qualifications in terms of the Experience Requirements (above). They do audits from time to time to validate applicants claims. To each his own, but I would think if you are planning to make PM a career, you would be better off waiting until you accumulate the required experience and then applying for your certification.

There are a number of courses you can take, but keep in mind they must be approved courses or the time and money spent is wasted.

The final examine itself cost about $400 I think (its been a while). You should also know that in order to keep your designation you have to complete an annual/ongoing series of education and seminar participation hours. Failure to meet the requirements means you loose your certification and have to re-apply (read $$ and time).

I have been in PM for about 18 years. It can be interesting and financially rewarding (particularly if you can become and Independent Contractor), but alot of it is based on reputation and ability to get the job done properly. Shortcuts will work for a time, but in the end, not unlike other parts of your life, they are almost certain to catch up to you.

Just my 0.02 cents.

 

[galt]

Well said NSM. There are only about 45,000 PMPs globally and there is a reason for that. The experiencial requirements are tough to acheive. Remember, with the BA certification you have to acquire 4500 hours of project management experience over the course of your last 6 years of employment (I actually thought it was 4 but I'll go with NSM's numbers it's been awhile for me too) That means you have to spend about 40% of your time managing projects full time. Not an easy task in the consulting world.

There are a lot of paper tiger MCSE's, MCSD's and the like out there. Being a phony with this cert can come back and really kill you. With a PMP organizations will look to you to manage multi million dollar engagements. You screw up and word gets around fast. Especially in this industry.

If you fake this one you may get away with it in the short term but it will come back to bite you.

 

[Tito Santana]

I don't plan to bullshit and will probably work two more years managing projects. I actually have some great experience working on huge projects ... just not enough

Another quick question: when I'm ready, do I contact them on their website (http://www.pmi.org) that I want to take the test?

Thanks for the info!!!

I wonder if managing King Kong Bundy's diet counts as a project LOL!!!!

Tito "Certified PIMP" Santana

 

[two_paddle]

PMP - A counterpoint.

Tito...

No offense to the other posters above, but I thought you might want a counterpoint from somebody who's not all that impressed with the PMP (although I should point out that I would EASILY qualify, and have been doing project management 15 years).

A couple of engineer friends of mine got a PMP certification a couple of years ago. Their company (a large organization) decided to see if there was any benefit to the program and sent a small group.

From what I observed, the PMP designation was created to accomplish two things:

1. Provide some initials that people can put after their name. There is, arguably, some value to this if you're in a professional work environment and didn't have the opportunity to get some initials the usual way.

2. Make a pile of money recycling the same course material, combined with very small amount of instruction and an easy examination.

It seems very expensive for what you get; it's expensive to maintain and unless you're working for a client or boss who's hung up on it, there's not a lot of value in it (in my humble opinion).

The coursework itself is a joke - my friends both did very well on the test, and each studied maybe 8-12 hours tops. I scanned through the material - there's less covered than in any second year university project management course. Maybe only 45,000 people have the designation - but I think that's because it's not really a highly respected designation - at least not in my circles.

So, if the letters will help you in your career and you're willing to cough up for it - then this is a fairly easy way to get some. But in my books if you've got the project management skills and the experience - that will stand far above this designation.

Finally, the organization that my friends worked for concluded much the same thing. They stopped sending their employees and decided to let the certifications lapse (i.e. they stopped paying the annual fee) for people who had already gone through the program.

I guess what it boils down to, is that a certification is only worth something if it's difficult to obtain - and this one isn't.

Sorry to break it to you, but I thought you should know how some people view the designation before you spend your hard-earned money.

But of course it's your choice.

Two Paddle

 

[CityOfJoy]

Very interesting discussion.. infact I am at a point where I am considering the same dilemma.

I have 9 years of technical experience developing web based systems and last 3 years have been management work. So now I don't have a formal PM education but I have managed well.

Ryerson Uni has a PMI recognized certification program and there is one starting May 3rd.. "fundamentals of project management" that I intend to take. It's 14 sessions of 3 hrs each on Mondays and Wednesdays until June... and will cost around $475 CAD.

To all PMs on the board.... is this course at Ryerson worth it.. here's the link for you to see .. I am talking about "CKPM202"

http://ce-online.ryerson.ca/ce/calendar/default.asp?section=course&sub=cert&mode=crs_list&cert={9F036BCD-9971-11D4-AE88-00E029501EB1}

NOTE: pls copy the link and paste it... the direct link doesn't work.


Thanks for your help.

 

[Not So Much]

Not A PMI Shill.....

...Sorry to break it to you, but I thought you should know how some people view the designation before you spend your hard-earned money.....

First of all, I should make it clear that my response was to Tito's questions about the Program and on the approach he seemed to be taking to it ("can I just simply say I have the experience (or lie)?"). The exam is not that difficult if you know their material and my comments about the difficulty were only offered without the knowledge of what PM experience Tito has. I have seen people that organized an office outing subsequently call themselves a Project Manager, but I would hardly think that would qualify them to manage a technology project with a multi million dollar budget and some tight timelines. Equally it would not properly prepare them to write the PMI Certification Exam.

I am by no means a big PMI supporter, nor do I think the PMP designation is the "be all, end all" to Project Management. Notwithstanding two_paddle's comments however, there are some organizations who are looking for PMP Certification as a sign of some standard Project Management knowledge. If that is the circle someone travels in then the PMP Certification will help them get in a door at least. Once they get there, it is their experience and supporting skill set that will determine whether a company is prepared to trust them to do the job.

 

[countstudly]

Catch 22

So how do you get the experience for the certification if it's unlikely that an employer will let you manage a project without the certification?

Does PMI track the jumps in salaries obtained after the certification is obtained? How about increased market value?

 

[Not So Much]

It Takes Time....

So how do you get the experience for the certification if it's unlikely that an employer will let you manage a project without the certification?

Being PMP certified, as previously suggested in this thread, is not a requirement for every job within every organization. Many industries have taken a more serious stance to their Operational approach and some form of Project Management Methodology is usually the foundation of that (not necessarily requiring PMP certification or subscribing to PMI based teachings). While highly arguable, my experience (mainly in information technology field) is that there are a number of ways to move to this position prior to Certification. One of the more traditional paths would be to begin as a resource on various Projects so that you can gain experience on how Project based work is different than day to day activities. You can learn the concepts that make a successful project (on Budget, on Schedule, as per the defined Requirements and to an agreed level of quality). Within larger projects there is usually a need for team leaders (next step on the ladder) and from there you can be positioned to run smaller Projects as a PM. Smaller Projects where you demonstrate success, lead to bigger ones and so on.

Each of these transitions can be accelerated and fast tracked by outside education (there is no shortage of quality courses and seminars available). Notwithstanding the opinions of some, education is important, but the build up of experience, particularly successful experience, takes time. While there are many that claim to be "know it alls" in PM, I've spent more time as a relief PM (picking someone else's mess) than I have taking a Project from start to finish.

 

[Cinema Face]

I didn't know you had to be certified to be a PMP.

 

[countstudly]

I take it that PMI is the certifying authority and that ESI and other vendors are not assoicated with it?

How is George Washinton University tied into all this?

Is there an advantage to following one curriculum over another?