NYC truck attack.

[Occasionally]

After the Boston marathon bombing, I was struck by what the bomber's uncle said when asked what might have motivated them:

"Being losers, hatred to those who were able to settle themselves -- these are the only reasons I can imagine. Anything else, anything else to do with religion, with Islam, is a fraud, is a fake"

I think that most of these "terrorists" are not really motivated by politics and don't give a shit about Islam or ISIS. They are just frustrated losers looking for a cause to to justify lashing out in a dramatic fashion.

Sounds reasonable.

Notice how all of the terrorist guys seem shabby and never seem to have a good job?

A westerner down on his luck who wants to go out with a bang typically commits suicide or maybe is one of those disgruntled guys who got fired and kills a few people at work before being shot by police. A limited number of people get hurt.

An Islamic guy down on his luck blows up buildings and rams rental trucks into crowds. The focus here is to take down as many people with him in a sinking ship. The more the better. And in spectacular fashion. Forget about a bullet to the brain. It's all about making a statement and if it means body parts being blown apart all over the street, the better.

 

[Conil]

Sounds reasonable.

Notice how all of the terrorist guys seem shabby and never seem to have a good job?

A westerner down on his luck who wants to go out with a bang typically commits suicide or maybe is one of those disgruntled guys who got fired and kills a few people at work before being shot by police. A limited number of people get hurt.

They may look shabby but most are middle class and up.

"The better young people are integrated, the greater the chance is that they radicalize. This hypothesis is supported by a lot of evidence". — From a report by researchers at Erasmus University in Rotterdam.

"The proportions of [Islamic State] administrators but also of suicide fighters increase with education," according to a World Bank report. "Moreover, those offering to become suicide bombers ranked on average in the more educated group."

Britain's MI5 revealed that "two-thirds of the British suspects have a middle-class profile and those who want to become suicide bombers are often the most educated".

"There is a stereotype that young people from Europe who leave for Syria are victims of a society that does not accept them and does not offer them sufficient opportunities... Another common stereotype in the debate in Belgium is that, despite research which refutes this, radicalization is still far too often misunderstood as a process resulting from failed integration... I therefore dare say that the better young people are integrated, the greater the chance is that they radicalize. This hypothesis is supported by a lot of evidence." That was the result of extremely important Dutch research, led by a group of academics at the Erasmus University in Rotterdam.
http://www.standaard.be/cnt/dmf20150201_01504894

Isil recruits better educated than their average countryman, World Bank study finds. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...-educated-than-their-average-countryman-worl/

 

[Occasionally]

They may look shabby but most are middle class and up.

"The better young people are integrated, the greater the chance is that they radicalize. This hypothesis is supported by a lot of evidence". — From a report by researchers at Erasmus University in Rotterdam.

"The proportions of [Islamic State] administrators but also of suicide fighters increase with education," according to a World Bank report. "Moreover, those offering to become suicide bombers ranked on average in the more educated group."

Britain's MI5 revealed that "two-thirds of the British suspects have a middle-class profile and those who want to become suicide bombers are often the most educated".

"There is a stereotype that young people from Europe who leave for Syria are victims of a society that does not accept them and does not offer them sufficient opportunities... Another common stereotype in the debate in Belgium is that, despite research which refutes this, radicalization is still far too often misunderstood as a process resulting from failed integration... I therefore dare say that the better young people are integrated, the greater the chance is that they radicalize. This hypothesis is supported by a lot of evidence." That was the result of extremely important Dutch research, led by a group of academics at the Erasmus University in Rotterdam.
http://www.standaard.be/cnt/dmf20150201_01504894

Isil recruits better educated than their average countryman, World Bank study finds. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...-educated-than-their-average-countryman-worl/

If it's true their education levels are pretty decent, is there proof good jobs follow?

 

[mandrill]

I looked at conil's sources. One is in Dutch and one has to purchase a subscription to read it. The World Bank article linked does not say anything remotely approaching what the Telegraph article claims. It may well be that a full edition of the report is available if one googles it.

It's an interesting topic and it could well be that the more educated and under-employed or unsatisfied the potential recruit is the easier he is to sign up. But nothing supplied by Conil helps with that.

I am currently reading a book called "ISIS - inside the army of terror" by Michael Weiss and Hassan Hassan. The book is a narrative history of the post Bush Mid East and doesn't look closely at recruitment trends. However, it makes the point that certain types of young person are attracted by very extreme ideology and violence. In my day, it was the Weathermen and Carlos the Jackal and putting up Che posters on your wall.

When I was in my 20's, some of my quite educated buddies were attracted and involved by extreme left wing / anarchist organizations.

The Boston Marathon bombers were educated and privilege as well.

 

[Conil]

If it's true their education levels are pretty decent, is there proof good jobs follow?

No guarantees in life, but chances to get a job is higher if you have an education, at the same time there billions of poor people that are not terrorists.

 

[Conil]

I looked at conil's sources. One is in Dutch and one has to purchase a subscription to read it. The World Bank article linked does not say anything remotely approaching what the Telegraph article claims. It may well be that a full edition of the report is available if one googles it.

It's an interesting topic and it could well be that the more educated and under-employed or unsatisfied the potential recruit is the easier he is to sign up. But nothing supplied by Conil helps with that.

I am currently reading a book called "ISIS - inside the army of terror" by Michael Weiss and Hassan Hassan. The book is a narrative history of the post Bush Mid East and doesn't look closely at recruitment trends. However, it makes the point that certain types of young person are attracted by very extreme ideology and violence. In my day, it was the Weathermen and Carlos the Jackal and putting up Che posters on your wall.

When I was in my 20's, some of my quite educated buddies were attracted and involved by extreme left wing / anarchist organizations.

The Boston Marathon bombers were educated and privilege as well.

What happened to this:

Quote Originally Posted by oagre View Post
Out little chat is over and you go back on ignore, where I usually keep you.

LMAO None of the articles need a subscription, you're likely too senile to figure it out. Then you can use this thing called google translate with one click.

Oagre is still angry with me because I caught him shilling for perla. I challenged him when he said: you can walk in perla and grab ANY of the girls and have a tremendous session.

 

[managee]

I looked at conil's sources. One is in Dutch and one has to purchase a subscription to read it. The World Bank article linked does not say anything remotely approaching what the Telegraph article claims. It may well be that a full edition of the report is available if one googles it.

It's an interesting topic and it could well be that the more educated and under-employed or unsatisfied the potential recruit is the easier he is to sign up. But nothing supplied by Conil helps with that.

I am currently reading a book called "ISIS - inside the army of terror" by Michael Weiss and Hassan Hassan. The book is a narrative history of the post Bush Mid East and doesn't look closely at recruitment trends. However, it makes the point that certain types of young person are attracted by very extreme ideology and violence. In my day, it was the Weathermen and Carlos the Jackal and putting up Che posters on your wall.

When I was in my 20's, some of my quite educated buddies were attracted and involved by extreme left wing / anarchist organizations.

The Boston Marathon bombers were educated and privilege as well.

I’ve heard good things about the book. Will give it a spin.

A certain percentage of people are going to be attracted to extremism. 9% of Americans think it’s acceptable to hold white supremacist beliefs. Having the resolve to follow-thru with an act of terror (or mass murder) is a whole other category of person.

I don’t know if I’d call either of the Boston bombers educated. One dropped out of community college after 3 semesters, the other had 7 F’s over their final 3 semesters at UMass but was still living in a dorm selling pot.

 

[mandrill]

I’ve heard good things about the book. Will give it a spin.

A certain percentage of people are going to be attracted to extremism. 9% of Americans think it’s acceptable to hold white supremacist beliefs. Having the resolve to follow-thru with an act of terror (or mass murder) is a whole other category of person.

I don’t know if I’d call either of the Boston bombers educated. One dropped out of community college after 3 semesters, the other had 7 F’s over their final 3 semesters at UMass but was still living in a dorm selling pot.

I didn't realize that about those 2 losers.

 

[mandrill]

I’ve heard good things about the book. Will give it a spin.

A certain percentage of people are going to be attracted to extremism. 9% of Americans think it’s acceptable to hold white supremacist beliefs. Having the resolve to follow-thru with an act of terror (or mass murder) is a whole other category of person.

I don’t know if I’d call either of the Boston bombers educated. One dropped out of community college after 3 semesters, the other had 7 F’s over their final 3 semesters at UMass but was still living in a dorm selling pot.

Learned a lot from the book, including that the current "coalition" attacks on ISIS are only semi effective due to corruption and incompetence and that the Shiite militias in both Syria and Iraq are engaged in genocide against the Sunni population while the US hushes it all up to present the image of "democracy" defeating extremist terror. The Shiite militias are largely pawns of Iran, which will probably run the entire Mid East incl Syria and Iraq in a few years, while the West is powerless to intervene.

Some chapters on Zarqawi and the al-Baghdadis which were tedious as I hated all those fuckers.

Considerable explanation of why ISIS is far more effective than other forces in the region - recruitment, indoctrination, discipline, etc and far less corruption than a normal Mid East organization. Somewhat reminiscent of Viet Nam in that the "bad guys" are simply far more competent than Uncle Sam's local lackey allies.

General narrative history of the region since Bush went in and killed Saddam.

Exposition of what a manipulative, two-faced PoS Assad is.

Worth reading.

 

[derrick76]

Y'all hold tight. Another Vegas style thread may be going down for Texas.

Stay tuned.

 

[managee]

Learned a lot from the book, including that the current "coalition" attacks on ISIS are only semi effective due to corruption and incompetence and that the Shiite militias in both Syria and Iraq are engaged in genocide against the Sunni population while the US hushes it all up to present the image of "democracy" defeating extremist terror. The Shiite militias are largely pawns of Iran, which will probably run the entire Mid East incl Syria and Iraq in a few years, while the West is powerless to intervene.

Some chapters on Zarqawi and the al-Baghdadis which were tedious as I hated all those fuckers.

Considerable explanation of why ISIS is far more effective than other forces in the region - recruitment, indoctrination, discipline, etc and far less corruption than a normal Mid East organization. Somewhat reminiscent of Viet Nam in that the "bad guys" are simply far more competent than Uncle Sam's local lackey allies.

General narrative history of the region since Bush went in and killed Saddam.

Exposition of what a manipulative, two-faced PoS Assad is.

Worth reading.

Great advice.

I loved The Looming Tower. If you haven’t read it, I highly recommend it.

Any others?

 

[mandrill]

Great advice.

I loved The Looming Towe. If you haven’t read it, I highly recommend it.

Any others?

I picked up another book, "ISIS - the state of terror" by Jessica Stern and J. M. Berger and will let you know what it says.

 

[frankcastle]

Yes I separate the religious/political terrorist from a paranoid schizophrenic. The consequences of both are terrible, and if you compared the above Islamic terrorist with Timothy McVeigh I would agree, but I find a schizophrenic and a terrorist two different things.

schizo and terrorist are different labels but at the end of the day both have something inherently wrong with their minds that allows them to do what they do.

 

[FAST]

schizo and terrorist are different labels but at the end of the day both have something inherently wrong with their minds that allows them to do what they do.

Yep,... in the case of Muslim terrorists,.... its called Islam,... and one does not inherent that.

 

[Frankfooter]

Learned a lot from the book, including that the current "coalition" attacks on ISIS are only semi effective due to corruption and incompetence and that the Shiite militias in both Syria and Iraq are engaged in genocide against the Sunni population while the US hushes it all up to present the image of "democracy" defeating extremist terror. The Shiite militias are largely pawns of Iran, which will probably run the entire Mid East incl Syria and Iraq in a few years, while the West is powerless to intervene.

Some chapters on Zarqawi and the al-Baghdadis which were tedious as I hated all those fuckers.

Considerable explanation of why ISIS is far more effective than other forces in the region - recruitment, indoctrination, discipline, etc and far less corruption than a normal Mid East organization. Somewhat reminiscent of Viet Nam in that the "bad guys" are simply far more competent than Uncle Sam's local lackey allies.

General narrative history of the region since Bush went in and killed Saddam.

Exposition of what a manipulative, two-faced PoS Assad is.

Worth reading.

Juan Cole's site is really quite good, he has a very deep knowledge of the area and culture.
https://www.juancole.com/

Its a good place to get an informed take on current issues.