Most recent articles on prostitution related laws, opinions, comments

[shakenbake]

If PeePee and the Conservates get a majority you can count on this happening.

Not.

 

[bettong]

The current law is C 36. The prior prostitution law against incalls, living off avails etc was declared unconstitutional under the Charter. Even under the old law outcall was legal it was only incall (bawdy houses) that were not legal, as well as "living off the avails."

The current law has been similarly struck down at least 3 times in Ontario. Major cities Police have stated they will not enforce C 36 unless underaged, forced trafficking etc. That includes Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver police.

In your reference, if you look up the most recent 2 cases (2020 and 2019 appeals) they were all underaged sexworker the guy was trafficking or having paid sex with.

A couple years ago I had an escort visit me at hotel in Toronto (actually Mississauga). Unknown how she was known, she was stopped by police in the hotel parking lot. They somehow knew she was an escort. Their only concern was she doing it willingly and not trafficked. She assured them yes very willing and there was no problem.

The Ontario cases that have been won on appeals in Ontario courts are only precedents in Ontario but I doubt any police in Canada would be willing to go against the cases. They were also in smaller more conservative cities where they were charged.

I never discuss sex with a companion/escort, only companionship, so should not be a legal issue even if C36 was enforced. Canada is unlike the US since you have Charter of Rights & Freedoms for the security and safety of the person. In the case where the Supreme Court voided the prior law, it was clear being illegal was more risky. When legal it is far safer.

Thanks for this Dave - Aussie here, have been a bit intimidated by what I've read about Canada's laws but this is very reassuring. Looking forward to a visit in a couple of months.
In Australia this is a matter of State law; things vary from state to state but prostitution is generally legal here, with varying degrees of regulation but a trend towards decriminalisation (although there is a bill in the upper house of parliament in south Australia that would implement the Scandinavian model - fortunately it seems unlikely to get up).

 

[nottyboi]

If PeePee and the Conservates get a majority you can count on this happening.

Are you mad? He is beholden to religious nut jobs.

 

[squeezer]

Are you mad? He is beholden to religious nut jobs.

This is what I said to clarify the other post.

You misunderstood me or perhaps I wasn't clear. I think Pee Pee and the Conservatives would once again take aim at the sex industry to please their religious base and attempt to fully criminalize it. They look at it as the low-hanging fruit, pissing off the least amount of voters but pleasing their base.

I blame Harper with Pee Pee by his side for Bill C 36. How you or anyone can believe I'd be in favor of Pee Pee for anything is like Mitchy cheering for Biden.

 

[Jami77]

Sorry If this is the wron place for this question: I honestly cant understand the law in Ontario and specifically Ottawa and Toronto. As it relates to clients what are we allowed and not allowed to do legally? For example if you contacted a SP via text is that illegal? How about if you or she discuss activities over txt or email? I had a SP after screening send me a menu prices included. I bailed because I thought I would end up in Handcuffs. Is that not a thing in Ontario ? It apperas procurement is in deed illegal but is it enforced.. ? So many questions.

Reference Reference I found

I find it confusing also - I mean I get the idea behind the law - to not prosecute the SP, only the John - which means that the John should behave because the SP can call the cops on him and be immune to prosecution. But I guess it didnt work out that way.

What I find confusing is that if its illegal for me to pay for sex then why do cities have licensed body rub parlours? A body rub parlour is obviously there for one reason only and its not massage. If I want a massage I go to a licensed RMT. So how can both exist at the same time?

 

[corrie fan]

I find it confusing also - I mean I get the idea behind the law - to not prosecute the SP, only the John - which means that the John should behave because the SP can call the cops on him and be immune to prosecution. But I guess it didnt work out that way.

What I find confusing is that if its illegal for me to pay for sex then why do cities have licensed body rub parlours? A body rub parlour is obviously there for one reason only and its not massage. If I want a massage I go to a licensed RMT. So how can both exist at the same time?

I think part of the reason cities license body rub parlours is so they can regulate them. It is understood that the sex industry will exist no matter how much effort is put into eliminating it. It is better to license parlours to improve the safety of sex workers and their clients. Parlours are inspected by the city to ensure there are no underage or trafficked women working there. Location and operating hours are regulated.

 

[retsim]

CBC radio just had a decent discussion, ending with a law professor's recommendation of the New Zealand model. You can listen to it from a link on this page, and vote for their options. The vote options do not make clear the difference between "Legalize prostitution" and "Decriminalize prostitution", which the federal government could do best by doing nothing. There is no need for a law of any kind.

http://www.cbc.ca/day6/blog/2014/03/06/rethinking-prostitution-doc-and-talk/

I am very surprised by how many people in my circles still do not know that escorting has been decriminalized in Canada, and even those who do, they do not understand how the decriminalization affects clients and protects providers; they would be a lot nicer in how they proposition providers if they knew, that's for sure! Still, decriminalization still seems to hurt providers a lot. There is a limit of advertising portals, it is difficult to promote services on dating apps without potentially getting banned, and it is difficult to discuss services in person in a variety of settings. Also, without legalization, less businesses are willing to openly provide services to the providers, and they have less recourse in cases of defamation, which is rampant in the provider circles. by the way, this is my first post here, glad to be on here to contribute and thanks.

 

[Giselle Montreal]

I am very surprised by how many people in my circles still do not know that escorting has been decriminalized in Canada, and even those who do, they do not understand how the decriminalization affects clients and protects providers; they would be a lot nicer in how they proposition providers if they knew, that's for sure!

Prostitution is not decriminalized in Canada, that's exactly what we are fighting for. Clients are criminalized and we, as SW, have immunities but not for everything, e.g. we could also be charged for discussing terms with a client and soliciting in public settings. We would be criminals just as much as clients.

"Bill C-36 also achieves its goal of protecting communities by criminalizing communicating for the purposes of selling sexual services in specific locations that are designed for use by children." https://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/rp-pr/other-autre/protect/p1.html

 

[Giselle Montreal]

Sorry If this is the wron place for this question: I honestly cant understand the law in Ontario and specifically Ottawa and Toronto. As it relates to clients what are we allowed and not allowed to do legally? For example if you contacted a SP via text is that illegal? How about if you or she discuss activities over txt or email? I had a SP after screening send me a menu prices included. I bailed because I thought I would end up in Handcuffs. Is that not a thing in Ontario ? It apperas procurement is in deed illegal but is it enforced.. ? So many questions.

Reference Reference I found

That would be good to know:

"Notably, Bill C-36 does not prohibit persons who sell their own sexual services from communicating for that purpose, other than in public places that are or are next to school grounds, playgrounds or day care centres." https://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/rp-pr/other-autre/protect/p1.html

Note that as a client, you are always a criminal, if there's proof that sexual services were exchanged for money. It is normal to be confused since there are a lot of grey zones that will be defined only once someone is prosecuted and a judge makes its ruling. But so far, authorities are more interested in juvenile prostitution and sexual trafficking.

 

[shane4]

That would be good to know:

"Notably, Bill C-36 does not prohibit persons who sell their own sexual services from communicating for that purpose, other than in public places that are or are next to school grounds, playgrounds or day care centres." https://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/rp-pr/other-autre/protect/p1.html

Note that as a client, you are always a criminal, if there's proof that sexual services were exchanged for money. It is normal to be confused since there are a lot of grey zones that will be defined only once someone is prosecuted and a judge makes its ruling. But so far, authorities are more interested in juvenile prostitution and sexual trafficking.

What percentage of the trade is trafficked? This is so over blown.

 

[Jami77]

What percentage of the trade is trafficked? This is so over blown.

I've seen documentaries where cops go after Leolist ads and show up at hotel rooms to make sure the girl is of age, and is okay and doing it of her own accord. I wonder too how much of leolist is genuine girls vs trafficked or underage? I also wonder how many AMPs contain trafficked girls?

 

[drlove]

I've seen documentaries where cops go after Leolist ads and show up at hotel rooms to make sure the girl is of age, and is okay and doing it of her own accord. I wonder too how much of leolist is genuine girls vs trafficked or underage? I also wonder how many AMPs contain trafficked girls?

Just stick to reputable providers and you’ll be fine.

 

[Muchadoaboutnothing]

I've seen documentaries where cops go after Leolist ads and show up at hotel rooms to make sure the girl is of age, and is okay and doing it of her own accord. I wonder too how much of leolist is genuine girls vs trafficked or underage? I also wonder how many AMPs contain trafficked girls?

Hotel rooms in the states all have a framed paper of how to report trafficking, what to look for and such. usually in one of the closets /doors. I noticed Canada doesn’t have this ever

 

[Muchadoaboutnothing]

Just stick to reputable providers and you’ll be fine.

In all fairness agencies don’t ask for an ID from what I understand. So those that say they’re 19,20,21 could be over aging themselves to get work?

 

[Muchadoaboutnothing]

What percentage of the trade is trafficked? This is so over blown.

The issue with human trafficking is if it was tracked then it wouldn’t be happening … so it’s not “overblown“. There’s no way of knowing and there’s varying degrees of what defines trafficking. how did she get involved. To what extent did she understand and agree? Has she tried to stop or whatever and it’s been denied covertly or overtly. Are they dependent on some way more than just financially ? Are
they isolated and addicted to anything ? Groomed ? Is support offered to cope with the job requirements ? etc etc etc

 

[Muchadoaboutnothing]

I've seen documentaries where cops go after Leolist ads and show up at hotel rooms to make sure the girl is of age, and is okay and doing it of her own accord. I wonder too how much of leolist is genuine girls vs trafficked or underage? I also wonder how many AMPs contain trafficked girls?

There was a man who posted a month ago about cops coming to the guys house or hotel to get money for the sw. I can’t recall if he thought it was a sting or whatever.

 

[Jami77]

Hotel rooms in the states all have a framed paper of how to report trafficking, what to look for and such. usually in one of the closets /doors. I noticed Canada doesn’t have this ever

I had a business meeting in the US and all the airports (including Toronto) had trafficking posters in the bathrooms. I guess its big at the airports?

 

[massman]

I had a business meeting in the US and all the airports (including Toronto) had trafficking posters in the bathrooms. I guess its big at the airports?

Also in the bathrooms at the En Routes on the 401.