Hydro and the ice storm

[dirkd101]

Ok, everyone knows about the ice storm and what happened. I just want to address what the CEO of Toronto hydro has put out there and that's the so-called selfless sacrifices that hydro employees are making because of this ice storm. Are these selfless individuals coming in for straight time or double, triple or quadruple over-time? These guys know a pay day when they see it and the gravy train at Toronto hydro is a juggernaut for sure.

I know these guys have to be there to hook up the power, but please stop making them out to be selfless in their sacrifices.

I'm sure the Toronto police and fire department were quite overwhelmed by the storm and I may have missed it, but I haven't heard the same blather from their upper management as I have from hydro.

 

[Aardvark154]

You have a point. However, although tempers are short, a great many of these line crews have had at most a few hours off on Christmas, you are also ignoring what I presume have been the "out of town" line crews that have been called in - certainly they have been in other places which were hit hard in the 2013 Ice Storm - most of them missed Christmas entirely - yes they are being paid, but I'm sure that they and their small children would have much rather they had been home.

 

[Stoo]

I live in a rural area where most folks were without power for days. When we don't have power, we also don't have water as a rule, since we're on wells. We were reconnected by crews from Niagara... They have been working on the backroads for days. I've seen them out there every time I've been out... including after 11 PM and at 6:30 AM, so I assume they were probably working all night...

While many of us have generators and alternate heat sources, after a few days the "charm" of roughing it starts to wear thin. For the most part, we're in a better position to manage the outage than someone in a highrise in Toronto, but I think that these crews are worth every penny they make in this sort of situation, especially over Christmas.

 

[Keebler Elf]

Talk about ungrateful!

I know I wouldn't want to give up my Christmas holidays no matter what the pay. So when others do I have nothing but respect for them and damn right they should be earning good OT pay.

Stop being such an ungrateful asshole.

 

[danmand]

The real question to be asked is why the hydro wires have not been buried? In Denmark and Gernany, and other northern european countries, the hydro wires were buried in the 1950's and 60's, even in rural areas. The web of wires and poles make Canada look very backwards, and the resulting outages are predictable.

 

[Aardvark154]

The real question to be asked is why the hydro wires have not been buried? In Denmark and Gernany, and other northern european countries, the hydro wires were buried in the 1950's and 60's, even in rural areas. The web of wires and poles make Canada look very backwards, and the resulting outages are predictable.

Its a fantastic idea, then again to state the obvious Canada and the United States are a great deal larger than Western Europe.

 

[danmand]

Its a fantastic idea, then again to state the obvious Canada and the United States are a great deal larger than Western Europe.

It is not a fantastic idea, it is common sense, and economically advantageously in the longer run. While Canda has areas with hardly any people, the rural area I live in (and most of suthern Ontario) has higher population density than many areas of Denmark, where hydro wires were buried.

 

[red]

Its a fantastic idea, then again to state the obvious Canada and the United States are a great deal larger than Western Europe.

thats it exactly. canada is big. germany is about 5% the size with much higher pop densities.

 

[danmand]

thats it exactly. canada is big. germany is about 5% the size with much higher pop densities.

The average population density is no argument for not burying the hydro wires where the population density is high, as in most of suthern Ontario.

 

[hamermill]

The real question to be asked is why the hydro wires have not been buried? In Denmark and Gernany, and other northern european countries, the hydro wires were buried in the 1950's and 60's, even in rural areas. The web of wires and poles make Canada look very backwards, and the resulting outages are predictable.

Simple - it's is because people aren't willing to pay.

 

[Aardvark154]

It is not a fantastic idea, it is common sense, and economically advantageous in the long run.

I never knew that "fantastic idea," "common sense," and economically advantageous in the long run" were antithetical concepts/ideas.

 

[red]

The average population density is no argument for not burying the hydro wires where the population density is high, as in most of suthern Ontario.

what are the costs to bury the hydro lines versus costs to repair?

it was $8 to $10 million to repair after the ice storm

how much to bury all the lines in toronto?

 

[danmand]

what are the costs to bury the hydro lines versus costs to repair?

it was $8 to $10 million to repair after the ice storm

how much to bury all the lines in toronto?

There is no way the real cost of the disruption is not much higher than $10M.

The hydro companies have crews working all summer to trim trees, however obviously not enough crews. You also avoid repairs from lightening strikes, which happen every month in our area.

I am not advocating a massive program to bury all wires next year. Spending let us say $50M every year on burying the wires will eventually solve the problem.

I doubt that the countries in northern europe buried the wires for aestetic reasons.

 

[TheDr]

Of course these Hydro guys know a payday when they see one, as almost every other employed person does. And to my mind they deserve every penny they make giving up their Christmas and working in very unpleasant conditions to fix a issue caused largely by lack of proper investment in the Hydro infrastructure over the years. Its not the people on the ground's fault.

The real scrutiny should come at a higher level in the Hydro companies, after all they put prices up on a regular basis and claim they are investing in the infrastructure but it is pretty obvious what they are not doing has not been enough. Perhaps the remuneration of the Executives and their bonuses along with dividends paid to shareholders and profits over the last 10 years should be examined alongside the investment in infrastructure to see quite where all the extra money has gone.

 

[peter4025]

Most municipalities in the GTA require that any new development has the wires buried. At one point in the future all electrical wires will be underground. The cost ( for homeowners) of burying a wire from the main line to the house is between $5,000 and $15,000. I don't think that many homeowners would be willing to pay these prices at this moment.

 

[Yoga Face]

The real question to be asked is why the hydro wires have not been buried? In Denmark and Gernany, and other northern european countries, the hydro wires were buried in the 1950's and 60's, even in rural areas. The web of wires and poles make Canada look very backwards, and the resulting outages are predictable.

they do?????????????????????


you do not bury hydro lines because energy is lost during transmission in the form of heat (which is why they use step up transformers because they step down amperage)

they would melt if buried


how does germany get around this problem???????


are you just talking about the lines to the house after the step down or the lines from the power station?????

 

[danmand]

they do?????????????????????


you do not bury hydro lines because energy is lost during transmission in the form of heat (which is why they use step up transformers because they step down amperage)

they would melt if buried


how does germany get around this problem???????

The high voltage transmission lines are not buried, only the wires that here are strung on poles along the roads.

 

[needinit]

Haven't driven through new housing estates but power there would be buried - I assume, or is that a bad assumption? I think suggested elsewhere road works, such as sewer updates and possibly repaving should also include dropping the power underground (or at least installing the infrastructure for it, so Hydro can come along after and install)? If they do the public works side, then they can ask each home owner to contribute (payment plan) to have it done at their end - over time small payments for 'insurance' of not losing power.

 

[destillat]

Haven't driven through new housing estates but power there would be buried - I assume, or is that a bad assumption? I think suggested elsewhere road works, such as sewer updates and possibly repaving should also include dropping the power underground (or at least installing the infrastructure for it, so Hydro can come along after and install)? If they do the public works side, then they can ask each home owner to contribute (payment plan) to have it done at their end - over time small payments for 'insurance' of not losing power.

My house in Mississauga is 28 years old and the power lines are buried.

 

[MRBJX]

You have a point. However, although tempers are short, a great many of these line crews have had at most a few hours off on Christmas, you are also ignoring what I presume have been the "out of town" line crews that have been called in - certainly they have been in other places which were hit hard in the 2013 Ice Storm - most of them missed Christmas entirely - yes they are being paid, but I'm sure that they and their small children would have much rather they had been home.

Oh brother. Its not like they went to war and might not return. Their children will soon learn that most of Christmas is a farce and its better to have money in your pocket.