Finally some justice

Questor

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http://ca.news.yahoo.com/verdict-due-today-trial-police-officer-accused-assaulting-080009992.html
This bit of news sort of restores my faith in out justice system. Maybe Bill Blair and his gang of thugs with badges will start to serve and protect instead of intimidate and abuse
Part of the problem during the G20 was that the gang of thugs did not wear badges or ID tags. They preferred to work anonymously because they were intending to assault people illegally.

"His explanation that he was responding to Adam Nobody's resistance is nothing more than an after the fact attempt to justify his blows," Botham said.
"I accept that in a dynamic situation, arrests need to occur quickly and officers may well need to use force to ensure that happens," she said. "(But) even on the defendant's evidence the resistance offered by Adam Nobody was minimal."
Outside court, Nobody said he was surprised at the verdict.
"I was, yes... we live in a system we all know that cops get off all the time, so yes, I can honestly say that I was."
Yes, I am surprised too.
 

GameBoy27

Well-known member
Nov 23, 2004
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I'd like to see the police service make every officer wear a camera with audio on their vest. It would likely make the bully cops think twice before they use excessive force and if they do, it would no longer be the cops word against perp. The good cops would have nothing to worry about.

Video evidence helped convict the officer in this case and would go a long way in making policing better IMHO.
 

Julian

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Jan 22, 2004
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I'd like to see the police service make every officer wear a camera with audio on their vest. It would likely make the bully cops think twice before they use excessive force and if they do, it would no longer be the cops word against perp. The good cops would have nothing to worry about.

Video evidence helped convict the officer in this case and would go a long way in making policing better IMHO.

Me too I'm sure the police union will do all the can to stop or delay this from happening, the good cops would have nothing to fear and can protect themselves against false claims...eventually it will come this, and this should save the courts a lot of time.
 

good to go

Active member
Aug 17, 2001
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We should look to have the police do paid duty work while under paid suspension instead of paid sitting on their asses at home. Where can i get a job where i am suspended and paid ........wow.
 

Mervyn

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Dec 23, 2005
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I'd like to see the police service make every officer wear a camera with audio on their vest. It would likely make the bully cops think twice before they use excessive force and if they do, it would no longer be the cops word against perp. The good cops would have nothing to worry about.

Video evidence helped convict the officer in this case and would go a long way in making policing better IMHO.
I would agree with the Helmet cams, but I can also see people being against the camera's using a "big brother argument
 

blackrock13

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Jun 6, 2009
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I would agree with the Helmet cams, but I can also see people being against the camera's using a "big brother argument
The helmet cams and vest cams are a great idea until you start dealing control of the recordings,how long you hold on to it and when to turn them on and off. Many cities many have tried them have not chosen to keep them. It's not cut and dry. The general public have gotten up in a tizzy when you suggest street cameras all over the place, citing privacy issues. This will be no different. It's not the police unions who have raised the biggest objections, contrary to what some on TERB might like to think.
 

destillat

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Aug 29, 2001
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I would agree with the Helmet cams, but I can also see people being against the camera's using a "big brother argument
If you are in public (the only place you would encounter police, unless you have a reason to have your home raided), you have no reasonable expectation of privacy, ANYWHERE... a few extra cams on cops shoulders shouldn't be a tough sell.
 

fuji

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Jan 31, 2005
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The cameras should be on whenever the officer is on duty and interacting with the public.

We could probably find a reasonable convention that is intuitive. Like, the camera is on whenever the officers cap is on.

On break or when not interacting with the public in an official capacity, cap and camera can be off.

That would make it clear to everyone in a very visible way.
 

Questor

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The helmet cams and vest cams are a great idea until you start dealing control of the recordings,how long you hold on to it and when to turn them on and off. Many cities many have tried them have not chosen to keep them. It's not cut and dry. The general public have gotten up in a tizzy when you suggest street cameras all over the place, citing privacy issues. This will be no different. It's not the police unions who have raised the biggest objections, contrary to what some on TERB might like to think.
Don't worry, as a mall cop, this wouldn't affect you. But I'm not surprised that you would object to something so straight forward.

The cop comes off of duty, downloads his cam onto a hard drive where it is stored for a week, unless it is flagged due to an issue that occurred on that shift. Otherwise, it gets deleted automatically.

The cops are protected from false accusations of abuse of power, brutality, etc. And citizens are protected from that rare bird, the out of control cop.

End of story.
 

destillat

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Aug 29, 2001
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Don't worry, as a mall cop, this wouldn't affect you. But I'm not surprised that you would object to something so straight forward.

The cop comes off of duty, downloads his cam onto a hard drive where it is stored for a week, unless it is flagged due to an issue that occurred on that shift. Otherwise, it gets deleted automatically.

The cops are protected from false accusations of abuse of power, brutality, etc. And citizens are protected from that rare bird, the out of control cop.

End of story.
Stored for a week?
With hard drives being sold in pesos nowadays... I think is fairly easy to up the retention period a bit.
 

NHFL

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Feb 20, 2013
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One of the biggest issues will be "edited" versions or somehow "lost" recordings.
 

blackrock13

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Jun 6, 2009
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Don't worry, as a mall cop, this wouldn't affect you. But I'm not surprised that you would object to something so straight forward.

The cop comes off of duty, downloads his cam onto a hard drive where it is stored for a week, unless it is flagged due to an issue that occurred on that shift. Otherwise, it gets deleted automatically.

The cops are protected from false accusations of abuse of power, brutality, etc. And citizens are protected from that rare bird, the out of control cop.

End of story.
So what you want is the cops camera to be put at the beginning of the sift and not turned off until the end? All of this has been discussed before. If the camera is allowed to be turned off, when will it be so? Just before he talks to a confidential informant, just before he sits down with a distraught mother who a=has just lost her son to a driveby shooting, or just before the cops beats on a wise ass street punk? witnesses might be reluctant to talk to police if they knew they were being recorded. As I said most of the objections have come from the public and civil liberty advocates and not the cops or their unions.

When does it get deleted again? At the end of a shift, should there be no red flagged events? How about that event that isn't red flagged by shifts end, but come to light as important a few days later? Maybe proof that a person was in the area even though the crime happened blocks down the road and around the corner, 20 minutes later, but of sight of the cop. Ooops.The false allegation are only protected providing the camera catches it in front of the cop. It doesn't have 360 view. IIRC, Ottawa and Winnipeg tried it and dumped it for many of the reasons mentioned here, much as a result of questions raised by lawyers and legal experts, not cops.
 

destillat

Well-known member
Aug 29, 2001
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So what you want is the cops camera to be put at the beginning of the sift and not turned off until the end? All of this has been discussed before. If the camera is allowed to be turned off, when will it be so? Just before he talks to a confidential informant, just before he sits down with a distraught mother who a=has just lost her son to a driveby shooting, or just before the cops beats on a wise ass street punk? witnesses might be reluctant to talk to police if they knew they were being recorded. As I said most of the objections have come from the public and civil liberty advocates and not the cops or their unions.

When does it get deleted again? At the end of a shift, should there be no red flagged events? How about that event that isn't red flagged by shifts end, but come to light as important a few days later? Maybe proof that a person was in the area even though the crime happened blocks down the road and around the corner, 20 minutes later, but of sight of the cop. Ooops.The false allegation are only protected providing the camera catches it in front of the cop. It doesn't have 360 view. IIRC, Ottawa and Winnipeg tried it and dumped it for many of the reasons mentioned here, much as a result of questions raised by lawyers and legal experts, not cops.
In my employ, I have zero expectation of privacy... email, surfing, walking down the hall...
Beat cops do not interview 'confidential informants'...
If you are on the beat, your camera runs... just like the dash cam in the cruiser... option to turn it off? hell no... remember the jack ass 'officer' that tried to convince a judge recently that they turned the dash cam off to 'conserve power'???
like many other professions... why shouldn't the cops be recorded for their entire shift??? since they are public servants AND have MUCH MORE power and authority than the layman, I see no reason why any legitimate, honest cop would have a problem being recorded during their working hours (again, as mentioned before... as MANY other profession already undergo).
 

gcostanza

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afterhours

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.. remember the jack ass 'officer' that tried to convince a judge recently that they turned the dash cam off to 'conserve power'???
do you happen to have a link?
 

destillat

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do you happen to have a link?
neither of these explicitly state the camera was turned off 'to conserve power'... although i explicitly recall reading that detail in the past... but they both show that the judge chastised the officer for turning the camera off...

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2013/03/26/toronto_police_chief_bill_blair_blasts_officers_for_unacceptable_behaviour.html

http://www.torontosun.com/2013/06/05/toronto-police-officer-to-be-charged-with-beating-raymond-costain
 
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