Cyclist wants "Justice"

[SchlongConery]

So I just read about an 18 year old woman who admitted she was crossing on a "Flashing Red Hand" at Bathurst and Queen. She thought she "had time" to make it but an 18 wheeler turning in front of her and barely clipped her. Compound fracture to her leg. OUCH!!!

"The little red hand was flashing, but Lara Bastien thought she still had enough time to pedal across the busy downtown intersection.

At the same time, a tractor trailer started to turn left and its 18 wheels met Bastien’s two in the middle of the street with gory results.

She heard a crunch, felt a warm pain, and didn’t dare look.

“I just missed getting hit by the truck’s grill, but instead my leg and bike got caught on the far side,” she said."

Here is the story. http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/201...tnesses_after_crash_with_transport_truck.html


"Bastien says she’s normally a pretty private person, but thought her story needed to be shared.

“If someone’s driving an 18-wheeler, they should use lots of caution,” she said.

She hasn’t had any witnesses come forward yet, but hopes one will soon.

“I’m just interested in getting justice for myself — I was this close to losing my life.”



I feel bad for the young girl but really, you'd think she learned the lesson that if you are riding a BICYCLE you should use lots of caution. The truck ALWAYS wins.

 

[Celticman]

I ride a bicycle and a motorbike. A sense of self preservation tells me that a flashing red light means stop, not "I might make it".

 

[james t kirk]

Yes, common sense dictates for one to yield to the 100,000 pound truck in the case where the truck driver decides to turn.

Being in the right doesn't really mean much if you're dead, or in her case, severely injured.

I'm not 100% certain exactly what the red flashing hand means - whether it means, "don't cross if you haven't already started to", or if it means, "hurry the fuck up"

Never the less, she was riding a bike, so if she had the green - she had the right of way and the trucker is in the wrong. But still, she should not have played chicken with a transport truck.

 

[SchlongConery]

Good points all around.

Saying that she was proceeding on the basis of a "Flashing Red Hand" suggests that she, like many cyclists in this city, illegally ride on the sidewalks and use the pedestrian crossing of the intersection as their roadway.

If there is such a flashing red hand, then indeed if she had been using the road as she should have been, then she was proceeding on a green light and had the right of way. The truck making a left turn has the obligation to ensure their way is clear before proceeding. However, if the cyclist appears out of nowhere or a crowd of pedestrians and zooms into the path of the truck (as her account of "almost" missing the grill and just getting clipped by the corner of his bumper) then she is lust like the twenty other cyclists I see in the city weaving in and around the streets, sidewalks, pedestrians and vehicles with no regard to either the rules of the road, the law nor of any realistic sense of self preservation.

Still sad she is injured. More sad is that she is in for much more hurt in her life with that attitude.

 

[Aardvark154]

It would have behooved her to have remembered that traffic safety "saw": "Don't be right, dead right."


Also it reads like she isn't so much interested in "justice" as in a sense of entitlement as a bicyclist.

 

[fuji]

who admitted she was crossing on a "Flashing Red Hand" at Bathurst and Queen.

Shes' a cyclist, so the flashing red hand doesn't apply to her, that's for pedestrians on the sidewalk--bikes aren't legally allowed on the sidewalk in Toronto.

She was in the legal right of way if the light was green or yellow when she entered the intersection, like any other vehicle. Just saying.

My guess is that she was following the recommendation of righting along the right edge of the lane so as not to piss off cars, and wound up seriously injured. If you want to ride a bike safely in the city you have to be an asshole, get out and take control of the lane, so that people can see you and--as in this case--drivers entering the road have a better angle to see you as they enter the roadway from a driveway or cross street. Zooming along the right edge of the road drivers entering can't see you until the last minute, it's just fucking dangerous to be there, but it is where drivers behind you expect you to be.

Sure the driver is in the wrong for not checking if a bike was coming along the right edge of the lane. The driver will now get a ticket, the cyclist may lose a leg--or worse. Better to be an asshole, take the lane, and live.

 

[WinterHawk]

A flashing Red Light means do not cross, if your already on them hurry the dam up. I see people all the time starting to cross when it's flashing Red. Sometimes not getting to the other side until the light is Red and traffic is crossing the intersection.

Starting to cross the intersection as the red light is flashing, be prepared to get hit, especially if your riding your dam bike instead of walking it like your supposed to. To many people don't use caution, and half the drivers in this city must have bought their license.

 

[Frosty]

It's that time of the year when we bitch about cyclists.

 

[oldjones]

Yes, common sense dictates for one to yield to the 100,000 pound truck in the case where the truck driver decides to turn.

Being in the right doesn't really mean much if you're dead, or in her case, severely injured.

I'm not 100% certain exactly what the red flashing hand means - whether it means, "don't cross if you haven't already started to", or if it means, "hurry the fuck up"

Never the less, she was riding a bike, so if she had the green - she had the right of way and the trucker is in the wrong. But still, she should not have played chicken with a transport truck.

The flashing hand is just incidental and irrelevant. According to the policeman's account in the news item, she was in the wrong, because she was cycling in a pedestrian crosswalk. Drivers are required to give way to pedestrians legally crossing at designated places. They can't be expected to do more than their best to try not to hit people doing unexpected things in unexpected places. A bike moving at speed where only people walking should be sure qualifies as that. Especially hard for a driver way up on the far side of a high tractor to see her once he's started his legal—and what appeared to be safe—right turn. There's only one legal and safe way for a cyclist to use crosswalks: dismounted.

The story doesn't say, and she's clearly in a state, but it would be different if she'd been in the curb lane and was merely next to the crosswalk. She and the tractor driver then are both vehicles legally using the intersection on the same green light. But he failed to make sure he was clear on his right side and able to make his turn safely. If she was riding there and he passed her to get to his turning position, he's clearly in the wrong for not waiting until she cleared since she can't see his signals from there. If she thought she could slide up alongside from behind as he paused before turning then she is wrong for passing on the right and ignoring his signals. But either way, it is always the responsibility of the turning diver to ensure they can safely complete their turn, and either way he has a cyclist in an ordinary cycling position he must allow for, and should have been watching for in the city.

Of course 100,000lb trucks and 30lb bikes are mismatched, so are gradeschool girls and dirty old men. It's why we have laws. When we're ready to do without one or the other we'll make some new ones.

 

[HEYHEY]

If she really wants justice then she should be the one who gets charged. What she did was illegal, as well as stupid.
But hey what do you expect from the average person ?
BTW , you'd think someone would read those BRIGHT YELLOW signs on every tractor trailer

According to the policeman's account in the news item, she was in the wrong, because she was cycling in a pedestrian crosswalk. Drivers are required to give way to pedestrians legally crossing at designated places. They can't be expected to do more than their best to try not to hit people doing unexpected things in unexpected places. A bike moving at speed where only people walking should be sure qualifies as that. Especially hard for a driver way up on the far side of a high tractor to see her once he's started his legal—and what appeared to be safe—right turn.

There's only one legal and safe way for a cyclist to use crosswalks: dismounted.

exactly!

 

[basketcase]

I'm 98% sure that the intersection has a countdown timer, not a flashing red hand.

 

[basketcase]

Shes' a cyclist, so the flashing red hand doesn't apply to her, that's for pedestrians on the sidewalk--bikes aren't legally allowed on the sidewalk in Toronto.
...
My guess is that she was following the recommendation of righting along the right edge of the lane so as not to piss off cars, and wound up seriously injured.
...

The title of the article says she was riding her bike in the crosswalk, not the road.

 

[good to go]

She is an idiot, she should have been walking not riding across the street. She is lucky to be alive yes but she should follow the law first.

 

[Questor]

The little red hand was flashing, but Lara Bastien thought she still had enough time to hop on her bike and pedal across the pedestrian crosswalk at the busy downtown intersection.
At the same time, a tractor trailer started to turn right and its 18 wheels met Bastien’s two with gory results.
She heard a crunch, felt a warm pain, and didn’t dare look.
“I just missed getting hit by the truck’s grill, but instead my leg and bike got caught on the far side,” she said.

Its difficult to tell exactly what happened from the information in the article. She "thought she had enough time to hop on her bike and pedal across the pedestrian crosswalk" suggests she was dismounted on the sidewalk but then decided to ride across the street in the crosswalk. She seems to be confused about the rules of the road, since she is looking at the pedestrian crossing sign and riding in the pedestrian crosswalk, yet as a moving vehicle, she should be watching the traffic signal and she should be outside of the crosswalk. It does not state in the article what she considers justice to be in this case, or what she hopes a witness will establish. From the facts available, she appears to be in the wrong.

 

[Moraff]

The flashing hand is just incidental and irrelevant. According to the policeman's account in the news item, she was in the wrong, because she was cycling in a pedestrian crosswalk. Drivers are required to give way to pedestrians legally crossing at designated places. They can't be expected to do more than their best to try not to hit people doing unexpected things in unexpected places. A bike moving at speed where only people walking should be sure qualifies as that. Especially hard for a driver way up on the far side of a high tractor to see her once he's started his legal—and what appeared to be safe—right turn. There's only one legal and safe way for a cyclist to use crosswalks: dismounted.

The story doesn't say, and she's clearly in a state, but it would be different if she'd been in the curb lane and was merely next to the crosswalk. She and the tractor driver then are both vehicles legally using the intersection on the same green light. But he failed to make sure he was clear on his right side and able to make his turn safely. If she was riding there and he passed her to get to his turning position, he's clearly in the wrong for not waiting until she cleared since she can't see his signals from there. If she thought she could slide up alongside from behind as he paused before turning then she is wrong for passing on the right and ignoring his signals. But either way, it is always the responsibility of the turning diver to ensure they can safely complete their turn, and either way he has a cyclist in an ordinary cycling position he must allow for, and should have been watching for in the city.

Of course 100,000lb trucks and 30lb bikes are mismatched, so are gradeschool girls and dirty old men. It's why we have laws. When we're ready to do without one or the other we'll make some new ones.

Just pointing out that the truck was making a left turn, not a right and I rather suspect she popped up right in front of the truck so the driver may not have even had a good chance of seeing her coming.

Edit: I see the article has been updated today to say the truck was making a right not a left. Apologies, I was just going by the original article posted.

 

[GameBoy27]

I'm not 100% certain exactly what the red flashing hand means - whether it means, "don't cross if you haven't already started to", or if it means, "hurry the fuck up".

It means do not cross!

She didn’t immediately speak with an investigating officer but police did in fact interview witnesses from the crash. An officer eventually called to fill in Bastien, adding that the driver won’t face charges.

“They said the case was closed because I shouldn’t have been biking in the pedestrian crosswalk,” Bastien said.

In other words, she was in the wrong and almost got herself killer.

 

[Celticman]

I find it hard to slam the lady. she was in the wrong, but her injury is so horrific. I am thinking about getting a dashboard camera to protect myself in case of an accident and a potential false accusation that it was my fault. It could negate the he said, she said. Anyone have one or know where to buy one?

 

[larry]

she gives cyclists a bad name.

 

[Imperius]

I find it hard to slam the lady. she was in the wrong, but her injury is so horrific. I am thinking about getting a dashboard camera to protect myself in case of an accident and a potential false accusation that it was my fault. It could negate the he said, she said. Anyone have one or know where to buy one?

eBay - For example, http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130455460442

 

[simon482]

if ever you are at a flashing red light and the thought in your head is "i hope/think i can make it" hit the brakes and wait the 2 minutes for the light to favour you again. instead of losing 2 minutes of her precious day she broke something and is gonna go sue happy and try to cash in even though she was at fault. most likely she will win since the person that hit her was a big mean truck driver.